Evidence is mounting that Apple has picked a location for its new campus

[Atlanta3000]

Seriously why does Apple or Amazon feel Raleigh is a city where they can attract and retain ten's of thousands of new workers when the data doesn't support this assumption?

Raleigh renter survey ranks region alongside San Francisco, LA area in this metric

https://webcache.googleusercontent.c...nt=firefox-b-1

Just a quarter of renters in the city say they plan to live in the area long-term. That puts Raleigh in the company of San Francisco, Boston and Riverside, California, outside of Los Angeles, which were the only places that had a small proportion of their renter pool planning to stay in town.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Seriously why does Apple or Amazon feel Raleigh is a city where they can attract and retain ten's of thousands of new workers when the data doesn't support this assumption?

Raleigh renter survey ranks region alongside San Francisco, LA area in this metric

https://webcache.googleusercontent.c...nt=firefox-b-1

Can't this be attributed to the fact that some of these are college towns (Riverside, Raleigh, Boston) and that renters/students are unsure where their careers will take them in the near future? SF (and Boston) has cost of living issues.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by JManc

Can't this be attributed to the fact that some of these are college towns (Riverside, Raleigh, Boston) and that renters/students are unsure where their careers will take them in the near future? SF (and Boston) has cost of living issues.

I don't think so. I think it means people go there for a job, but as soon as they can find another opportunity they will gladly leave. I lived in Raleigh from 1999 - 2001 and it was OK, but I knew immediately I wanted to leave.

[Atlanta3000]

Why Atlanta Beats Raleigh In the Quest for Apple's Headquarters In the South

https://www.inc.com/lisa-calhoun/why...-in-south.html

* Easy airport connectivity to its other campuses for its own team and its suppliers.

* A steady stream of diverse talent from schools like Georgia State, Georgia Tech, UGA, Mercer, Emory, SCAD, and more.

* A transportation hub capable of supplying and scaling repairs and refurbs. With Delta and UPS headquartered in Atlanta, it's a clear logistics leader.

* International capacity not only through air, but also overseas. The largest single container terminal in North America is Port of Savannah, which also boasts the largest concentration of import distribution centers on the East Coast.

* Creativity--Apple's services core is fueled in part by cloud services, which are supported by music, video, gaming, AR and other digital creativity so core to Apple's unique elan.

* A business-forward political structure ripe for becoming more progressive, as evidenced by Georgia just tapping Stacey Abrams as the first black woman governor's candidate in the country.

[James Bond Agent 007]

^
Well, if the original article is correct, and Raleigh has already been chosen, with DC having come in 2nd, I'd say that that's a bit of a moot point, don't you think?

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by James Bond Agent 007

^
Well, if the original article is correct, and Raleigh has already been chosen, with DC having come in 2nd, I'd say that that's a bit of a moot point, don't you think?

This is the first sentence of the article:

In the wait for Apple's announcement over a fourth campus, the debate is heating up over where Apple is going.

Nothing in the article alluded to Raleigh already being selected. Did you even bother to read it?

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Nothing in the article alluded to Raleigh already being selected. Did you even bother to read it?

There are about a billion articles indicating that Raleigh has been chosen.

Why would Atlanta even want another sprawling exurban corporate campus? Traffic isn't quite bad enough yet?

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Crawford

There are about a billion articles indicating that Raleigh has been chosen.

Why would Atlanta even want another sprawling exurban corporate campus? Traffic isn't quite bad enough yet?

Yeah - NYC doesn't need anymore jobs as well because your house prices are high enough already and your traffic sucks too.

Atlanta is closed for business per Crawford.

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Why would Atlanta even want another sprawling exurban corporate campus? Traffic isn't quite bad enough yet?

I'm sure for the same reasons DC, Dallas, Chicago and others would want "another sprawling exurban corporate campus," so they don't become a metro area that can't seem to land any significant relocations/expansions and instead remain stuck in neutral like Detroit.

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

I'm sure for the same reasons DC, Dallas, Chicago and others would want "another sprawling exurban corporate campus," so they don't become a metro area that can't seem to land any significant relocations/expansions and instead remain stuck in neutral like Detroit.

One has nothing to do with the other. And I'm not aware of any of these cities in running for Apple or with similar conditions as Atlanta.

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Yeah - NYC doesn't need anymore jobs as well because your house prices are high enough already and your traffic sucks too.

Atlanta is closed for business per Crawford.

Probably shouldn't respond to a post lacking even a scintilla of sense, but:

A. NYC isn't in the running for an Apple campus
B. If it were, I guarantee it wouldn't be a sprawling corporate campus
C. There are tons of people in NYC who would be against such a campus (myself included)
D. Not wanting another sprawltastic hellhole in exurban GA has nothing to do with "Atlanta is closed for business" and
E. Higher property values are a very good thing, bad traffic in sprawl is a very bad thing

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by Crawford

One has nothing to do with the other. And I'm not aware of any of these cities in running for Apple or with similar conditions as Atlanta.

No one even said Atlanta was in the running for Apple. You just assumed that was the case.

But my point still stands. A ton of metro areas want "another sprawling exurban corporate campus" because of the positive feedback loop they generate:

a ton of high-paying jobs ---> more highly educated talent ----> more taxpaying retailers & restaurants to support that highly educated talent ---> improved schools / civic services ---> improved quality of life ----> rinse/wash/repeat

...to avoid becoming stuck in neutral or even decline.

[The North One]

You're delusional, nobody has to build sprawling office corporate campuses in order to not be in neutral or decline. That's the point being made that you're deliberately being obtuse about.

You're also wrong, Detroit has had acquisitions recently (LinkedIn, Adient, etc.) and on top of it, those companies all went to the urban core, unlike exurban sprawl hell Georgia.

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by The North One

Detroit has had acquisitions recently (LinkedIn, Adient, etc.) and on top of it

1. What company has LinkedIn been acquired by? I must have missed the news.

EDIT: That's right, LinkedIn was acquired by Microsoft. But what does that have to do with Metro Detroit?

2. "Adient" was already in Metro Detroit. It was a division that was spun off form Johnson Controls. It's not the same as landing the Nissan HQ (Nashville) or the Toyota HQ (Dallas) or the GE headquarters (Boston) or the Volkswagen HQ (DC) with thousands of *new* high-paying jobs from outside the region.

And BTW, "acquisitions" are not the same as corporate expansions / relocations. You do know that, right (then again, maybe not)?

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by JManc

Can't this be attributed to the fact that some of these are college towns (Riverside, Raleigh, Boston) and that renters/students are unsure where their careers will take them in the near future? SF (and Boston) has cost of living issues.

And SF is also a "college town". The city's largest employer is UCSF, I believe, even though that institution doesn't offer bachelor's degrees. It's primarily a graduate, research and medical institution (although UC also has a separate law school in the city as well). In addition, there is the University of San Francisco (a Jesuit school once well known for its basketball team), San Francisco State (a part of the California State University system) and San Francisco City College (what the name implies). Finally, it's quite possible some UC Berkeley students live in the city--their campus is a 30 minute BART ride away and housing in Berkeley itself is tight and as expensive as in the city.

But I think the main reasons a lot of people might not consider this their permanent home is that their tech jobs are their first jobs out of school and they are hoping to eventually advance to work in their field closer to home or they are simply part of the vast number of young unmarrieds who assume that when kids come they'll want a house/yard in the suburbs.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

1. What company has LinkedIn been acquired by? I must have missed the news.

EDIT: That's right, LinkedIn was acquired by Microsoft. But what does that have to do with Metro Detroit?

And BTW, "acquisitions" are not the same as corporate expansions / relocations. You do know that, right (then again, maybe not)?

Linkedin leased all of this new San Francisco tower a few years ago and has 2500 employees there who aren't going anywhere:


https://www.sfgate.com/technology/ar...er-5422501.php

Actually, given the shortage of large blocks of office space in the city now--there's really only one building offering such coming online and it's in the early stages of construction--there are probably those wishing LinkedIn would move out.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

2. "Adient" was already in Metro Detroit. It was a division that was spun off form Johnson Controls. It's not the same as landing the Nissan HQ (Nashville) or the Toyota HQ (Dallas) ...

FWIW, both of these were Southern California losses, nothing to do with Detroit. (Nissan fled Gardena, and Toyota fled Torrance.)

(I realize you didn't claim the contrary, but still, I figured I should point it out to make sure.)

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by lio45

FWIW, both of these were Southern California losses, nothing to do with Detroit. (Nissan fled Gardena, and Toyota fled Torrance.)

(I realize you didn't claim the contrary, but still, I figured I should point it out to make sure.)

Thanks, but that has nothing to do with my point.

[JMKeynes]

Raleigh is definitely the front-runner. Tim Cook is a Duke alum, and he spoke at the Duke graduation recently. When he was in the Triangle, he met with the Governor of NC.

The Triangle has one of the best educated populations in America. It's home to Duke and UNC (and other schools). It's cheap, and there's relatively little traffic.

[The North One]

Adient moved their global headquarters into Detroit from Wisconsin, so because they had some presence in southeast Michigan means it wasn't an acquisition? Johnson Controls isn't even headquartered in Michigan, where is our logic? (can't wait for your continued "oh it's not that great" downplay response) LinkedIn opened their new first office in the US for about ten years in Detroit. Relocating the head of companies is far from the only driver of growth, other corporate investments can be far more valuable and obviously the natural growth of home companies (like Amazon in Seattle) is a thing that exists which is responsible for most of the growth in other regions. Maybe Georgia could try doing that instead of luring companies with absurd public government incentives from places like California and the Northeast.

Regardless, all of this is just your usual derailing and trolling shtick, the point was sprawly exurban corporate centers (which Atlanta loves more than anyone) is shitty, dead-end urban planning responsible for crippling congestion despite extreme low-density in such a metropolitan region.