TYSONS (Virginia) | Development Thread

[highlander492]

Came across this Powerpoint from years ago...2 projects that it mentioned I had never heard of but from the renderings looked like substantial proposals near the Spring Hill Metro station. These are the (as listed in the Powerpoint):

- Clemente /Schmitz/NW Mutual project
- Avalon Bay / Marchant / McIlvane project

Does anyone have any insight into what happened to these projects? cough cough TysonsEngineer

Too bad, they seemed like great mixed use projects (both towards the end of the powerpoint).

http://www.cdctysons.com/images/Tysons_Corner.pdf

[TysonsEngineer]

Originally Posted by highlander492

Came across this Powerpoint from years ago...2 projects that it mentioned I had never heard of but from the renderings looked like substantial proposals near the Spring Hill Metro station. These are the (as listed in the Powerpoint):

- Clemente /Schmitz/NW Mutual project
- Avalon Bay / Marchant / McIlvane project

Does anyone have any insight into what happened to these projects? cough cough TysonsEngineer

Too bad, they seemed like great mixed use projects (both towards the end of the powerpoint).

http://www.cdctysons.com/images/Tysons_Corner.pdf

You rang?

I have your answers.

NW Mutual project by Clemente is actually the same property as Greensboro Place and the Dittmarr/Best Western (it was split into two projects when SAIC sold their property to Meridian). Those two projects are still a full go. In fact in the past month Greensboro Place has announced both a grocer is coming (Whole Foods) and an upscale indie movie theater chain. They are planning to begin construction soon on Building 1 now that they have lined up those major tenants. Densities on those are about the same if not more than the original proposal.

AvalonBay is still actively looking at opportunities on their property, though I do not believe they have submitted anything for rezoning yet. There was a bit of a scuffle when the original Tysons Tax passed as AvalonBay's management noted that economically speaking it was putting too much of a burden for it to make sense to build. Since that time there have been about a dozen projects of similar scale break ground so they may be more interested now that the market is bearing feasible comps. There have been rumors about AvalonBay submitting for rezoning, but it's only rumors right now and you can imagine they are pretty tightlipped about things like that, not wanting to show their hand to the County before deciding yay or nay. They may also be actively trying to sell to another group perhaps, which again, would keep them tightlipped.

[highlander492]

Thanks for the reply.

Yea, this was before Tysons peaked my interest so I was unaware of some of these cases. Anyway, I did find this article detailing the original Avalon scuffle from the Washington Post from 2011.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busine...BtM_story.html

It makes you wonder how many landowners out there that haven't submitted anything yet are biding their time and crafting out site plans that have yet to go public.

Anyway, I take issue again with the Clemente / Schmitz renderings.

From what I can make out, the site plan sits between Spring Hill road and Westpark Drive not on the "Boro" and Westpark Plaza side but surrounding the area where the Ascent stands. This rendering shows development on the site of the Schmitz Exxon and on the site of the NADA building as (at the corner of Greensboro/Westpark as well as the McDonalds/Container Store site, nothing that I have seen in the Spring Hill Station site plan or any other approved plan. Am I looking at this wrong?

Thanks!

[TysonsEngineer]

Originally Posted by highlander492

Thanks for the reply.

Yea, this was before Tysons peaked my interest so I was unaware of some of these cases. Anyway, I did find this article detailing the original Avalon scuffle from the Washington Post from 2011.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busine...BtM_story.html

It makes you wonder how many landowners out there that haven't submitted anything yet are biding their time and crafting out site plans that have yet to go public.

Anyway, I take issue again with the Clemente / Schmitz renderings.

From what I can make out, the site plan sits between Spring Hill road and Westpark Drive not on the "Boro" and Westpark Plaza side but surrounding the area where the Ascent stands. This rendering shows development on the site of the Schmitz Exxon and on the site of the NADA building as (at the corner of Greensboro/Westpark as well as the McDonalds/Container Store site, nothing that I have seen in the Spring Hill Station site plan or any other approved plan. Am I looking at this wrong?

Thanks!

You are completely right! I confused it with the original SAIC submission which had an odd name also. This is a different project, and I had never heard of it. I will have to dig into this one, maybe it's something on the horizon.

[highlander492]

Cool! If you find anything, let us know!

Thanks again.

[highlander492]

http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...ice-tower.html


elsewhere in Fairfax:
looks like massive new development in Franconia @ Kingstowne Town Center:

http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...-addition.html

[202_Cyclist]

Up next for Tysons? Another year of staggering growth

By Jonathan O'Connell
November 24, 2015
Washington Post

"For those who doubted that building four Metro stations in Tysons would lead to a massive construction boom, a ride on the Silver Line — passing through a gauntlet of construction cranes — quickly settles the matter.

As the Silver Line opened, people wondered: ‘Who would want to live in a high-rise in Tysons?’ Even with the Metro running there isn’t a lot to do other than go to the mall and completing most basic errands — picking up groceries, going to the pharmacy — usually requires bearing notoriously bad traffic.

And yet last year three high-rise apartment towers got under way just as another set was being completed and a third was getting ready to begin. About 1,000 people already live in the high-rise buildings and shortly thousands more will be..."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...5679&tid=ss_tw

[202_Cyclist]

I biked to out to Reston yesterday and notice that Boston Properties has begun construction on a development that will include two residential towers (21 and 19 floors) and two six-story residential buildings. The site was previously a surface parking lot directly next to the Reston Town Center.

Last residential project in Reston Town Center core to start ‘immediately’
http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...wn-center.html

[202_Cyclist]

Here are two photos I took with my phone yesterday of the development of the parking lots at the Reston Town Center that I mentioned in the post above. Boston Properties owns this site and plans to build at least 500 apartments in two 19-story buildings.

[202_Cyclist]

Admittedly, this is Reston, not Tysons but it is close enough.

Design for Reston’s tallest building tweaked in a major way


By Michael Neibauer
Washington Business Journal
Jan. 27, 2016

"The office building planned for Reston Parkway and Bowman Towne Drive, one block north of Reston Town Center, will rise to 23 stories and 330 feet — 125 feet taller than anything around it.

With that in mind, Akridge and RTC Partnership LLC, led by Richard Whealen, have altered the design to create something grand.

Akridge partnered with RTC one year ago to advance the 420,000-square-foot trophy class office tower at 1760 Reston Parkway. Not long after, it retained HOK to do “some refinement and enhancement” to the original design from architect Polleo Group, said David Toney, Akridge’s vice president of development..."

http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...aked-in-a.html

[PremierAtlanta]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

Admittedly, this is Reston, not Tysons but it is close enough.

Design for Reston’s tallest building tweaked in a major way


By Michael Neibauer
Washington Business Journal
Jan. 27, 2016

"The office building planned for Reston Parkway and Bowman Towne Drive, one block north of Reston Town Center, will rise to 23 stories and 330 feet — 125 feet taller than anything around it.

With that in mind, Akridge and RTC Partnership LLC, led by Richard Whealen, have altered the design to create something grand.

Akridge partnered with RTC one year ago to advance the 420,000-square-foot trophy class office tower at 1760 Reston Parkway. Not long after, it retained HOK to do “some refinement and enhancement” to the original design from architect Polleo Group, said David Toney, Akridge’s vice president of development..."

http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...aked-in-a.html

At 330', this tower will make quite the impression. It's in a great spot. It's close enough to the u/c Reston Tower Center Metro Station that I can not see why this building could not lease up nicely. I'm sure it may poach tenants from buildings not so well position to the Metro.

Once this and the two 19 story apartment towers are finished, Reston will have quite the skyline. I enjoy driving past Reston on 267.

[paytonc]

A recent Federal Realty investor presentation gives some additional specifics on what's possible at Pike 7, the strip mall with DSW west of Greensboro Metro: a $750-$900 million, 2 million sq ft project that could start once current leases expire in 2020.

Federal developed Bethesda Row and Pike & Rose in Maryland.

[TysonsEngineer]

Originally Posted by paytonc

A recent Federal Realty investor presentation gives some additional specifics on what's possible at Pike 7, the strip mall with DSW west of Greensboro Metro: a $750-$900 million, 2 million sq ft project that could start once current leases expire in 2020.

Federal developed Bethesda Row and Pike & Rose in Maryland.

That's funny, I did a similar quick study on that same property a while back. Its location is ridiculous for it to remain a strip mall, and they could phase the development with almost no impact by building a split parking garage with their first phase under the abandoned brick building with no disruption to existing tenants. Once that's set they could remove each portion of surface parking one at a time with each new structure, replacing the next phases surface parking as you go.

That property could easily support 4 early phase buildings (keeping the strip mall) and a separate 4 towers if they decided to demolish the strip mall later.

Interestingly, in the potential plans section they note that it is encumbered by leases til 2020, but I think they could develop most of that property in advance of those leases if they needed to given the above. Heck even if they ate into the parking, the entire north side of the parking lot is ALWAYS empty, the side nearest the wall along Route 7. They could lose 20% of the parking there and never have any impacts even during christmas season (it's not really a christmas driven strip mall anyways, it's mostly a daily errands center).

[202_Cyclist]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

Here are two photos I took with my phone yesterday of the development of the parking lots at the Reston Town Center that I mentioned in the post above. Boston Properties owns this site and plans to build at least 500 apartments in two 19-story buildings.

There is now a tower crane that has been installed for this development.

[202_Cyclist]

I took this photo during my bike ride out to Reston yesterday of a transit-oriented development being built by Bozzuto next to the Wiehle Ave metro station. Bozzuto is building 421 apartments.

[202_Cyclist]

Fairfax board approves 25-story Tysons condo tower after working out affordable issue

By Michael Neibauer
Washington Business Journal
Apr.5, 2016

"Tysons will have its condos after all.

The Fairfax County Board of Supervisors on Tuesday approved plans for The Arbor, a 140-unit, 25-story condo tower with more than 6,000 square feet of ground-floor retail at Arbor Row, Cityline Partners' 2.2 million-square-foot redevelopment of the West Park office park. Developer Renaissance Centro is the contract purchaser of the Arbor Row condo pad.

It will be the first condo building constructed since Fairfax County approved the Tysons Plan, a long-term land use guide geared toward transforming Tysons into a pedestrian-friendly, mixed-use mini-city..."

http://www.bizjournals.com/washingto...ndo-tower.html

[paytonc]

Originally Posted by TysonsEngineer

Interestingly, in the potential plans section they note that it is encumbered by leases til 2020, but I think they could develop most of that property in advance of those leases if they needed to given the above.

Federal Realty wouldn't have purchased the center except for its redevelopment potential. I'm sure that they've reviewed the leases, which probably have silly clauses specifying available parking and require co-tenancies, and decided that between those, competing with existing supply coming online before 2020, and their existing redevelopment pipeline (getting Pike & Rose past the halfway point, both from a human-resources and capital-allocation standpoint) it's not going to make sense before 2020.

[TysonsEngineer]

Originally Posted by paytonc

Federal Realty wouldn't have purchased the center except for its redevelopment potential. I'm sure that they've reviewed the leases, which probably have silly clauses specifying available parking and require co-tenancies, and decided that between those, competing with existing supply coming online before 2020, and their existing redevelopment pipeline (getting Pike & Rose past the halfway point, both from a human-resources and capital-allocation standpoint) it's not going to make sense before 2020.

That's fair. That being said though, 2020 will creep up on them pretty quickly, and if they really want to make the most out of this prime property, they should begin the rezoning process asap.

Most rezonings of this size in Tysons took between 2 and 5 years for approval (some of the longer length ones like Georgelas were model projects so that explains some of the longer periods to approval).

Having done a rezoning in the past, there is atleast 6 months of leg work prior to submission, if not a full year to get to the level of rendering/design plans that the FXCO is looking for in Tysons rezoning proposals.

That being the case, they should get the process started now if they have any chance of turning dirt in 2020.

[paytonc]

Don Wood, Federal Realty's CEO, took credit on the company's recent earnings call for not "jumping" into redeveloping Pike 7. (This transcript is unfortunately garbled.)

"We did not jump and say oh god we got to be the first one to market. We sat back, we renewed leases, we kick out so that we were able to get to face if we needed to, but we’ve created, we are disciplined at that particular asset has so north to our benefit that’s only because we really -- we ran it like a true real estate company would and real estate play and not like a drunken sailor with respect to development for Pete’s sake in terms of what it should be. So I want a little, I guess I really want as I can look the credit for the discipline that we showed in not jumping to what the new Tysons is going to be because as you just point out, it takes a long time with a major infrastructure chains like the Silver Line is to figure out what Tysons should be."

[TysonsEngineer]

Originally Posted by paytonc

Don Wood, Federal Realty's CEO, took credit on the company's recent earnings call for not "jumping" into redeveloping Pike 7. (This transcript is unfortunately garbled.)

"We did not jump and say oh god we got to be the first one to market. We sat back, we renewed leases, we kick out so that we were able to get to face if we needed to, but we’ve created, we are disciplined at that particular asset has so north to our benefit that’s only because we really -- we ran it like a true real estate company would and real estate play and not like a drunken sailor with respect to development for Pete’s sake in terms of what it should be. So I want a little, I guess I really want as I can look the credit for the discipline that we showed in not jumping to what the new Tysons is going to be because as you just point out, it takes a long time with a major infrastructure chains like the Silver Line is to figure out what Tysons should be."

Ok, that's a reasonable statement by him, but at the same time, many of those drunken sailors who pushed into the market, with their directly adjacent metro access, have been rewarded not only with majority lease prior to completion, but majority lease at rates that would make 1 floor of a single building more valuable than all of the current lease value that Pike 7 holds onto currently.

There is a benefit of being first to strike the iron when it's hot, all the people looking to move on up to a better newer building will do so early on when those new products start popping up (as is being seen).

Obviously there is the mo money mo problems issue of financing; with big lease rates will come big financing costs as well. But the market is showing that they would have had a pretty easy time selling at a minimum commercial at that location, if not mixed use residential which has also been pretty successful at hitting benchmarks in town (see Ascent).