Top Cities According to Resonance

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by 10023

GDP isn’t the whole story, and is largely just a function of population and living standards.

North American cities tend to have higher quality of life than European equivalents and that is reflected in the higher per capita GDP of American cities. Those numbers mean something in the real world. Lets put it this way - Paris wouldn't be in flames right now over a 4% gas tax if Paris had a per capita GDP equal to some of the wealthier American cities.

[nito]

Originally Posted by badrunner

North American cities tend to have higher quality of life than European equivalents and that is reflected in the higher per capita GDP of American cities.

But GDP per capita isn’t the defining variable in quality of life, something that is ill defined and with multiple interpretations as to what it should be defined by.

GDP per capita also has little to do with the riots in Paris; the protestors are predominantly non-city dwellers for a start. A high GDP per capita hasn’t stopped US cities from outpacing their European peers in murder rates (in the order of magnitudes), and of course lower life expectancies, higher inequalities, poorer public services, etc...

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by nito

But GDP per capita isn’t the defining variable in quality of life

Nobody is saying that GDP per capita is the defining variable in quality of life, just that there is a clear correlation between the two. Just look up the cities/countries with highest GDP per capita and it's obvious. GDP per capita would be near the top of the list of criteria I would use to evaluate cities.

Originally Posted by nito

A high GDP per capita hasn’t stopped US cities from outpacing their European peers in murder rates (in the order of magnitudes), and of course lower life expectancies, higher inequalities, poorer public services, etc...

Nearly all of that is due to demographic differences between the US and Europe, and if we take a more granular look, it so happens that the areas that suffer those inequities the most in the US are also the areas with the lowest GDP per capita, which of course proves my point about GDP per capita being a reliable predictor for quality of life.

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by badrunner

North American cities tend to have higher quality of life than European equivalents and that is reflected in the higher per capita GDP of American cities. Those numbers mean something in the real world. Lets put it this way - Paris wouldn't be in flames right now over a 4% gas tax if Paris had a per capita GDP equal to some of the wealthier American cities.

I think the rioting in the US over a significantly higher gas tax would be more widespread if anything...

But it will have the form of a Malheur Refuge takeover and the rioters would be hailed as heroes or something.

[10023]

Originally Posted by badrunner

North American cities tend to have higher quality of life than European equivalents and that is reflected in the higher per capita GDP of American cities. Those numbers mean something in the real world. Lets put it this way - Paris wouldn't be in flames right now over a 4% gas tax if Paris had a per capita GDP equal to some of the wealthier American cities.

Nonsense.

[mhays]

I'd say European cities (in the more prosperous countries) have a nearly-universal better quality of life than US cities....transit, healthcare, walkability, etc.

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

I think the rioting in the US over a significantly higher gas tax would be more widespread if anything...

Has there ever been any widespread rioting in modern US history over something like a gas tax? Will middle class Americans start flipping over police cars and setting things on fire if the price of gas went up by 4 percent?

[Denvergotback]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Has there ever been any widespread rioting in modern US history over something like a gas tax? Will middle class Americans start flipping over police cars and setting things on fire if the price of gas went up by 4 percent?

I would.

Also this Colorado town just legalized thowing snowballs
( https://www.yahoo.com/news/boy-tries...005536587.html ) So we are a bit out of control here at the moment

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Has there ever been any widespread rioting in modern US history over something like a gas tax? Will middle class Americans start flipping over police cars and setting things on fire if the price of gas went up by 4 percent?

I could see that happening, yes. Take away gun, gas-guzzler or sprawl "rights" and there would be huge protests.

The French protesters aren't protesting the gas tax, BTW, but rather the fact that real incomes are declining while the wealthy are having their taxes reduced on the backs of the working class.

France is a much more "participatory" democracy. They vote, and protest, in far greater numbers, and are a better country for it.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I could see that happening, yes. Take away gun, gas-guzzler or sprawl "rights" and there would be huge protests.

Or business-owners' "rights."

Originally Posted by Crawford

The French protesters aren't protesting the gas tax, BTW, but rather the fact that real incomes are declining while the wealthy are having their taxes reduced on the backs of the working class.

France is a much more "participatory" democracy. They vote, and protest, in far greater numbers, and are a better country for it.

Hear, hear! I fully agree with you. In France, when people protest, it's a good thing. The government more or less listens to their grievances. There are often transit strikes in Paris, and I remember when the French were protesting a proposal to lengthen the number of work hours in a week.

In the US, protesters are seen as a problem, and whatever they're protesting about doesn't even seem to be taken into account. Remember the Occupy movement?

Which totally puzzles me; I would think that Americans would welcome protest and protesters. After all, the United States, as well as the French Republic, were both born of protest. Yet Americans see protest and protesters as a huge problem, with police and the government wanting to suppress and control protest/protesters. If people in the US protested more, we would not see the raising of the age of retirement, or the shortening of morning/afternoon breaks in the workplace. Or the continuing rising costs of healthcare. I could go on and on.

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I could see that happening, yes. Take away gun, gas-guzzler or sprawl "rights" and there would be huge protests.

I don't think that taking away constitutional or property rights is anything remotely like a gas tax. You are comparing a 4% increase in gas prices to extreme measures like disarming an entire population.

Originally Posted by Crawford

The French protesters aren't protesting the gas tax, BTW, but rather the fact that real incomes are declining while the wealthy are having their taxes reduced on the backs of the working class.

Precisely. To quote the only person in this thread who actually lives in France:

Originally Posted by mousquet

The French welfare state has been a scam for decades. People pay taxes and get nothing delivered in return.

What both of you are describing is declining quality of life. It's exactly my point. That's why I brought up the riots in the first place. Things like that just don't happen in a functioning economy. But maybe the US is on a similar trajectory and just isn't there yet? The same economic forces are squeezing the middle class in both countries.

Originally Posted by Crawford

France is a much more "participatory" democracy. They vote, and protest, in far greater numbers, and are a better country for it.

I would say that the US has a very healthy and vibrant protest culture. It's just more focused on social issues and sometimes just silly stuff. People certainly aren't rioting because they can't make rent.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Precisely. To quote the only person in this thread who actually lives in France:

The person "who actually lives in France" is stating an opinion, not an objective fact. And it is also an opinion that is demonstrably false. For instance, a huge difference between France and the U.S. is that the government of France provides universal health care to citizens.

Now here's my opinion: I don't think many people in France would opt for America's health care policy over their own country's.

[badrunner]

I'm pretty sure mousquet wasn't being literal.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by badrunner

I'm pretty sure mousquet wasn't being literal.

Doesn't change anything. Relative to the U.S., the country of which most people who read the statement are citizens, it is bizarre to say that your government gives you nothing. It is a fact that the French government provides an enormous benefit that the U.S. government does not guarantee its own citizens.

[badrunner]

Not sure what your point is. I'm all for universal healthcare in the US, but that's just one aspect of overall quality of life. And it's not like it's a truly free service. They pay for it with higher taxes and lower take home pay (leading to gas riots?). Maybe they can't really afford it.

[mhays]

Their healthcare is also a much more cost-effective system than the US'.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Take away gun, gas-guzzler or sprawl "rights" and there would be huge protests.

All very much more fundamental than a 4% tax increase on a single item.

The French protesters aren't protesting the gas tax, BTW, but rather the fact that real incomes are declining while the wealthy are having their taxes reduced on the backs of the working class.

France is a much more "participatory" democracy. They vote, and protest, in far greater numbers, and are a better country for it.

The "yellow vest" movement is growing and becoming more diverse, but the current rioting was started by suburbanites protesting the gas tax increase specifically. Then, because they attributed that increase to wealthier urbanites in government unsympathetic to their problems, the issues have gotten broadened. But the core of the movement did, indeed, first go to the streets over the gas tax.

So you think breaking store fronts of merchants who had nothing to do with the governmental action they dislike and burning cars owned by equally unrelated persons makes for a better country? I hope the next outbreak of Antifa violence trashes your home or car so I can ask how you feel about it then.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Now here's my opinion: I don't think many people in France would opt for America's health care policy over their own country's.

Just as a majority in this country have demonstrated (by voting) that they won't opt for France's over what America currently has.

I think my fellow citizens are wrong, as I've repeatedly said, but we don't have a single payer system because too many people don't want one, not because of some nefarious conspiracy to keep us from getting one. Those who agree with me need to do a better job of selling the idea--that's democracy, something France and the US share.

[chris08876]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Has there ever been any widespread rioting in modern US history over something like a gas tax? Will middle class Americans start flipping over police cars and setting things on fire if the price of gas went up by 4 percent?

Not until things get really bad.

But lets just say this, a pissed off America can be dangerous. The people that is.

But it would have to get really, really bad before massive bloodshed and rebellion occurs. I think it'll happen eventually, once things like climate change, massive flooding, food shortages hit to the point where its families fending for themselves as the authorities can't contain the catastrophe. A long time from now though, but it will happen eventually.

The U.S. will be mild in that respect. Some places, will be in big trouble!

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by 10023

Nonsense.

Life in Europe sucks