Winnipeg Roads & Infrastructure

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by Reignman

Speaking of 59/101, if the province now has $100 million more to spend on infrastructure, why not put that towards this long overdue interchange?

"Long overdue" is not strong enough to describe this. The original plans for the 59/101 interchange go back at least the early 1980s if not longer.

I am wondering which will be built first 59/101 or Perimeter/Waverly.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by CoryB

"Long overdue" is not strong enough to describe this. The original plans for the 59/101 interchange go back at least the early 1980s if not longer.

I am wondering which will be built first 59/101 or Perimeter/Waverly.

You mean 100/Kenaston I assume? From an economic benefit standpoint, the Kenaston cloverleaf should get priority. However the current intersection at 59/101 has proven to be quite unsafe...so really there's a valid argument to prioritize either one.

Back on topic of Winnipeg roads...our streets are really taking a beating this winter with the record cold temps. It should be a real rough ride this spring when all the frost heaves are subjected to the melt/freeze cycles that spring weather brings. Pothole pandemic.

[Reignman]

Anybody know when the city's list of 2014 street renewal projects is released? There's obviously a lot of streets that need attention...but one I personally hope to finally see done this year is the stretch of southbound Pembina between Chancellor Drive and Markham Rd. That is an absolutely brutal section of road.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by Reignman

Anybody know when the city's list of 2014 street renewal projects is released? There's obviously a lot of streets that need attention...but one I personally hope to finally see done this year is the stretch of southbound Pembina between Chancellor Drive and Markham Rd. That is an absolutely brutal section of road.

Two quotes from the 2014 budget:

Recreational Walkways and Bike Paths Page 2-2 - $2.83M
Pembina Hwy SB - University to Markham
- buffered bike lanes transitioning to asphalt
pathway

Regional Major Rehabilitation Works: Page 2-18 - $6.05M
Pembina Hwy SB - University Cres. to Markham Rd

http://www.winnipeg.ca/Finance/files...getVolume2.pdf

So it'll be getting the full re-build this year. You can also see all the other projects for 2014 there.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Two quotes from the 2014 budget:

Recreational Walkways and Bike Paths Page 2-2 - $2.83M
Pembina Hwy SB - University to Markham
- buffered bike lanes transitioning to asphalt
pathway

Regional Major Rehabilitation Works: Page 2-18 - $6.05M
Pembina Hwy SB - University Cres. to Markham Rd

http://www.winnipeg.ca/Finance/files...getVolume2.pdf

So it'll be getting the full re-build this year. You can also see all the other projects for 2014 there.

Thanks for the link bomberjet....great news about the rehab of that stretch of Pembina.

Looking at page 44 of the budget, it shows Marion St. widening/grade separation from Archibald to Lag project slated for 2015. Did I miss something..? Last I heard I thought the plan was to connect Goulet to Dugald overpassing Archibald. Then cut Marion access to Lag. Did plans change?

[bomberjet]

No that didn't change. It's out for functional design right now. They just use the Marion Widening name instead of Goulet connection.

Edit: At least I don't think it's changed from what I remember..

[Winnipegger]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Two quotes from the 2014 budget:

Recreational Walkways and Bike Paths Page 2-2 - $2.83M
Pembina Hwy SB - University to Markham
- buffered bike lanes transitioning to asphalt
pathway

Regional Major Rehabilitation Works: Page 2-18 - $6.05M
Pembina Hwy SB - University Cres. to Markham Rd

http://www.winnipeg.ca/Finance/files...getVolume2.pdf

So it'll be getting the full re-build this year. You can also see all the other projects for 2014 there.

I wish they would pave and add a sidewalk on Markham between University Crescent and Pembina because a lot of students walk down that gravel road and it can get pretty messy in spring and summer. Does anyone know if the city or University now owns that road since the University acquired the old golf course?

[TR_Chick]

The U of M owns Markham from the point it turns gravel to University crescent. Initially I think there was resistance to pave it (back in the golf course days) because they didn't want it used as a thorough fair and also to discourage parking on it. Then since the U of M bought the course, they knew it was going to be redeveloped between RT and the new south woods development eventually so I think it was just put on the back burner. But I agree, that road badly needs something done to it. They seem to have to resurface it every 2 weeks at times during the summer.

[biguc]

Looks like Public Works is hell-bent on keeping Provencher a truck route.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/loc...243564151.html

Getting truck traffic off Provencher is obviously a good move as far as turning it back to a street from a stroad. Local access aside, which is easy to provide for, I don't really see any good reason for trucks to drive there. The main argument against it is that there's already enough traffic on Marion. But that only raises the question, why are trucks allowed on Marion either? At least west of Archibald, anyway.

This got me thinking about something a lot of people have noticed about Winnipeg: Why are there trucks everywhere?

Check out the truck route map, on a shitty pdf like everything else the city provides: http://www.winnipeg.ca/publicworks/P...ckroutemap.pdf

Now look at Vancouver's:
http://vancouver.ca/streets-transpor...gulations.aspx

Could you imagine if Vancouver let trucks smash up and down Robson or Granville? That would be shit. Kind of like it's shit that Winnipeg lets trucks smash up and down Portage, Osborne, and every goddamn four lane street in town.

Winnipeg could easily halve its number of truck routes. Then we could all enjoy streets that aren't choked in dust, pot holes, and dead cyclists.

[original]

Drove down Route 90 today around 4pm for the first time in a while. What a nightmare, basically a crawling parking lot...
I'm guessing nothing has progressed?

[Bdog]

Originally Posted by biguc

Looks like Public Works is hell-bent on keeping Provencher a truck route.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/loc...243564151.html

Getting truck traffic off Provencher is obviously a good move as far as turning it back to a street from a stroad. Local access aside, which is easy to provide for, I don't really see any good reason for trucks to drive there. The main argument against it is that there's already enough traffic on Marion. But that only raises the question, why are trucks allowed on Marion either? At least west of Archibald, anyway.

This got me thinking about something a lot of people have noticed about Winnipeg: Why are there trucks everywhere?

Check out the truck route map, on a shitty pdf like everything else the city provides: http://www.winnipeg.ca/publicworks/P...ckroutemap.pdf

Now look at Vancouver's:
http://vancouver.ca/streets-transpor...gulations.aspx

Could you imagine if Vancouver let trucks smash up and down Robson or Granville? That would be shit. Kind of like it's shit that Winnipeg lets trucks smash up and down Portage, Osborne, and every goddamn four lane street in town.

Winnipeg could easily halve its number of truck routes. Then we could all enjoy streets that aren't choked in dust, pot holes, and dead cyclists.

If Provencher and Marion are both cut off as truck routes, how do trucks cross the Red into downtown (or get to the western half of the city from the eastern industrial areas)?

[citydesigner23]

Originally Posted by Bdog

how do trucks cross the Red into downtown (or get to the western half of the city from the eastern industrial areas)?

the trucks could use Archibald to Narin Ave to Higgins /or Disraeli Freeway.

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by biguc

This got me thinking about something a lot of people have noticed about Winnipeg: Why are there trucks everywhere?

I'm surprised you ask this when you have answered it yourself quite often: It's because we have no proper transportation infrastructure (freeways).

The two largest industrial areas in Winnipeg are around the airport and St.B/Transcona. There are also large factories in the Chevrier area (Motor Coach and Versatile or whatever it is called now) along with suppliers scattered all over the city.

As no factories carry inventory any more, there has to be a continual supply chain to feed production lines from suppliers, and that means a lot of trucks on the road all the time. This will only increase as every manufacturing facility (that has not already) moves to a just-in-time method of supply.

[rypinion]

Originally Posted by Riverman

It's because we have no proper transportation infrastructure (freeways).

But he provides Vancouver as a contrast. There aren't freeways criss-crossing Vancouver either and they apparently have limited truck routes.

[Riverman]

Not a lot of manufacturing going on in Vancouver either. Certainly not relative to the size of the city.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Riverman

Not a lot of manufacturing going on in Vancouver either. Certainly not relative to the size of the city.

I think the truth lies somewhere in between biguc and Riverman. The reality of our geography is such that trucks will need to go through central parts of the city because there aren't many viable alternatives.

But that said, there is a little too much leeway given to trucks. For instance, why is nearly every downtown street (including non-through streets like Edmonton St.) designated as a truck route? Maybe there is also a need for time restrictions... every morning rush hour I see a string of grain trucks from By's Transport in St. Adolphe pounding up Donald Street into downtown heading who knows where. Do those grain trucks need to be there at the peak of rush hour, clogging the street? And there are definitely some streets that should not be truck routes... Osborne and Provencher, for instance, have too many pedestrians and cyclists to allow unrestricted truck traffic. Maybe the trucks will have to take a 10-minute detour... maybe the next council will have the guts to take that step.

[Riverman]

I know By's Transport has the contract to haul all the flour to the big bakeries in the city but bulk (tank) trailers are used, not grain trailers. But yes, they have the right to use the street at any time of the day.

Any hauler is the same - they will move loads at the precise time the customer wants them. As I said, no business carries inventory any more; parts or raw material must be delivered at the precise time the customer needs it.

Originally Posted by esquire

Maybe the trucks will have to take a 10-minute detour... maybe the next council will have the guts to take that step.

And make it even more difficult for manufacturing in Manitoba to be competitive? A lot of jobs rely on manufacturing here.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Riverman

I know By's Transport has the contract to haul all the flour to the big bakeries in the city but bulk (tank) trailers are used, not grain trailers. But yes, they have the right to use the street at any time of the day.

That right, at least in relation to certain streets and certain times of day, can be revoked.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Riverman

I'm surprised you ask this when you have answered it yourself quite often: It's because we have no proper transportation infrastructure (freeways).

The two largest industrial areas in Winnipeg are around the airport and St.B/Transcona. There are also large factories in the Chevrier area (Motor Coach and Versatile or whatever it is called now) along with suppliers scattered all over the city.

As no factories carry inventory any more, there has to be a continual supply chain to feed production lines from suppliers, and that means a lot of trucks on the road all the time. This will only increase as every manufacturing facility (that has not already) moves to a just-in-time method of supply.

And this lack of infrastructure investment that Winnipeg has neglected for the past 50 years will in turn hurt industrial and manufacturing expansion and growth which in turn will lead to fewer jobs here which will lead to an ever eroding tax base......but yup keep voting in the nit-wits as we have for the past 50 years and then wonder why every municipality in western Canada has surpassed us economically and why taxes are lower everywhere else! End of rant.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by Bdog

If Provencher and Marion are both cut off as truck routes, how do trucks cross the Red into downtown (or get to the western half of the city from the eastern industrial areas)?

Here's a better question: why do they need to?

You can see in the Vancouver truck route link I provided that if trucks can't reach a local destination via truck route, they may take the shortest route. That takes care of any reason a truck would have to go downtown from an industrial area (think of how absurd that is, anyway. Semis full of animal feed and cabinets rolling on up to, what? The MTS centre?)

If they need to go to the west they can use the ring road, like most car drivers tend to prefer anyway.

Finish the damn ring road and make sure industry has good access to the Perimeter. Then halve the total number of truck routes and make sure those that exist are good.

I really doubt any manufacturing is going to skip town because truckers need to take a 5 minute longer drive.

Also, how about manufacturing takes advantage of the other kind of infrastructure that carves up our city and is, really, the whole reason this city exists? Good old rail.