VIA rail seemed weird when I used it

kool maudit · #1 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:24 PM**

In July I took the train from Toronto to Montreal. It was a bit depressing and my Swedish companion laughed at it. It had old-style carbon copy credit card machines, dated decor, and it went very slowly. The Copenhagen-Stockholm line was probably like this in 1985.

THAT SAID

Canada isn't Northern Europe, train travel is a niche thing, and funding VIA is a political hot potato for a lot of reasons. You need to factor these things in. It was still a good way to get to Montreal.

HOWEVER

What's with the boarding process? Ordinarily, the train pulls into the station and passengers board their car through one of its two doors. Passengers wait on the platform and stand in the area where their car is likely to arrive. This means that hundeds of people can board at once, and it doesn't take a long time because those, say, 200 people are using 20 doors strung along 10 cars.

This is a picture of the station in Hamburg, and you can see there is space to board all up and down the trains:

When the ride begins a guy comes down the aisle and checks your ticket.

In Toronto and Montreal, though, they did this thing where it was like a plane. You waited at a gate in the station and then they boarded you through a single door, checking your ticket at said door.

Once through the door you got onto the platform, found your car, and got in.

Is this just a strange Canadian thing? I have never used trains in Asia or anything, but in Europe they don't do it this way. When I lived in Canada I didn't notice it because I wasn't used to taking trains.

It doesn't work very well and it doesn't play to the strengths of trains or train travel.

kool maudit · #2 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:29 PM**

I am looking at images of rail travel in japan and India now and they do it the platform way. What's with the gate idea?

kool maudit · #3 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:37 PM**

This guy is bitching about VIA in a similar manner to me, but he still didn't mention the weird, airplane-style boarding:

https://calgaryherald.com/business/e...ck-in-the-past

kool maudit · #4 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:44 PM**

I am trying to find information about this and can't, but what I can find is very telling as to VIA's shittiness.

VIA transported 4.4 million passengers in 2017, which was seen as a success:

https://london.ctvnews.ca/via-rail-c...cade-1.3919894

DSB, its Danish equivalent, carried 195 million that year in a country smaller than Metro Toronto. So you can see why the Danish government really needs to keep its trains in good shape while Canada's does not.

As said above, though, Canada isn't Europe and like I said to my travel companion, Sweden is far from perfect and we could fit it into Manitoba with room left over for Denmark anyway so shut up.

This was after a beer or two.

STILL

If they changed the boarding thing and maybe bought some wireless credit card machines it would be an easy win.

whatnext · #5 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:51 PM**

Anyone used to European train travel is going to find Canadian train travel backwards. There’s too much geography and not enough people to ever make intercity really succeed now that cars and planes are available.

I don’t know about VIAs boarding. Maybe it’s a legacy of the days conductors took tickets and it’s written into the staff contract?

kool maudit · #6 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:53 PM**

To be honest and having looked at the traffic numbers, VIA is pretty close to the mark given what a small-scale operation it is. You can't change things like freight train priority and moving to high-speed at anything other than great expense, and I can see why Canada is hardly likely to make a Manhattan Project-style priority of this.

The boarding thing is odd, though.

kool maudit · #7 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:56 PM**

Seems like the US uses the plane-style boarding method, excepting things like the Long Island commuter lines:

https://www.vox.com/2014/3/31/556360...n-amtrak-train

I am glad that someone else has noticed this.

kool maudit · #8 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 2:58 PM**

Seems from Vox like it might be a terrorism security-type thing. I wonder if we just signed up to the US method in 2001 or something and now we have a contract.

niwell · #9 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:07 PM**

I remember reading about the security thing some time ago - I agree it's quite strange, particularly since they don't actually check anything. The credit card thing though, ugh it's terrible. Last time I took the train they were training a new employee and it took the seat in front of me 10 minutes to order a beer. Luckily I actually had cash on me. You would think if they have wifi you could figure out a proper payment system. I mean if they can do it on planes... Speaking of which, the wifi also sucks.

If you book far enough in advance sometimes it's almost the same cost to take business class which is totally worth it.

lio45 · #10 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kool maudit

In Toronto and Montreal, though, they did this thing where it was like a plane. You waited at a gate in the station and then they boarded you through a single door, checking your ticket at said door.

Once through the door you got onto the platform, found your car, and got in.

Just like at the movie theater, where you pay for a given movie but after you got inside you can go into just any room...?

Is there anything to prevent someone from buying a much cheaper Toronto-Hamilton ticket then "mistakenly" hopping into a Vancouver-bound train?

(I also haven't taken the train in Canada in ages. Those times we did, as a kid - on service that doesn't exist anymore - I'm pretty sure our train was the only one in the station at the times we boarded it, so, not a problem.)

kool maudit · #11 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:48 PM**

If , say, boarded a train to Stockholm with a Malmo ticket, it would be noticed quickly (the guy comes by shortly after departing the station) and I would be fined heavily and kicked off at Malmo.

TownGuy · #12 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Just like at the movie theater, where you pay for a given movie but after you got inside you can go into just any room...?

Is there anything to prevent someone from buying a much cheaper Toronto-Hamilton ticket then "mistakenly" hopping into a Vancouver-bound train?

(I also haven't taken the train in Canada in ages. Those times we did, as a kid - on service that doesn't exist anymore - I'm pretty sure our train was the only one in the station at the times we boarded it, so, not a problem.)

Hell, with GO you don't even need to buy a ticket to hop on a train and they board the platform way. It is strange and off putting how VIA operates. I could hop on a train here in Cobourg and be in Toronto in just over an hour but I choose to drive to Whitby or Oshawa and take the GO train because VIA is an expensive pain in the ass.

kool maudit · #13 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:49 PM**

Oh, I see what you meant. In Canada, there doesn't seem to be an easy way to get from platform to platform once you are past your 'gate'.

niwell · #14 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 3:54 PM**

They check your tickets again after boarding as well - I assume they would make you get off at the next station if you attempted it.

SignalHillHiker · #15 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 4:47 PM**

This was fun to read. I'm biased and deprived. I still sit on sweaty, smelly streetcars smiling unrestrained in pure glee like an idiot. Proper trains, even more so. I wish we still had ours. Even if it took two weeks to cross the island.

Acajack · #16 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 5:59 PM**

I took VIA between Ottawa and Montreal and back about a month ago. It was for a weekend with the boys in la métropole.. One of the guys scored free VIA-1 (first class) tickets for all of us.

For sure, it did not feel like taking the train in western Europe but it wasn't bad at all IMO.

Yes, they checked our tickets airport-style at a kind of "gate" and then they were checked on board again after the train got rolling.

I think others have alluded to the fact that there aren't many trains departing from VIA stations, and so unlike in Europe they might have the luxury of being able to assign a person to check tickets before they walk to the train.

The rail cars were definitely dog-eared, but the service was great. Of course we were in first class so that might have something to do with it.

We got in good with the staff so it was basically open bar all the way up and all the way down.

Good times.

Acajack · #17 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 6:07 PM**

I have never gotten the impression that the way they take your tickets with a gate was in any way related to security. It seems to me it's always been like that every time I've taken VIA (pre and post 9-11).

As for preventing people from getting on the wrong train. I guess... but as mentioned there aren't that many trains in Canadian passenger rail stations. Even in the busiest ones it's not that hard to figure out what you need to do.

casper · #18 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 6:15 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Just like at the movie theater, where you pay for a given movie but after you got inside you can go into just any room...?

Is there anything to prevent someone from buying a much cheaper Toronto-Hamilton ticket then "mistakenly" hopping into a Vancouver-bound train?

(I also haven't taken the train in Canada in ages. Those times we did, as a kid - on service that doesn't exist anymore - I'm pretty sure our train was the only one in the station at the times we boarded it, so, not a problem.)

Via rail staff in Central Canada are very confused. They think they are running an airline. That has been my experience with the Ottawa-Montreal type route. The gate thing and all of that. That includes the silly pre-flight safety briefing by the air-stewards (sorry train host).

Once they start to head west the Via rail people behave as if they are running a train. At most of the stations in the west you can just walk out to the platform. Normally on the Canadian in any station is only one or two doors that are opened by the conductor.

Your not going to accidentally buy a Toronto to Montreal ticket and end up on a train to Vancouver. They know who is assigned each seat or cabin and how far they are going.

Via rail has nearly 3,000 employees. So it is a small operation but not that small.

casper · #19 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 6:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

.....

The rail cars were definitely dog-eared, but the service was great. Of course we were in first class so that might have something to do with it.

We got in good with the staff so it was basically open bar all the way up and all the way down.

Good times.

I believe the cars they use on service between Montreal-Ottawa-Toronto are European rail cars. They were originally built for some night-time service between London and Paris that was cancelled before it ever went into operation. Via rail ended up getting the rail cars at a discount.

The rail cars in the west and the Canadian are mostly old, they keep them in a good state of repair so they are fine but you do fell like your going back to the 1960s/1970s.

acottawa · #20 Posted **Aug 26, 2018, 6:45 PM**

I agree the complicated boarding process is silly. Not sure if there is a rational reason for it. If there is I would think it is the platform widths and the steep stairs. In Europe where passengers have full access to the platforms and board themselves the platforms are quite wide and the platforms are level with the trains. I suspect the pre-flight briefings are a government requirement.