New Seabus: Burrard Pacific Breeze

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by Jared

Maybe they could try one of those floating tunnels, but I can't see that happening for a long time - they're rather unproven, and obviously very expensive.

The first thing that came to my mind was the BART transbay tube in SF with a maximum depth of 41 metres under the bay that was opened in 1974. It was considered quite an engineering feet back in the day when they built the steel tubular sections on land and floated 'em out and sunk 'em.



The maximum depth of Burrard Inlet between Canada Place and Lonsdale is only 25 - 50 metres based upon these map profiles:



And yeah, a direct connection to high-density Lonsdale would make logistical sense as opposed to running same over the LGB but that's still a loooooong ways out.

[eduardo88]

Originally Posted by Nutterbug

Here's what my idea of a rerouted Expo Line looks like, Main Street Station westward:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...,0.142651&z=13

I like it, though the only problem is it wouldnt serve the main CBD at Burrard Station, making it more of a burden for commuters....The expo line could be branched tho with a terminus at Waterfront and one in West Van

[Nutterbug]

Originally Posted by eduardo88

I like it, though the only problem is it wouldnt serve the main CBD at Burrard Station, making it more of a burden for commuters....The expo line could be branched tho with a terminus at Waterfront and one in West Van

Okay then, I just moved Thurlow Station back to Burrard, and added another station at Jervis.

Surely, the suits with the briefcases can manage to walk an extra couple of blocks. Anyways, I'm trying to strike a compromise between serving the business suits and the Robson St. crowd and the rest of the downtown peninsula, while accomodating a southward expansion of the CBD. If the combined Expo and the Millenium Lines are too much for Robson and West Van, then I suppose one of them can bend back towards Waterfront.

Heck, maybe we can even run two parallel lines along Dunsmuir and Robson between the stadiums and Burrard, while keeping the old Skytrain line intact. There's enough traffic to justify both lines, right?

[eduardo88]

Originally Posted by Nutterbug

Okay then, I just moved Thurlow Station back to Burrard, and added another station at Jervis.

Surely, the suits with the briefcases can manage to walk an extra couple of blocks. Anyways, I'm trying to strike a compromise between serving the business suits and the Robson St. crowd and the rest of the downtown peninsula, while accomodating a southward expansion of the CBD. If the combined Expo and the Millenium Lines are too much for Robson and West Van, then I suppose one of them can bend back towards Waterfront.

Heck, maybe we can even run two parallel lines along Dunsmuir and Robson between the stadiums and Burrard, while keeping the old Skytrain line intact. There's enough traffic to justify both lines, right?

Personally what i would like to see happen would be the Millennium Line solely be an east-west line, from UBC to Douglas College via Lougheed. The Expo Line should be branched off to have to termini, one at 168th Street in Surrey, and the other at Lougheed (using the third platform). On the northern end it could also be split into two at the ends with one terminated at Waterfront and another going to West Van. As Below (obviously very crude 2 minute drawing, but you get the point)

[fever]

West Van would be a waste. It wouldn't shape growth and there's little existing demand. Extensions and new lines in the valley and city make far more sense than lines in executive suburbs. Same thing goes for the Arbutus line.

[Nutterbug]

Originally Posted by eduardo88

Personally what i would like to see happen would be the Millennium Line solely be an east-west line, from UBC to Douglas College via Lougheed. The Expo Line should be branched off to have to termini, one at 168th Street in Surrey, and the other at Lougheed (using the third platform). On the northern end it could also be split into two at the ends with one terminated at Waterfront and another going to West Van. As Below (obviously very crude 2 minute drawing, but you get the point)

What's wrong with the looparound Millenium Line? Traffic's going to be much heavier along Broadway in Vancouver than in the Tri-Cities, so you might as well have the loop route to supplement the load. Besides, the Sapperton and Braid passengers might want a one seat ride going towards Broadway.

Originally Posted by fever

West Van would be a waste. It wouldn't shape growth and there's little existing demand. Extensions and new lines in the valley and city make far more sense than lines in executive suburbs. Same thing goes for the Arbutus line.

I'm sure WV has its share of kids and seniors who can't drive, not to mention those who are frustrated with driving across the Lions Gate Bridge. And if not for them, then what about the Horseshoe Bay ferry passengers and possibly future Sea-to-Sky bus transfers?

[Smooth]

^Kids and seniors hardly need to go into town. I don't think you can built a mass transit line which caters to those demographics.

If you haven't already noticed, the people who live on the North Shore on this forum are the ones who are saying that rapid transit isn't needed.

I'll let you in on a little secret. The commute over the Lion's Gate bridge isn't bad at all and even if it's a slow go the scenery is so spectacular that no-one minds. I spent the last couple of years commuting from Lynn Valley into downtown across the Lion's Gate bridge and and I could usually do it in 20 minutes. In that time I never grew tired of the views along the way.

[fever]

Originally Posted by Smooth

I'll let you in on a little secret. The commute over the Lion's Gate bridge isn't bad at all and even if it's a slow go the scenery is so spectacular that no-one minds. I spent the last couple of years commuting from Lynn Valley into downtown across the Lion's Gate bridge and and I could usually do it in 20 minutes. In that time I never grew tired of the views along the way.

When I was commuting over the lions gate in the morning, it was rare to even have to slow down. It depends on the exact time in the morning... except when there are accidents, it might take as much as 3 or 4 minutes. The bridge can get congested in the afternoon, especially on weekends, when everyone heads over town to go to the beach and people are returning from Whistler and the island.

[Nutterbug]

Originally Posted by Smooth

^Kids and seniors hardly need to go into town. I don't think you can built a mass transit line which caters to those demographics.

If you haven't already noticed, the people who live on the North Shore on this forum are the ones who are saying that rapid transit isn't needed.

Would they be the ones who don't want people moving near them?

Considering the people served would include Robson Street visitors, West Enders, Stanley Park visitors, North Vanners, West Vanners, ferry passengers (Vancouver Island, Sunshine Coast and Bowen Island) and Sea-to-Sky residents and travellers, I think you'll have more than enough traffic to justify this route.

[Smooth]

Originally Posted by fever

When I was commuting over the lions gate in the morning, it was rare to even have to slow down. It depends on the exact time in the morning... except when there are accidents, it might take as much as 3 or 4 minutes. The bridge can get congested in the afternoon, especially on weekends, when everyone heads over town to go to the beach and people are returning from Whistler and the island.

I've always found the traffic moves the fastest when it's rush hour. It's partly because you don't get the slow leisure drivers but I also think having an extra lane on Georgia going into town makes a huge difference.

A few years ago West Pender was closed because of that construction excavation cave-in. As a result that extra lane on Georgia was closed. The traffic then became miserable and backed up well into Stanley Park.

[Nutterbug]

What's more, with a railroad and a dock within close proximity, Ambleside has the potential to be a multimodal transit hub, with trains going to Whistler and passenger ferries going to the Island among other places. A Skytrain connection would be icing on the cake, though it may be a nightmare to some local NIMBYs.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by Nutterbug

What's more, with a railroad and a dock within close proximity, Ambleside has the potential to be a multimodal transit hub, with trains going to Whistler and passenger ferries going to the Island among other places. A Skytrain connection would be icing on the cake, though it may be a nightmare to some local NIMBYs.

No one wants Ambleside to be a multimodal transit hub. Why not put a big industrial shipping dock on Kits beach too?

[Nutterbug]

Originally Posted by Pinion

No one wants Ambleside to be a multimodal transit hub. Why not put a big industrial shipping dock on Kits beach too?

"We are GHG polluting gas hogs, and we're proud of it, dammit!"

How could anyone complain about having convenient modes of transport available near them anyways?

[eduardo88]

Originally Posted by Nutterbug

"We are GHG polluting gas hogs, and we're proud of it, dammit!"

How could anyone complain about having convenient modes of transport available near them anyways?

Because some people are idiots, for example people who love highways instead of mass transit.

[Rusty Gull]

Originally Posted by Smooth

If you haven't already noticed, the people who live on the North Shore on this forum are the ones who are saying that rapid transit isn't needed.

I have to disagree. I know a lot of folks on the North Shore would happily trade in their single-occupancy vehicle commute for comfortable rail transit to downtown.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gull

I have to disagree. I know a lot of folks on the North Shore would happily trade in their single-occupancy vehicle commute for comfortable rail transit to downtown.

Yeah I'm only saying it's not wanted in West Van, where absolutely nothing is wanted. I'd love a skytrain bridge where the seabus is, east to second narrows, then back south. That would get tons of ridership and would go through mostly industrial/commercial areas where NIMBYs wouldn't be a problem (besides the reserves...).

Just to Lower Lonsdale would be a dream. My commute would be ten minutes at most.

[Smooth]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gull

I have to disagree. I know a lot of folks on the North Shore would happily trade in their single-occupancy vehicle commute for comfortable rail transit to downtown.

I didn't say it wasn't wanted... just that it wasn't needed.

I think if people on the North Shore were given the choice between the status-quo or increasing density to justify mass transit we all know what the vast majority would choose.

I'm not saying I'm anti-transit, I'm just saying that the mentality of people on the North Shore is quite anti-density. More so then almost everywhere else in the Lower Mainland.

I personally would love to see more transit friendly high density development on the North Shore but I'm quite sure I'm in the minority.

[G-Man]

Are there any pics of the new seabus or will it look the same as the other two?

[Nutterbug]

Originally Posted by Smooth

I didn't say it wasn't wanted... just that it wasn't needed.

I think if people on the North Shore were given the choice between the status-quo or increasing density to justify mass transit we all know what the vast majority would choose.

I'm not saying I'm anti-transit, I'm just saying that the mentality of people on the North Shore is quite anti-density. More so then almost everywhere else in the Lower Mainland.

I personally would love to see more transit friendly high density development on the North Shore but I'm quite sure I'm in the minority.

I guess we'll just have to tighten the noose around the choke points that are the bridges by not expanding them, and soon, we'll have them gasping for transit.

Aren't rich people supposed to be free market capitalists? What gives them the right to block developers from building 50-storey highrises on their purchased land?

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by G-Man

Are there any pics of the new seabus or will it look the same as the other two?

the pic i saw on tv - it looked the same