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  #101  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2017, 7:08 PM
528XI 528XI is offline
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Hearing there is some delay in this project and a cancellation is being considered.

I made inquiries when demolition began to linger
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  #102  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2017, 8:52 PM
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The foundation permit is under review. The most recent revisions were submitted last week.
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  #103  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2017, 6:49 PM
pdxtraveler pdxtraveler is offline
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Just saw that permits were issued to demolish the existing building and one to excavate for the new. I had actually wondered if this would make it in this wave.

I do think this building will help with the issues that so many have with Yard. It won't stand out as much anymore. I think that area right around the Bridgehead is going to be kind of interesting!
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  #104  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2017, 7:01 PM
PDX City-State PDX City-State is offline
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Originally Posted by pdxtraveler View Post
Just saw that permits were issued to demolish the existing building and one to excavate for the new. I had actually wondered if this would make it in this wave.

I do think this building will help with the issues that so many have with Yard. It won't stand out as much anymore. I think that area right around the Bridgehead is going to be kind of interesting!
I think you're right about this. The Yard stands out because it's so much bigger than everything around it, but from the ground level on 3rd avenue, it's actually a nice building along the street--and will be even better once they add retail. And speaking of retail at the Yard, the haters of this building need to check out Knot Springs--the spa in the Yard that has incredible views of Portland. The Yard isn't perfect, but there are so many far crappier buildings to bet upset about in Portland right now.
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  #105  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 9:16 AM
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I think you're right about this. The Yard stands out because it's so much bigger than everything around it, but from the ground level on 3rd avenue, it's actually a nice building along the street--and will be even better once they add retail. And speaking of retail at the Yard, the haters of this building need to check out Knot Springs--the spa in the Yard that has incredible views of Portland. The Yard isn't perfect, but there are so many far crappier buildings to bet upset about in Portland right now.
The best retail in the world won't change the Yard's grim looming appearance from the west. Ugly buildings right on the riverfront can never be obscured by good buildings. They will be eyesores for generations to come.
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  #106  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 3:50 PM
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The best retail in the world won't change the Yard's grim looming appearance from the west. Ugly buildings right on the riverfront can never be obscured by good buildings. They will be eyesores for generations to come.
Yes, but as the eastside develops the Yard won't be nearly as prominent. Also, it's not that ugly.
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  #107  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2017, 11:51 PM
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Yes, but as the eastside develops the Yard won't be nearly as prominent. Also, it's not that ugly.
More people see The Yard each day while crossing the Burnside Bridge than from all other angles combined. Nothing is going to block that view other than maybe the big one hitting Portland and bringing this architectural atrocity to the ground in a heap of rubble.

By the way - the city shut down the 11th floor hotel in The Yard, forcing them to turn those apartments back into apartments. And speaking of the apartments... they're terrible.
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  #108  
Old Posted Dec 31, 2017, 8:55 AM
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More people see The Yard each day while crossing the Burnside Bridge than from all other angles combined. Nothing is going to block that view other than maybe the big one hitting Portland and bringing this architectural atrocity to the ground in a heap of rubble.

By the way - the city shut down the 11th floor hotel in The Yard, forcing them to turn those apartments back into apartments. And speaking of the apartments... they're terrible.
Good to hear the city put a stop to the hotel they were running, if they can't rent those apartments for the prices they wanted, then the prices need to come down. This buildings is poorly designed inside and out. Though now that it has been up for a while and they replaces some of the panels with windows, I am less bothered by this building.

With the potential of more big buildings to be built around it, the Yard will always stand out, but it won't be as much of an eye sore with surrounded by other buildings.
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  #109  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 6:29 AM
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Someday, when the building is fully occupied, and the windows are illuminated at night and show the rising/spreading pattern that was intended, the building could look half decent for about three hours each night. Unless the glass is too dark . . .

Did we ever figure out why this dark, glum building ended up looking nothing at all like the reflective, silvery thing shown in the renderings? Was 1) the architect not correctly rendering the designed materials, 2) were the built materials completely different from what the architect's design?

If 1), does the developer have a malpractice case against the architect?
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  #110  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 6:00 PM
soleri soleri is offline
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Originally Posted by johnliu View Post
Someday, when the building is fully occupied, and the windows are illuminated at night and show the rising/spreading pattern that was intended, the building could look half decent for about three hours each night. Unless the glass is too dark . . .

Did we ever figure out why this dark, glum building ended up looking nothing at all like the reflective, silvery thing shown in the renderings? Was 1) the architect not correctly rendering the designed materials, 2) were the built materials completely different from what the architect's design?

If 1), does the developer have a malpractice case against the architect?
I spent a lot of time talking to one of Skylab's architects, and the closest I can get to solving this mystery is that the Hood River developer misjudged the scope and cost of this project, mainly because this was their first high-rise. They ended up using cheaper materials along with fewer windows once the true costs became evident.

This isn't my least favorite new high-rise in Portland. That would be NV in the Pearl which not only looks cheap but is so uninspired that it looks like a '60s building reclad in the '90s.
On the other hand, it's in the Pearl so its mediocrity feels as if it's appropriate to its location.
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  #111  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 6:58 PM
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Originally Posted by johnliu View Post
Someday, when the building is fully occupied, and the windows are illuminated at night and show the rising/spreading pattern that was intended, the building could look half decent for about three hours each night. Unless the glass is too dark . . .

Did we ever figure out why this dark, glum building ended up looking nothing at all like the reflective, silvery thing shown in the renderings? Was 1) the architect not correctly rendering the designed materials, 2) were the built materials completely different from what the architect's design?

If 1), does the developer have a malpractice case against the architect?
I'm thinking they ended up doing very well for themselves in the end...

Sale price for Yard building 'sets new high-water mark' for Portland's east side
Updated Dec 21, 2016; Posted Dec 21, 2016
By Anna Marum amarum@oregonian.com
The Oregonian/OregonLive

http://www.oregonlive.com/business/i...uilding_s.html

(emphasis mine)

Quote:
The Burnside Bridgehead's tallest tower -- and possibly its most controversial -- has sold for $126.68 million.

The sale of the 21-story Yard building marks the city core's largest apartment transaction to date, according to a statement from commercial real estate brokerage Marcus & Millichap.

It also sets a new "high-water mark" for price per unit and price per square foot for Portland's east side, the firm said. The building houses 284 units, averaging 682 square feet.
...(continues)
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  #112  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 8:30 PM
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I'm thinking they ended up doing very well for themselves in the end...
Doesn't that help make the case for developers not giving a damn about quality materials in the future?

This is why it bothers me that there were such meaningless repercussions for the whole debacle. Neither the developer nor Skylab paid any meaningful price for what they did. In fact, the developer made out like a bandit in the end. Didn't other architects talk on the record about how they knew the Skylab renderings were unrealistic? I hope that crap firm gets run through the ringer the next time they propose building in the city. I believe Skylab wasn't up to the challenge this site presented. Their work speaks for itself - all you have to do is compare their fantasy renderings to what was actually built.
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  #113  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 10:04 PM
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That all sounds like a load of baloney. I’m no architect, but does the proper amount of reflective windows really cost all that much more than wall paneling in the grand scheme of an entire buildings construction budget? And couldn’t they have just gone back and added reflective window tinting to mitigate a lot of the complaints?
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  #114  
Old Posted Jan 2, 2018, 10:55 PM
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That all sounds like a load of baloney. I’m no architect, but does the proper amount of reflective windows really cost all that much more than wall paneling in the grand scheme of an entire buildings construction budget? And couldn’t they have just gone back and added reflective window tinting to mitigate a lot of the complaints?
It wasn't just the cost of the windows. Those dummies didn't realize they couldn't hit energy requirements with all of that glass in the design they proposed and marketed... so they had to change it. How could they not have known?

Quote:
"Jeff Kovel, principal at Skylab Architecture, said the firm had to decrease the amount of glazing in order to meet energy requirements."

--The Oregonian
How is that sort of ineptness excusable? I could understand if The Yard was a student proposal... but it was a real world project designed by architects who should have known the requirements for what they were designing. How. Could. They. NOT?

Did Skylab ever address the fact that their fantasyland renderings showed reflective glass buy they actually used brown?

Fantasy:



Reality:

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  #115  
Old Posted Jan 3, 2018, 3:09 AM
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My apologies, I took the bait and contributed to getting this thread off topic. Let's get back to discussing 5 MLK.
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  #116  
Old Posted Jan 3, 2018, 3:09 AM
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Originally Posted by soleri View Post
I spent a lot of time talking to one of Skylab's architects, and the closest I can get to solving this mystery is that the Hood River developer misjudged the scope and cost of this project, mainly because this was their first high-rise. They ended up using cheaper materials along with fewer windows once the true costs became evident.

This isn't my least favorite new high-rise in Portland. That would be NV in the Pearl which not only looks cheap but is so uninspired that it looks like a '60s building reclad in the '90s.
Overall, I more or less share the criticisms of the Yard here, especially with the rendering smacking me in the face again. Gee, how did that tasteful greenery on the balconies get replaced with beige panels? Neither the architect nor the developer had the experience to pull off the proposal, which, given some of its more out-of-the-box attributes (the hexagonal shape, for example, which adds to the building's overwhelming bulk and general lack of grace), needed to be an absolute slam dunk to be successful. It's the sloppy, polar opposite approach to the sort of refined attention to detail and rigorous austerity that a firm like Hacker brings to their projects.

I don't share the optimism of some here about the effect of 5 MLK. Personally, I think we need more fine-grained, smaller-scale architecture in the vicinity --with less space devoted to car storage-- to make the bridgehead into a place people actually want to hang out, especially with all of the car congestion on the streets. I think a more holistic approach to that block would have been to save the old building on the corner and wrap something contemporary around it, similar to the approach Malsin is taking with WPA down the street. 5 MLK has the potential to be another hulking, monolithic highrise, especially when the value engineering sets in.

I do find it interesting that soleri brings up the NV because both it and the Yard are rotated off the grid, which makes them stand out even more. I agree with soleri that the NV is a deeper failure than the Yard, made much worse by the fact that it, unlike the Yard, sits in the middle of an existing grid surrounded by buildings that don't necessarily beg you to look at them. The gimmicky shingles only add to the unsightliness. The design commission, in hindsight, should have held them to a much higher materials standard or pushed back harder on the 45-degree angle. In this case, the 45-degree angle ended up being the equivalent of drawing a big red circle around the zit in the middle of your forehead.
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  #117  
Old Posted Jan 3, 2018, 8:29 AM
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My apologies, I took the bait and contributed to getting this thread off topic. Let's get back to discussing 5 MLK.
I was about to respond to the Yard and didn't realize this was the 5 MLK thread.

I had to laugh to myself recently because I came across someone online complaining about the loss of old Portland and mentioned this building, and reading it, all I could think is "and how many times did you shop at Fishels?"
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  #118  
Old Posted Feb 11, 2018, 10:46 PM
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I can ignore the NV, by simply thinking "how nice, they facelifted that 1970s building", and anyway I don't go by it 2X every day.

But the Y - oh, this isn't the thread for that building. But why then does it keep creeping into this thread.

Because the - it, you know which building I'm talking about - and 5 MLK will stand as two sides of a monumental gate to the eastside of the city. They'll forever be paired and compared.

I wonder, as they designed 5 MLK, if the architects thought about how their building would play off It Which Must Not Be Named. The opportunity to contrast light with dark, elegance with crudity, grace with bulk?
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  #119  
Old Posted Feb 12, 2018, 12:26 AM
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Add my name to the list of those who hate the NV. Unlike the Yard, which while dark and oppressive, at least has a compelling massing (mostly from the short ends though, the broadside is too wide and should have been broken up), the NV has neither. In my opinion, the 45 degree symmetrical form is even worse than the shingles. At least it's not all black/brown like the Yard though (although ironically, the base of the NV is all grey/brown brick, and actually quite nice).

While it started out on the wrong foot, I think the design of 5 MLK has come a long way and (hopefully) won't suffer the same fate.
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  #120  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2018, 8:01 PM
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