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  #18841  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 1:45 AM
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Why would anyone be forced to choose? They're both idiots and I would cast a null ballot in a heartbeat over giving either of them my vote.
Gotta agree with that
     
     
  #18842  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 1:47 AM
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Actually from some stuff I've read many wouldn't even consider Trump a conservative.
Of course he isn't, he isn't an anything as he has no values other than his ego. Most American 'conservatives' are not so either, as they are quite happy to restrict other peoples' freedoms when it suits them.
     
     
  #18843  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 2:36 AM
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Most American 'conservatives' are not so either, as they are quite happy to restrict other peoples' freedoms when it suits them.
I think that's normal; you seem to be mistaking 'conservative' for 'libertarian'. It's not atypical for the former to want to stick their noses in your bedroom and your uterus, and even wish they could force you to attend church.

(I do agree with what you said earlier about those definitions being pretty limited, especially considering that the 'fiscal' and 'social' components are kind of independent.)
     
     
  #18844  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 2:57 AM
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Why would anyone be forced to choose? They're both idiots and I would cast a null ballot in a heartbeat over giving either of them my vote.
Fully agreed that neither should be in any position of leadership. Still think Trump will get Canada to concede last minute on supply management so he can claim a "major" victory on trade.
     
     
  #18845  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 3:14 AM
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Fully agreed that neither should be in any position of leadership. Still think Trump will get Canada to concede last minute on supply management so he can claim a "major" victory on trade.
I stlll think improved market access is more likely tha full dismantling of the supply management regime. Depends what the U.S. side is willing to give in exchange. I see that Maxime Bernier has decided that this is the right time to renew his call for dismantling of supply management. A test of Scheer's control over his caucus on the horizon?
     
     
  #18846  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 3:25 AM
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I stlll think improved market access is more likely tha full dismantling of the supply management regime. Depends what the U.S. side is willing to give in exchange. I see that Maxime Bernier has decided that this is the right time to renew his call for dismantling of supply management. A test of Scheer's control over his caucus on the horizon?
I suspect it is all theatre. The Liberals have already caved on supply management but have to play up Trump forcing their hands.
     
     
  #18847  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 3:35 AM
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I suspect it is all theatre. The Liberals have already caved on supply management but have to play up Trump forcing their hands.
I don't think "caved" is accurate. If it's out there, it's as part of a trade off, not some give away.
     
     
  #18848  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 3:37 AM
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
Please take note:

MPs unite to condemn Trump's tariffs, verbal attacks
NDP motion backs Liberal government's position, supports supply management
Kathleen Harris · CBC News · Posted: Jun 11, 2018 4:50 PM ET | Last Updated: 2 hours ago
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mp-h...rump-1.4701468



also:

Mulroney says he's 'never seen anything' like Trump surrogates' attacks on Trudeau
Former PM says Canada needs to ignore noise from White House and concentrate on NAFTA talks
CBC News · Posted: Jun 11, 2018 6:17 PM ET | Last Updated: 19 minutes ago
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mulr...afta-1.4701799



and finally:

Trump's tirade sparks calls for calm, promises of support for Trudeau
https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trum...deau-1.3967602



a Tweet from Andrew Scheer:



and a Tweet from Doug Ford:



rousseau, please don't try and equate Canadian conservatives with the Trumpian style alt right pseudo conservatives south of the border. We are nothing alike. Many conservatives (especially Progressive Conservatives) are simply liberals who believe in financial responsibility and accountability, and who also have a firm belief in the value of free enterprise, personal freedom and have a general dislike for Liberal style graft, corruption and largesse.. We have nothing in common with the gong show going on south of the border.

When forced to choose between Trump and Trudeau, 95% of Canadian conservatives would choose Trudeau - believe it.

Thank you very much for your attention to this matter........

Don't worry. I don't think anyone here would confuse you and the majority of Canadian conservatives with rrskylar and the like. You and many of the more right-leaning members of SSP come off as intelligent members that just want the best for Canada. The others use words like "libtard" and phrases like "liberal tears". They treat political discourse like it's a WWE wrestling match. I'd imagine most liberals and conservatives look to those people with embarrassment and pity more than anything.
     
     
  #18849  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 3:53 AM
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I suspect it is all theatre. The Liberals have already caved on supply management but have to play up Trump forcing their hands.
Maybe they'll give up supply management in exchange for getting their Trade and Gender chapter into NAFTA 2.0!

A preview from the agreement with Chile: http://international.gc.ca/trade-com....aspx?lang=eng

As far as I can tell it doesn't commit anybody to anything aside from the establishment of a committee which may suggest things which may or may not be implemented.

In any case, it would be great if behind the scenes work is being done to modernize some Canadian industries as part of the NAFTA negotiations. I'm not all that confident in it, but sometimes outside pressure can be good.
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  #18850  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 4:10 AM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
I think that's normal; you seem to be mistaking 'conservative' for 'libertarian'. It's not atypical for the former to want to stick their noses in your bedroom and your uterus, and even wish they could force you to attend church.

(I do agree with what you said earlier about those definitions being pretty limited, especially considering that the 'fiscal' and 'social' components are kind of independent.)
I don't think I am mistaking them (I'm aware of what they claim to be about), as they are more boxes that people choose to put themselves in rather than true definitions. They all blur into one, and when pressed most people don't truly believe in everything they claim to in all situations - things are always different when the money is coming out of their pocket, or it's someone else's freedom being taken away.
     
     
  #18851  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 5:00 AM
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Don't worry. I don't think anyone here would confuse you and the majority of Canadian conservatives with rrskylar and the like. You and many of the more right-leaning members of SSP come off as intelligent members that just want the best for Canada. The others use words like "libtard" and phrases like "liberal tears". They treat political discourse like it's a WWE wrestling match. I'd imagine most liberals and conservatives look to those people with embarrassment and pity more than anything.
Please, anyone here who god help expresses any viewpoint right of centre is painted as a right wing zealot, the left and liberals in general consider all those who disagree with their viewpoint as extremists!

PS Just hope the selfie sock puppet can get some better glue to keep his eyebrows in place!
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  #18852  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 5:12 AM
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Maybe they'll give up supply management in exchange for getting their Trade and Gender chapter into NAFTA 2.0!

A preview from the agreement with Chile: http://international.gc.ca/trade-com....aspx?lang=eng

As far as I can tell it doesn't commit anybody to anything aside from the establishment of a committee which may suggest things which may or may not be implemented.

In any case, it would be great if behind the scenes work is being done to modernize some Canadian industries as part of the NAFTA negotiations. I'm not all that confident in it, but sometimes outside pressure can be good.
Trying to work gender into trade agreements is as ludicrous as working it into regulatory reviews for energy projects. It's nothing more than a play at metaprogressive, which unfortunately seems to the Trudeau government's highest priority.

Giving on supply management isn't really a concession as the country will benefit enormously from its demise. I suspect the affected farmers will receive more than generous compensation.
     
     
  #18853  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 5:29 AM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post

PS Just hope the selfie sock puppet can get some better glue to keep his eyebrows in place!
The eyebrow glue incident is, to use a popular term, fake news.

http://www.snopes.com/fact-check/jus...deaus-eyebrow/
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  #18854  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 6:51 AM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Please, anyone here who god help expresses any viewpoint right of centre is painted as a right wing zealot, the left and liberals in general consider all those who disagree with their viewpoint as extremists!

PS Just hope the selfie sock puppet can get some better glue to keep his eyebrows in place!
No, you’re pretty much just regarded as a fool and right wing buffoon, not a zealot.
     
     
  #18855  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 6:58 AM
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Originally Posted by giallo View Post
Don't worry. I don't think anyone here would confuse you and the majority of Canadian conservatives with rrskylar and the like. You and many of the more right-leaning members of SSP come off as intelligent members that just want the best for Canada. The others use words like "libtard" and phrases like "liberal tears". They treat political discourse like it's a WWE wrestling match. I'd imagine most liberals and conservatives look to those people with embarrassment and pity more than anything.
Agreed.

Both conservatives and liberals in Canada need to make sure that they don’t follow the travesty of American politics (where your party / political affiliation becomes your primary identity and governs who you can and can’t socialize with) by not allowing the extreme fringes take over the social / political conversations.
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  #18856  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 8:56 AM
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Agreed.

Both conservatives and liberals in Canada need to make sure that they don’t follow the travesty of American politics (where your party / political affiliation becomes your primary identity and governs who you can and can’t socialize with) by not allowing the extreme fringes take over the social / political conversations.
You are suppose to follow Chinese politics. And not let Trump bully Canada.
     
     
  #18857  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 9:05 AM
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Canada in general needs to consider itself in comparison to countries other than the US. Despite the linguistic and cultural overlap, the structures of the two countries are very different.
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  #18858  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 9:36 AM
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You and many of the more right-leaning members of SSP come off as intelligent members that just want the best for Canada. The others use words like "libtard"
I'll lay claim to libtard which was admittedly a poor response to an appropriately poor post. People on the right are used to being called names like racist, homophobe, sexist and should know better to not act in kind.

Unfortunately modern politics is like a WWE match and a cultural war. It used to be a lot fairer fight, but not anymore, all gloves are off.
     
     
  #18859  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
I stlll think improved market access is more likely tha full dismantling of the supply management regime. Depends what the U.S. side is willing to give in exchange. I see that Maxime Bernier has decided that this is the right time to renew his call for dismantling of supply management. A test of Scheer's control over his caucus on the horizon?
Mad Max has posted his book chapter on supply management here:

https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.ne...pdf?1528225699

It's a long read, a simpler reason to end supply management is to paraphrase our PM "because it's 2018"!
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  #18860  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2018, 12:57 PM
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Mad Max has posted his book chapter on supply management here:

https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.ne...pdf?1528225699

It's a long read, a simpler reason to end supply management is to paraphrase our PM "because it's 2018"!
Whatever one's views on supply management, all can agree, I think, that Bernier's raising the issue again at such a sensitive time demonstrates that his only loyalty is to himself (if there were any doubt about it).
     
     
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