HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Downtown & City of Ottawa


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #2061  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 1:23 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 15,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighwayStar View Post
Only thing I took away from it is if the Arena falls through, the NCC process will have to start all over again.

Logic being the Arena was central to the accepted proposal, and if it goes away, a full restart will be required.
Well, hopefully they will have something by the time of the 100th anniversary of the expropriation in 2062.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2062  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 2:18 PM
McC's Avatar
McC McC is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,057
The NCC isn't ringing any alarm bells publicly, at least:

Quote:
@NCC_CCN
1h1 hour ago

#LeBreton update: RendezVous Group has begun environmental assessment & has opened its discussions with @Ottawacity. Still aiming to have a Master Development Agreement in place by 2019.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2063  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 3:17 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 15,828
The NCC should have required detailed financial plans from all bidders in the first place. If the plan is financially viable then they would just be able to ignore Melnyk's bluster. If the plan is not financially viable then they would have known that years ago and not wasted all this time.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2064  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 3:23 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,854
I hope all the speculation is wrong, and that the current concept goes ahead. I hate the thought of another 10 or 20 year delay or do something that is not inspiring.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2065  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 4:16 PM
1overcosc's Avatar
1overcosc 1overcosc is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Kingston, Ontario
Posts: 11,475
Quote:
Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
The NCC should have required detailed financial plans from all bidders in the first place. If the plan is financially viable then they would just be able to ignore Melnyk's bluster. If the plan is not financially viable then they would have known that years ago and not wasted all this time.
I thought fiscal analysis was part of the process of choosing the bid?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2066  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 4:36 PM
McC's Avatar
McC McC is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,057
Quote:
Originally Posted by McC View Post
The NCC isn't ringing any alarm bells publicly, at least:
Whereas the Mayor is calling out Melnyk and co to clarify their position:
Quote:
@JonathanWilling
25m
Mayor @JimWatsonOttawa says city wrote to RendezVous this week about talking. Wants to make sure the group is still serious, especially in light of Melnyk’s comments re. condo market.

@JonathanWilling
22m22 minutes ago
“Are you dead serious you want to continue on with this project?” Watson says he’ll ask Melnyk.
1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes

@JonathanWilling
20m20 minutes ago
Watson says city doesn’t want to waste its time on LeBreton if RendezVous isn’t serious about carrying through with the massive redevelopment.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2067  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 4:38 PM
phil235's Avatar
phil235 phil235 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 3,749
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighwayStar View Post
Only thing I took away from it is if the Arena falls through, the NCC process will have to start all over again.

Logic being the Arena was central to the accepted proposal, and if it goes away, a full restart will be required.
That doesn't make a lot of sense. There shouldn't be anything preventing them from moving to the second bidder if they can't agree with Melnyk.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2068  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 5:23 PM
roger1818's Avatar
roger1818 roger1818 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Stittsville, ON
Posts: 6,510
Quote:
Originally Posted by McC View Post
Whereas the Mayor is calling out Melnyk and co to clarify their position:
But Watson is up for re-election and the NCC isn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
That doesn't make a lot of sense. There shouldn't be anything preventing them from moving to the second bidder if they can't agree with Melnyk.
Except, if I remember correctly, the second bidder also has an arena for the Sens in their plans (though Melnyk said they wouldn't use it).
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2069  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 5:45 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 15,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
That doesn't make a lot of sense. There shouldn't be anything preventing them from moving to the second bidder if they can't agree with Melnyk.
The second bidder had even more questionable finances than the winning bidder. They were promising to build a tenant-less arena, a half dozen museums and a school with almost no sources of revenue. The RVL proposal seems like it might be feasible if there was a really hot condo market (which there isn't).

The whole concept requires there to be hundreds of millions in up-front profit from a condo or mixed use development that can be ploughed into building amenities for the site. That doesn't seem to align well with the Ottawa real estate market.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2070  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 8:56 PM
kevinbottawa kevinbottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,229
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighwayStar View Post
Only thing I took away from it is if the Arena falls through, the NCC process will have to start all over again.
If things fall through with Rendezvous Lebreton wouldn't the other proponent get a chance to negotiate with the NCC.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2071  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2018, 9:48 PM
HighwayStar's Avatar
HighwayStar HighwayStar is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: PHX (by way of YOW)
Posts: 1,191
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinbottawa View Post
If things fall through with Rendezvous Lebreton wouldn't the other proponent get a chance to negotiate with the NCC.
As mentioned above, the other proponent also includes an arena in their proposal.

Anyway, in the TV report, the "restart" comment came from Mr. Watson fwiw..
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2072  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 2:01 AM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
Planet Ottawa and beyond
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 12,300
Mayor to confront Eugene Melnyk over LeBreton comments
'If he's constantly hedging his bets, he better tell us,' Jim Watson tells reporters

CBC News
Posted: Apr 19, 2018 1:15 PM ET | Last Updated: 8 hours ago


Ottawa Mayor Jim Watson says he plans to confront Eugene Melnyk to find out whether the Ottawa Senators owner is serious about redeveloping LeBreton Flats.

"If he's constantly hedging his bets, he better tell us," Watson told reporters following a National Capital Commission (NCC) board meeting Thursday.

Melnyk's RendezVous LeBreton Group emerged last year as the winning bidder to redevelop the vacant land west of Ottawa's downtown, and is currently in talks with the NCC. The group's plans include building a new NHL arena and moving the Senators from their current home in Kanata.

The mayor's comments come a week after Melnyk told Senators season ticket holders during a town hall meeting that the LeBreton Flats project is more complicated than he originally thought, and fraught with risk.

'It's a very difficult — much more than I thought — very difficult process, and it's not the NCC that is holding it up. They've actually been very very good throughout this whole process. The problems we are finding, they are much more complicated than I could even start to describe to you. It's a huge project with tremendous risk," Melnyk said at the April 11 town hall.

"I'm a risk-taker. This one is really rolling the dice, and if we're wrong, we're really badly wrong. And my concerns are, are we moving from Kanata, where we've now stabilized — we're OK," Melnyk said.

"And why are we moving? Are we moving to be closer to the very people that cannot get tickets, or won't buy tickets?" he asked.

Melnyk questioned why the federal and municipal governments won't buy tickets for their employees, and said he'd "love to see that change."

One fan questioned whether Melnyk has the financial resources to re-sign Senators captain Erik Karlsson and make the move to LeBreton. Melnyk responded that he has more than enough money, but said he needs to be fiscally responsible as well.

Another hot topic at the town halls was Melnyk's attack on Ottawa fans during the NHL 100 Classic outdoor game festivities in December. At that time, he said he'd consider moving the franchise unless attendance at Canadian Tire Centre improved.

"If it doesn't look good here, it could look very, very nice somewhere else, but I'm not suggesting that right now. All I'm saying is that I would never sell the team," Melnyk said in December. "At one point one of the two have to break. You can't keep spending at the top end and getting the lowest revenues.

"Here we're fighting every day to sell a ticket, honest to God. When you get to the third round of the playoffs and you're begging people to buy a ticket, something's wrong with that picture, so we're just hoping that changes."

Melnyk went on to add the redevelopment of LeBreton Flats in downtown Ottawa is not a given, saying he's not convinced a downtown arena is a necessity for this franchise.

"I'm all in, but it wouldn't be a disaster for us at all if LeBreton didn't happen," Melnyk said in December. "We need something to happen at one point. Something's got to break somewhere and I mean a positive break. We're just basically sitting it out, working through with the [National Capital Commission], and they've been co-operative and reasonable and we're just going to try to continue to get that completed. I don't trust anything happening our way necessarily."

As far as NCC chief executive Mark Kristmanson is concerned, the LeBreton talks are going generally as planned.

Kristmanson said environmental studies are moving again, and that he had a productive lunch with Melnyk and Trinity boss John Ruddy three weeks ago.

Asked if comments like Melynk's undermine public confidence in the process, Kristmanson wouldn't comment on Melynk's statements, but said that in these sorts of huge projects, there will always be a "swirl of commentary."

"And we'll have our ups and downs on this process, but so far, so good. I'm not dismayed."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...lats-1.4626636
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2073  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 2:28 AM
Harley613's Avatar
Harley613 Harley613 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Aylmer, QC
Posts: 6,661
We have a guy who's only concern is the bottom line of his hockey team and who is now controlling (or holding hostage) the biggest piece of city building in Ottawa history. The future of a G7 capital is tied to a piddly B market hockey team. This whole situation has looked like a disaster from the beginning and I think it's about to explode.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2074  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 1:45 PM
ars ars is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harley613 View Post
We have a guy who's only concern is the bottom line of his hockey team and who is now controlling (or holding hostage) the biggest piece of city building in Ottawa history. The future of a G7 capital is tied to a piddly B market hockey team. This whole situation has looked like a disaster from the beginning and I think it's about to explode.
Not sure I agree with that(if you're talking about the Lebreton redevelopment bids). The Rendezvous Lebreton was and still is a strong bid, and it looked like all parties were and are on board. The only weak link(and potential disaster in the making) was Melnyk, straight from the start.

That said, I'm not sure EM will survive the wrath of Gary Bettman and the BoG if he actually spurns the Lebreton arena. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity for both the Sens and the NHL.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2075  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 3:05 PM
1overcosc's Avatar
1overcosc 1overcosc is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Kingston, Ontario
Posts: 11,475
If its needed to make the numbers work I'd gladly support the NCC giving RVL the land for free or highly reduced cost.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2076  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 5:14 PM
phil235's Avatar
phil235 phil235 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 3,749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harley613 View Post
The future of a G7 capital is tied to a piddly B market hockey team.
What is a "piddly B market hockey team"?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2077  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 5:42 PM
McC's Avatar
McC McC is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,057
Quote:
Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
What is a "piddly B market hockey team"?
Hopefully not one that trades Karlsson, Hoffman (and ties Bobby Ryan's contract around one of their necks) with the sole objective of cutting payroll. The Senators aren't one now, but one fork on the road they're walking these days would certainly go that way.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2078  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 10:44 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 15,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by ars View Post

That said, I'm not sure EM will survive the wrath of Gary Bettman and the BoG if he actually spurns the Lebreton arena. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity for both the Sens and the NHL.
The NHL has access to the books, so they would know whether the math on the arena works or not.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2079  
Old Posted Apr 20, 2018, 10:47 PM
JHikka's Avatar
JHikka JHikka is offline
ハルウララ
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 12,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
The NHL has access to the books, so they would know whether the math on the arena works or not.
Indeed. I'm guessing if the BoG sees an issue arising they will address it, and they're likely working proactively in the event that current ownership is having issues regarding its new arena. One team's problems affects them all.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2080  
Old Posted Apr 24, 2018, 8:55 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 23,991
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinbottawa View Post
If things fall through with Rendezvous Lebreton wouldn't the other proponent get a chance to negotiate with the NCC.
No. Part of the NCC's January announcement surrounding the agreement in principal with RVL included the outright elimination of DCDLS.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Downtown & City of Ottawa
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 9:14 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.