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  #21  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 5:28 AM
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yeah but the port of churchill handles practically nothing and is closed most of the year....how is that our advantage?

i remember when winnport started that china cargo flight trumpeting it as the future because it was so much closer....how did that go?

the mid continent corridor is made up by marketing people...its not real....drawing a vertical line on a map, that just happens to be in the middle doesnt make it something....nobody lives in the middle of the continent.


anyways...looking to expand our economic base is a good thing, so i hope it finally works, but seriously this had been the next greatest thing for so long, you have to forgive my lack of enthusiasm...there hasnt even been a hint of success in the 20 years they have been talking about this....even calgary is a bigger transportation hub than we are now....and they dont even have a railway.
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  #22  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 5:38 AM
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hmmm...thanks for clearing that up....good info.

i would think that the polar air route would help edmonton as well.

why not do it in abbotsford?...it seems odd to me to drag cargo thousands of kilometres to process....even edmonton...if vancouver is the main port, to drive or train cargo way up north, process it and then ship it back south seems counter intuitive....thousands of kms of transportation for nothing....is the cargo from prince rupert enough to justify it?
don't forget win and ed have lots of land availible to do this in and van is right up against the coast
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  #23  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 5:55 AM
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@newflyer

yeah but the port of churchill handles practically nothing and is closed most of the year....how is that our advantage?

i remember when winnport started that china cargo flight trumpeting it as the future because it was so much closer....how did that go?

the mid continent corridor is made up by marketing people...its not real....drawing a vertical line on a map, that just happens to be in the middle doesnt make it something....nobody lives in the middle of the continent.


anyways...looking to expand our economic base is a good thing, so i hope it finally works, but seriously this had been the next greatest thing for so long, you have to forgive my lack of enthusiasm...there hasnt even been a hint of success in the 20 years they have been talking about this....even calgary is a bigger transportation hub than we are now....and they dont even have a railway.
I agree that Churchill is a small port today. It would have to grow to handle increased trade.. and the Feds are investing in it to increase its capacity. It will have to see continious expansion, as demand dictates. The fact as Global Warming takes hold that port will see increased shipping seasons. With the large cost & time savings of using that northern Port over Vancouver .. it won't take much convincing to use it. The only thing which is holding it back is limited capacity and a limited shipping season.

The large Cargo Jets can now go from China to Winnipeg directly.. and they actually had planes land into Winnipeg this week from China. Once again the lack of capacity is holding expansion of trade at bay.

The Mid Contiient Corridor has seen massive growth of Trade in the last 15 years. The border at Highway 75 is the second busiest in Western Canada. This is not "made up by marketing people" .. it is a very large corridor and is rapidly growing trade route which is also reaching its capacity limit. It links the US mid-west .. Texas and Mexico to the Canadian market and vice versa.. Hardly a small amount of trade.

Winnipeg is a hub .. which needs an infussion of investment to increase its ability to handle more trade. Its that simple.
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  #24  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:01 AM
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winnipeg also has several internet backbones runing threw it if severd would cause problems between the east and wes coast comunications...
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  #25  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:05 AM
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winnipeg also has several internet backbones runing threw it if severd would cause problems between the east and wes coast comunications...
Yeah .. last spring MTS accidently severed a trunk line ... and caused massive distress in my office.
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  #26  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:09 AM
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Chicago might be pushing reality ... but Winnipeg may soon return to its economic roots as being a major global centre of trade.

As it is layed out now the new Centreport Canada site will be nearly half the size of Regina.
The problem is that Regina is no longer in the planning stage, which Winnipeg seems to still be ironing out. The upgrades are already underway and our inland port has received a shot in the arm from CP rail as well as Loblaws who has committed to building a distribution centre, one million square feet in size and which will bring 1700 jobs to Regina.

Not saying both can't exist, but it seems as if Regina has already secured a number of tenants. Does that harm Winnipeg's chances? I don't know for certain, but it can't help.
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  #27  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:15 AM
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nothing stoping regina from having somthing that services the province
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  #28  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:17 AM
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Originally Posted by newflyer View Post
I agree that Churchill is a small port today. It would have to grow to handle increased trade.. and the Feds are investing in it to increase its capacity. It will have to see continious expansion, as demand dictates. The fact as Global Warming takes hold that port will see increased shipping seasons. With the large cost & time savings of using that northern Port over Vancouver .. it won't take much convincing to use it. The only thing which is holding it back is limited capacity and a limited shipping season.

The large Cargo Jets can now go from China to Winnipeg directly.. and they actually had planes land into Winnipeg this week from China. Once again the lack of capacity is holding expansion of trade at bay.

The Mid Contiient Corridor has seen massive growth of Trade in the last 15 years. The border at Highway 75 is the second busiest in Western Canada. This is not "made up by marketing people" .. it is a very large corridor and is rapidly growing trade route which is also reaching its capacity limit. It links the US mid-west .. Texas and Mexico to the Canadian market and vice versa.. Hardly a small amount of trade.

Winnipeg is a hub .. which needs an infussion of investment to increase its ability to handle more trade. Its that simple.
a lot of those things are pretty big if's....if global warming kicks in enough we can use churchill...if someone spends billions to build a port there....if the chinese decide to fly planes here....i dunno man.

i would have to see numbers to verify that the mid continent trade corridor actually exists...does manitoba do more trade with mexico and texas than other provinces?...do goods from mexico bound for other places in canada actually come to winnipeg first?...seems unlikely....then what...down the two lane trans canada to toronto?

if you drew a line straight down from calgary wouldnt there be a trade corridor there?....probably a bigger one....how about a straight line down from vancouver toronto or montreal?....now those seem like trade corridors....what goods are traded between texas, mexico and manitoba?
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  #29  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:18 AM
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The problem is that Regina is no longer in the planning stage, which Winnipeg seems to still be ironing out. The upgrades are already underway and our inland port has received a shot in the arm from CP rail as well as Loblaws who has committed to building a distribution centre, one million square feet in size and which will bring 1700 jobs to Regina.

Not saying both can't exist, but it seems as if Regina has already secured a number of tenants. Does that harm Winnipeg's chances? I don't know for certain, but it can't help.

The next step is realigning rail tracks. The CPR line runs north of the airport. With more cargo arriving by air from Asia and Europe, goods can be off-loaded to rail cars and shipped east, west or south.


I don't think Regina will be able to compete with Winnipeg in any meaningful way. Regina only serves one national raiway.... While Winnipeg serves CN, CP, OmniTrax and a few US rail companies.

The development of Winnipeg's port is also on its way...
Quote:
The CentrePort process has already begun.

Two big things Manitoban's will notice first are improvements to roads. Inkster Boulevard will be twinned from Oakpoint Highway to the Perimeter Highway. The $68-million project, co-funded by Ottawa, will allow truckers to get in and out of the city faster and safer.

Last week, Ottawa and Manitoba pledged $85 million to fixing up Highway 75 from the Emerson border north to Morris. The project is also being done, in part, to deal with heavier truck traffic heading north and south.

The next step is realigning rail tracks. The CPR line runs north of the airport. With more cargo arriving by air from Asia and Europe, goods can be off-loaded to rail cars and shipped east, west or south.

Source: Free Press


Add in the 6 rail yards already in the city of Winnipeg handling massive amounts of goods. east-west and north-south.



Winnipeg's relation to major US markets .... and access to the Mid Continient Corridor makes Winnipeg's port much more marketable.

But like you said I am sure there is room for both ... I would still expect Winnipeg to get the overwelming majority of trade though.
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Last edited by newflyer; Sep 19, 2008 at 6:39 AM.
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  #30  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 6:28 AM
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a lot of those things are pretty big if's....if global warming kicks in enough we can use churchill...if someone spends billions to build a port there....if the chinese decide to fly planes here....i dunno man.

i would have to see numbers to verify that the mid continent trade corridor actually exists...does manitoba do more trade with mexico and texas than other provinces?...do goods from mexico bound for other places in canada actually come to winnipeg first?...seems unlikely....then what...down the two lane trans canada to toronto?

if you drew a line straight down from calgary wouldnt there be a trade corridor there?....probably a bigger one....how about a straight line down from vancouver toronto or montreal?....now those seem like trade corridors....what goods are traded between texas, mexico and manitoba?
Global Warming is far from an "if" ... the shiiping season from Churchill has already expaned from a decade ago.

Planes are already flying into Winnipeg from China and other nations like Russia.. not an if ... its happening.

The Trans Canada link to Ontario is seen as very weak link .. most trade going east of Winnipeg is sent on Rails. Trade some time and goto Symington Yards one day and sit in Awe of the mass of rail cars moving in and out of the city.

Here is a little read for you:

http://www.destinationwinnipeg.ca/fi...%20upd2006.pdf

Destination Winnipeg has alot of information on many sectors of the city's economy. Take a look.
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  #31  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 4:54 PM
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below is an exert from an email i received from the cruise line industry. although it has nothing to do with manitoba and our cruise businesses (river rouge, paddlewheel queen ) it does show you what some governments do and take risks for POTENTIAL business. Like this whole Centreport or Winnport thing, make the commitment with dollars, business will not come until it is truly built.

Unfortunately, it has now become clear that the cruise port in Galveston will not reopen in the near future, and Carnival has just announced that the Conquest and the Ecstasy will resume operations this weekend from the Port of Houston's Bayport Cruise Terminal. The ships will operate the same itineraries as before and will return to Galveston as soon as the port and city are ready.

The brand-new, state-of-the-art Bayport Cruise Terminal was completed earlier this year, at a cost of $81 million, without the commitment of a single major cruise line to call there. The temporary closing of the port of Galveston will give Bayport an opportunity to impress cruise lines that could consider using the terminal as a home port in the future
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  #32  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 4:58 PM
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Heaven forbid Winnipeg and Edmonton work together on this.
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  #33  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 8:37 PM
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Manitoba News Release
............................................................

September 19, 2008

BUSINESS INITIATIVE TO SUPPORT INLAND PORT DEVELOPMENT


The Winnipeg Chamber of Commerce and Province of Manitoba today announced $80,000 for a private sector-led initiative to identify and attract new business investment to Manitoba's inland port.

The goal of the chamber's new Business Call program will be to seek out and act on the expertise of local CEOs who work in organizations or are connected to industries most likely to be interested in locating to the province's inland port, Winnipeg Chamber of Commerce president Dave Angus and Competitiveness, Training and Trade Minister Andrew Swan said today.

"We have looked at the best way to market ourselves to the world and the answer is to start by using the resources we have here at home," said Angus. "The intelligence and expertise of our local business community spans the globe and cuts across all sectors. Business Call will tap into this knowledge to help focus our efforts to build our inland port."

Business Call will connect with Manitoba business leaders to identify and pursue viable prospects for new investment, business relocation and business expansion, both on a local and international level. It will also gather industry information that will help inform future decisions. The program is receiving $50,000 from the province and $30,000 from the chamber.

"Building Manitoba's inland port is a vision we share with our business community and we are supporting it on various fronts,"
Swan said. "Developing our inland port has the potential to grow Manitoba's economy by taking better advantage of strong transportation assets and our strategic, central location."

Last week, the province introduced legislation creating CentrePort Canada Inc., a private-sector focused corporation that will develop and promote Manitoba's inland port. The proposed act designates 20,000 acres of land around James Armstrong Richardson International Airport for the inland port to serve as a transportation, trade, manufacturing, distribution, warehousing and logistics centre.

These are the types of companies Business Call will work to attract, Angus said.

"As the dynamics of the supply chain change, as energy costs continue to rise, businesses are

reassessing their locations. This unique, inland port zone gives companies a reason to look at Winnipeg, Manitoba, as a viable location," he said. "We have strategic advantages to offer companies who are pursuing entry into or increased presence in the North American market."

Manitoba's inland port advantages include:

- The James Armstrong Richardson International Airport, which is undergoing further expansion, operates unrestricted 24 hours a day and is first in Canada in the number of dedicated cargo freighters operating through it.

- The border crossing south of Winnipeg at Emerson is the top-ranked border crossing on the prairies, processing $14.4 billion in trade traffic annually. This key trade route to the United States and Mexico is being upgraded with $85 million in federal-provincial funding for PTH 75.

- Winnipeg is the only location between the west coast and central Ontario where the key lines of Canada's two major railways, CN and CPR, intersect. Both railways maintain extensive intermodal yards in Winnipeg. CN, CPR and Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railroad provide direct access to southern markets.

- Manitoba has the only deep-sea port in mid-Canada, the
port of Churchill, located at the northern tip of the mid-continent trade corridor, which runs south to the U.S. and Mexico. Manitoba is also linked to the Asia Pacific Gateway via Prince Rupert to the west and through Thunder Bay to the east.

- The province has introduced legislation to allow tax
increment financing to be used to support development of the inland port.

- 30 -
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  #34  
Old Posted Sep 19, 2008, 9:45 PM
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Originally Posted by newflyer View Post
Global Warming is far from an "if" ... the shiiping season from Churchill has already expaned from a decade ago.

Planes are already flying into Winnipeg from China and other nations like Russia.. not an if ... its happening.

The Trans Canada link to Ontario is seen as very weak link .. most trade going east of Winnipeg is sent on Rails. Trade some time and goto Symington Yards one day and sit in Awe of the mass of rail cars moving in and out of the city.

Here is a little read for you:

http://www.destinationwinnipeg.ca/fi...%20upd2006.pdf

Destination Winnipeg has alot of information on many sectors of the city's economy. Take a look.
If I may add to this conversation...

The Russian planes (at least one of them) that came here before were for MacDon, shipping their harvesting machinery to Russia. So knowing that with this inland port, businesses and industries like MacDon can see the benefits with it, which will be a lot more easier for shipping exports to other countries.
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  #35  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 4:38 AM
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Heaven forbid Winnipeg and Edmonton work together on this.
I definately would see regional regional transportaion centres like Edmonton and Regina feeding into Winnipeg's Centreport. It will become the primary transportation hub between Vancouver and Toronto... with huge significant logistical advanages.

Massive rail infrastrucre already exsists. 6 exsisting rail yards. 2 multi-modal terminals exist. Four of the largest Trucking compnaies in the nation are based from Winnipeg. Winnipeg is directly linked to the Mid-Continent Corridor, which is developing electronic tracking of shipments, as well is working towards the development of Free Trade Zones in each of the 3 NAFTA nations along this major transportation corridor. The Port of Churchill is expanding its capacity while its shipping season also grows.

The new Centreport development will include a new rail yard, including another multi-modal terminal linking rail, truck and aircraft cargo exchange.
It will also include a large container yard, with automated control management system. New and upgraded highways and railways will be constructed in and around Winnipeg, and along major travel routes in Manitoba and across the nation.

One only needs to look at the Kansas Inland Port to see what the Winnipeg planners are looking to acheive.
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  #36  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 5:52 AM
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From the Winnipeg Free Press

Local expertise to be tapped for developing inland port

Updated: September 19 at 01:56 PM CDT

The provincial government and the Winnipeg Chamber of Commerce want to tap local executives in search of potential investors for a plan to develop Manitoba as a transportation and distribution hub.

The province and the Chamber today announced they would spend $80,000 to survey senior Manitoba businesspeople about industries most likely to be interested in coming here to be part of the inland port.

"We have looked at the best way to market ourselves to the world and the answer is to start by using the resources here at home," Dave Angus, Chamber of Commerce president, said, in a news release. "The intelligence and expertise of our local business community spans the globe and cuts across all sectors."

The proposed plan will be known as Business Call. It will receive $50,000 from the province and $30,000 from the Chamber.

The province recently created CentrePort Canada Inc., a private-sector focused corporation to develop an inland port. Provincial legislation designated 80 square kilometres of land around Richardson International Airport "to serve as a transportation, trade, manufacturing, distribution, warehousing and logistics centre," the news release said.
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  #37  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 7:38 AM
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churchill also has cruse ships docking there
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  #38  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 3:46 PM
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I definitely would see regional transportation centres like Edmonton and Regina feeding into Winnipeg's Centreport. It will become the primary transportation hub between Vancouver and Toronto... with huge significant logistical advantages.

Massive rail infrastructure already exists. 6 existing rail yards. 2 multi-modal terminals exist. Four of the largest Trucking companies in the nation are based from Winnipeg. Winnipeg is directly linked to the Mid-Continent Corridor, which is developing electronic tracking of shipments, as well is working towards the development of Free Trade Zones in each of the 3 NAFTA nations along this major transportation corridor. The Port of Churchill is expanding its capacity while its shipping season also grows.

The new Centreport development will include a new rail yard, including another multi-modal terminal linking rail, truck and aircraft cargo exchange.
It will also include a large container yard, with automated control management system. New and upgraded highways and railways will be constructed in and around Winnipeg, and along major travel routes in Manitoba and across the nation.

One only needs to look at the Kansas Inland Port to see what the Winnipeg planners are looking to achieve.
From Western Economic Diversification Canada Program -Government of Canada - March, 2008...

Port Alberta Funding to Build Blueprint for the Future
The Government of Canada is investing in the development of a strategic plan to help position Port Alberta as a major North American inland trade and transportation hub.

The Honourable Rona Ambrose, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada, Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs and Minister of Western Economic Diversification, announced federal funding of $1.5 million toward the plan today.

"This investment marks an important step toward building the foundation needed to make Port Alberta a reality and success," said Minister Ambrose. "This investment will help develop a blueprint that will bring the Port Alberta concept to life and create an industry-led council to provide leadership for the initiative."

Port Alberta has the potential to transform Edmonton Region into a major North American warehousing and distribution hub that combines air, rail and road transportation infrastructure with links to Asia and the United States.

"Edmonton is a key inland staging area for trade between Asia and North America, so investing in Port Alberta is an investment in the future of the Edmonton Region," said Edmonton Mayor Stephen Mandel. "As the global port to the oilsands, Edmonton's future as an inland port is key to Canada's economic prosperity."

The funding from Western Economic Diversification Canada will support the building blocks of research, partnership and plans that will contribute to developing a strong and vibrant Port Alberta. The project will identify opportunities for Port Alberta, determine the economic impact and develop an action plan to ensure established targets are met.

"This new funding is vital to developing Port Alberta and positioning Edmonton International Airport, as part of this vital regional initiative, to become a major cargo processing centre, capable of hosting multiple modes of transportation and acting as a catalyst for advancing global trade and distribution across the region," said Reg Milley, President and CEO of Edmonton Airports. "Onsite warehouse and logistics facilities will serve North America's growing trade through NAFTA and with Asia and Europe."
Western Canada and Alberta are well positioned-both geographically and economically-to take advantage of changing dynamics in the global economy. The Edmonton region, in particular, has the potential to become a major North American trade and transportation hub between Asia and North America.

"Alberta's business environment just got better," said Martin Salloum, President and CEO of the Edmonton Chamber of Commerce. "In an ever-changing global environment, the communities that will survive over the long run are those that can effectively work together towards a common goal. Twenty years from now, residents of the Edmonton Capital Region will see a more diverse, dynamic economy thanks in part to the Port Alberta partnership and the investment made today by the Government of Canada."

Efforts to develop Port Alberta were initiated by Edmonton Airports in June 2006. Along with the Airport, the Edmonton Economic Development Corporation and the Edmonton Chamber of Commerce have formed a partnership to champion and direct the initiative. The City of Edmonton has also been a strong advocate for Port Alberta.

"Alberta's vibrant economic growth is based on efficient access to North American and world markets," said Ron Gilbertson, president and CEO of Edmonton Economic Development Corporation. "Port Alberta will coordinate a strategy to optimize Greater Edmonton's road, rail and runway infrastructure so local industry can maximize growth internationally with new export and back-haul opportunities with Asian markets as well as service vital regional markets in Northern Alberta and the far North. Port Alberta will play a vital role in supporting the growth of companies currently in our region and attracting the firms necessary to help support and sustain our ongoing economic growth."

Western Economic Diversification Canada is a department of the Government of Canada that works in partnership with the provinces, industry associations and communities to stimulate and encourage diversification of the western economy. It also represents the interests of the West in national decision-making.


...of interest is the fact that Edmonton started the process in June, 2006 and has already secured federal seed financing...Winnipeg has been at this concept for years and years and now finally Manitoba incorporates Centreport. Makes me think that the government is trying to catch up to the pack...
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  #39  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 3:55 PM
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Originally Posted by DAVEinEDMONTON View Post
...of interest is the fact that Edmonton started the process in June, 2006 and has already secured federal seed financing...Winnipeg has been at this concept for years and years and now finally Manitoba incorporates Centreport. Makes me think that the governement is trying to catch up to the pack...
Perhaps we are catching up to the pack, but now will be doing so with incredible speed, and may even surpass Edmonton in terms of infrastructure, but only time will tell. I still say Regina has little chance compared to both Edmonton and Winnipeg; maybe on a much, much smaller scale. I can't wait for all the naysayers to eat their words when this thing proves to be a success. I still think that both Edmonton and Winnipeg can work together to make two viable inland ports, sharing the economic benefits between the two cities.
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  #40  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2008, 4:24 PM
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Perhaps we are catching up to the pack, but now will be doing so with incredible speed, and may even surpass Edmonton in terms of infrastructure, but only time will tell. I still say Regina has little chance compared to both Edmonton and Winnipeg; maybe on a much, much smaller scale. I can't wait for all the naysayers to eat their words when this thing proves to be a success. I still think that both Edmonton and Winnipeg can work together to make two viable inland ports, sharing the economic benefits between the two cities.
Wouldn't their markets be quite different? Winnipeg's only seems to make sense if it is focused on the U.S. market, which is only about 70 miles away by Interstate highway and major direct rail connections. Edmonton's might be servicing the Prairies and especially the oil industry.
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