St Patrick's Island bridge comp: Which one do you like? - Page 7

smitty67 · #**121** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:47 PM**

right. so that why we don't have covered platforms on the LRT? or bus shelters?

I get it now. thanks for clearing that up for me.

oh wait. they're all covered too.

Witty Nickname · #**122** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

CMLC has posted the following Open House info for the designs:

PUBLIC OPEN HOUSE

All members of the public are invited to view all original materials and submissions for the St. Patrick’s Bridge design competition at the SIMMONS Building in East Village, according to the following schedule.

•Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - Noon-5:00 PM
•Friday, October 16, 2009 - Noon- 5:00 PM
•Wednesday, October 21, 2009 - Noon-5:00 PM
•Friday, October 23, 2009 - Noon -5:00 PM

The Simmons Building is located at 610 Fifth Avenue SE, Calgary, Alberta (403.718.0500).
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Why the heck can't they have some open house time during a weekend or evenings? Stupid, stupid, stupid.

I might just have to check it out. Thanks for the info BT!

CorporateWhore · #**123** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:51 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty67

right. so that why we don't have covered platforms on the LRT? or bus shelters?

I get it now. thanks for clearing that up for me.

oh wait. they're all covered too.

Oh wait, you're a pompous twit.

You don't sit around a bridge waiting for half an hour every day, regardless of the weather. If you're opinion was absolute, every bridge in the northern hemisphere would be covered.

Western Spaghetti · #**124** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty67

why would you want to walk around downtown in plus 15's, when you can go outside????????? oh right, snow, rain, cold, etc. imagine the amount of ice that will be on a great deal of those bridges when the freeze thaw hits from the chinooks. no ice on the covered bridges. the saucier and perotte submission knows how to cover a public walking space over a river as well.

I would rather have the bridge open, and have the natural light on it at all times. Having it covered would help with the snow, but it would make it dark and unfriendly.

You Need A Thneed · #**125** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty67

anybody who thinks that the rogers design and the calatrave design are the same has lost the plot.
.

I don't think anyone has said that. All anyone has said is that they are both covered.

Personally, the Rogers design and the S&P design would make me VERY disappointed if they were built. They don't take the surroundings into consideration at all. In a different location, they might look great.

Having the structure ALL overhead like the rogers design blocks out the sky from view, IMO. Calgary is the sunniest city in Canada, let's enjoy the sun!

CorporateWhore · #**126** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 6:56 PM**

I think anyone who has lived in Calgary for a significant amount of time knows that our natural light is one our best attributes....not sure why we would want to cover that up, in a park of all places.

Both Rogers and S+P would make some great +15's though.....can we just move them over a few blocks?

You Need A Thneed · #**127** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CorporateWhore

Both Rogers and S+P would make some great +15's.....can we just move them over a few blocks?

That's my thoughts as well. They would look great as a +15 design. They are TERRIBLE ideas for a bridge over the river in Calgary.

freeweed · #**128** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by smitty67

As far as the structures themselves, I believe the mast/cable/suspension solutions are very troubling. If a mast structure was appropriate for a climate/region such as Calgary’s don’t you think that the master of all mast structures (Calatrava) would have done one himself? Instead he offered a solution that was more sympathetic to seasonal variation, rain, snow, etc. Very few of the designs in this competition actually took these issues into consideration.

Winnipeg has far worse climate than Calgary (in terms of winter/snow/rain) and they have a mast/cable-stayed bridge, and it works just fine.

Covering a bridge is a neat idea here or there, but it's pretty pointless. The sidewalk/road leading up to and exiting the bridge won't be covered, so it's not like you can escape the elements.

Calatrava made a lower bridge due to height restrictions, not the climate - as many others have already pointed out.

Habanero · #**129** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:06 PM**

I'm glad that I had to rush out of the office yesterday and didn't get a chance to vote, because today I've had a chance to look them over more, and the Infinity design is my favorite. I was going to go with the Marc Boutin entry.

Wooster · #**130** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:16 PM**

I don't think there's necessarily a problem with covered bridges. I like how Calatrava's bridge is partially covered, but still feels very open to its surroundings. Its design (and the fact that it is covered) has a lot to do with the structurial rigidity of a helical shape. It needed that strength to cover such a long, flat uninterrupted span. The design suits the site's needs.

In the case of St. Patrick's bridge, a covered bridge may have some merit, but I think people are yearning for something a bit different and open. It doesn't have the same constraints as the Peace bridge.

You Need A Thneed · #**131** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:27 PM**

I think it should be mentioned too, that while the infinity proposal and Glide both "use up" more of the island then some of the others, it's really not a lot of the island at all. There's a lot of space on that island, even those two bridge don't even take up 5% of the space available on the island.

I'll agree with Wooster here, I'm not against covered bridges, just how the covered bridges are done. The covering on the Peace bridge basically doesn't obstruct vision any more then the structure already does. Plus it certainly isn't totally enclosed (the Rogers proposal isn't either).

Surrealplaces · #**132** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:38 PM**

I sent a bunch of e-mails off today (to 12 people) with a link to the thread, and asked them to pick their top three favorites. Should prove to be interesting.

I showed the bridge designs to a few co-workers who have no interest in architecture, and three of them liked the Infinity project, the other liked the Harcowe yolles-Reach. Both of those are decent projects.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Ave

I'm having a hard time deciding what style to hope for. I'm with many of you who like the Hacrow Yolles - 'Reach', and the Arup Glide' Both of those designs are quite different from the norm. 'Glide' is straight forward and elegant.

Now my dilemma. We had a bunch of people over last night for a birthday dinner. People ranging from all ages, etc... I hooked up the laptop to the TV and showed everyone the designs. Virtually everyone liked the tall free cable styled designs. I mentioned that I liked the 'Glide', but everyone thought it was boring, and nobody liked it. I realize that these folks aren't into architecture, so I'm not surprised.

Would it be better to have something we all like, but wouldn't necessarily appeal to the general public? Or something stereotypical, yet appeal more to the masses?

Maybe it's the family and friends I keep. I would be curious to see some sort of 'general public' vote on the styles.

nick.flood · #**133** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:45 PM**

We certainly don't need covered bridges when it's only going to cover you during 5% of your trip. You're uncovered before and after you cross the bridge so unless the bridge is a tube like structure as per Calatrava's where it's just a minor addition to do it, put the efforts into other design aspects of the bridge.

MonctonGoldenFlames · #**134** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

CMLC has posted the following Open House info for the designs:

PUBLIC OPEN HOUSE

All members of the public are invited to view all original materials and submissions for the St. Patrick’s Bridge design competition at the SIMMONS Building in East Village, according to the following schedule.

•Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - Noon-5:00 PM
•Friday, October 16, 2009 - Noon- 5:00 PM
•Wednesday, October 21, 2009 - Noon-5:00 PM
•Friday, October 23, 2009 - Noon -5:00 PM

The Simmons Building is located at 610 Fifth Avenue SE, Calgary, Alberta (403.718.0500).
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Why the heck can't they have some open house time during a weekend or evenings? Stupid, stupid, stupid.

just got off the phone them. they said they are only holding the open houses at these times because they fall within regular business hours of cmlc at the simmonds building. i told her that it seemed unfair to hold them during times when most people are unavailable. she said "i don't know what else to tell you, we are a company just like any other company and that's when we are holding them"

i say we bombard the office with calls asking why they are doing this. i would love to go, but like most people, i can't get out of work for this.

403.718.0300

Bigtime · #**135** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:52 PM**

Well I know a lot of companies that are like other companies that aren't only open until 5pm.

Surely for something this important to the East Village plans and public perception they could have some extended hours?

Fernando · #**136** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:55 PM**

That is ridiculous. Part of being in planning is sometimes working evenings and weekends for public open houses. Municipalities and private consulting firms do this all the time.

If I recall correctly, I attended a riverwalk open house run by CMLC with their consultants Stantec in the evening last year. Weird.

MonctonGoldenFlames · #**137** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Well I know a lot of companies that are like other companies that aren't only open until 5pm.

Surely for something this important to the East Village plans and public perception they could have some extended hours?

she was very curt with me, and i didn't feel like having a conversation trying to explain the common sense behind holding an open house that give all people a chance to attend. i'm sure she's just a secretary and is just repeating what she has been told to say.

if cmlc lack this much common sense, i am starting to doubt whether or not the east village will turn out as good as it should.

Fernando · #**138** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 7:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonctonGoldenFlames

if cmlc lack this much common sense, i am starting to doubt whether or not the east village will turn out as good as it should.

You're right to be upset. But that is a big leap.

MichaelS · #**139** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 8:03 PM**

My favourite 5 are:

ARUP and Kaisan - Love this one.
The Reach - Love it also, but would like to see a bit more detail (similar to ARUP and Kaisan).
Inifinty Engineering
Sturgess
Buckland Taylor.

I don't like the SPFa ones (both of them). They seem far to bulky and heavy to me. Plus, they focus a lot on adding steps/seating either on the island or the bridge itself. That's fine, but keep in mind we are already doing something like that on the south river bank as part of the River Walk project. If we build more of these spaces, they will all appear empty as there aren't enough people to fill them all up. Leave it at just the River Walk, so that the same amount of people will congregate in a more concentrated area, giving a more vibrant feel. If we spread people out too much, it will have an empty feel.

MonctonGoldenFlames · #**140** Posted **Sep 23, 2009, 8:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fernando

You're right to be upset. But that is a big leap.

ya, it's a bit of a leap. but i really meant that if common sense or at least the best interest of the taxpayers they serve, is not a priority to them, then maybe some decisions made in the future will not be the best for us or the east village.