Medical Emergency on SkyTrain today

[Volksboi]

I was riding the skytrain as I do every day on my way home from work and was in conversation with a friend of mine and we noticed a gentleman in his mid to late 40 starting to have what appeared to be a seizure. The emergency button was pressed several times as we approached Brentwood skytrain station and a skytrain official came on the PA and advised that there would be someone coming to the skytrain car at the approaching stop.

The train stopped at brentwood and no one came, the doors closed and the train proceeded to holdom and a female skytrain attendant boarded the train and the train continued to Sperling Burnaby Lake where the train stopped permanetly. This in my mind was crazy because the people on the phone with 911 had to keep changing there location as the train kept moving. There where two people on the line with 911 and the 911 dispatcher requested to speak with the skytrain official that was in control of the "scene". The skytrain official refused to talk to the 911 dispatcher and advised that she was dealing directly with skytrain control. This skytrain official did nothing first aid related, and did not even know how to check his pulse, which was shocking considering she was the one responding to the medical emergency.

About 3 - 5 minutes later another skytrain attendant boarded the train and he requested a passenger to help remove the man from the train. The sky train attendant did not support his neck at all, and just grabbed him by his arms and carried the man out with his head almost dragging on the ground. he then started CPR. The train started to move again and I was still on the train. I stayed in for two stops, then felt I needed to go back and give a statement to someone at the scene. At the time I arrived there was several fire fighters and paramedics on the scene trying to revive this poor man and continued to do so for what appeared to be about 10 - 15 minutes with no sucess of reviving him.

This was a huge eye opener for me since I have no first aid training at all, and had no idea what to do, nor did anyone else on the train. The reason I am writing this is because I am so upset and shocked that the person responding to a medical emergency had no sort of first aid training to assist this man, and even went as far as refusing to talk to a 911 operator who could have assisted her in helping this man. I am not sure what I should do. I feel I need to report this somewhere, as a man lost his life due to the situation not being dealt with correctly by skytrain.

[Hong Kongese]

This guy must had suffered a massive heart attack.

Yes, the transit attendants should have some basic first aid trainning.

[Volksboi]

I agree! If they are going to respond to a medical emergency they should know how to deal with these types of situations...

[SpongeG]

that sounds horrible

whenever i see the attendants they are sitting around gabbing with each other getting on and off for what appears to be no reason as all they do is stand around

[fever]

I saw the firemen giving the guy CPR. You know it's pretty much too late by then. Sad

They stopped the westbound trains shortly after I passed Sperling, but the guy was on the eastbound platform. Obviously someone fucked up

[zivan56]

Although I agree the attends should have first aid training, someone in the train should have helped. If you (not you specifically, in the general sense) don't know what to do, you could just try to perform CPR the best you can.
You cannot be sued or held liable for trying to help someone without knowing what to do...even if you do it improperly. There is a BC law which prevents you from even being sued unless you knowingly did harm.

[mr.x]

That's terrible.....to think they could handle the situation in such an untimely and unprofessional manner, and as a result a man has lost his life.

Really, bring it up the media. I really do hate how our news has lately blown things out of proportion, but this is one thing that really deserves and needs a closer look at.

Absolutely terrible.

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by zivan56

Although I agree the attends should have first aid training, someone in the train should have helped. If you (not you specifically, in the general sense) don't know what to do, you could just try to perform CPR the best you can.
You cannot be sued or held liable for trying to help someone without knowing what to do...even if you do it improperly. There is a BC law which prevents you from even being sued unless you knowingly did harm.

Perhaps, but isn't that sort of a hindsight perspective? I'm sure the passengers on that car were panicking.

With that said, it would have been a good idea for the passengers to drag the guy out of train once it had arrived at Brentwood. I mean, it's ridiculous that the guy was still on a moving train after he collapsed.

[Volksboi]

Yea I contacted CTV and they are jumping all over it and will be doing a big story on it. And the people on the train did what they could do, no one had any sort of first aid training and we tried to do the best we could. When this guy stoped breathing and lost his pulse the skytrain attendant was there, and people assumed, which I guess should not have that the person responding to a medical emergency would be able to assist this man further until help arrived. The even bigger thing about this aswell is the skytrain passed through 3 stations from the time the emergency button was pushed, till the train stopped.

[Volksboi]

And he was in his seat still. There was people trying to support his next after he stopped seizing.. Its really tough to say what the passengers should have done until you are actually in the situation.

[raggedy13]

That's both frustrating and depressing. Poor guy. I also feel bad for all of you that just had to stand there helpless and watch as the situation went from bad to worse. You'd think they'd be better organized for dealing with medical emergencies.

Originally Posted by Volksboi

Yea I contacted CTV and they are jumping all over it and will be doing a big story on it.

I'm glad to hear this. Good for you for being proactive about this. Hopefully some good will come out of it.

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by Volksboi

Yea I contacted CTV and they are jumping all over it and will be doing a big story on it. And the people on the train did what they could do, no one had any sort of first aid training and we tried to do the best we could. When this guy stoped breathing and lost his pulse the skytrain attendant was there, and people assumed, which I guess should not have that the person responding to a medical emergency would be able to assist this man further until help arrived. The even bigger thing about this aswell is the skytrain passed through 3 stations from the time the emergency button was pushed, till the train stopped.

Good for you, i hope they make a big deal out of it (but only to a fair extent). SkyTrain's medical emergency procedures need a closer look at.




Last year while riding the bus with a friend after getting off at Lougheed Station, a young woman and her husband were getting on one of those high level buses. They had their 6-day new born with them, in the carriage. For some reason, the husband decided to lift the carriage up on to the bus without taking the baby out.

Well, the baby fell right out of the back hole of the carriage (the carriage was completely slanted). The newborn hit his head on the bus floor and proceeded to roll down the steps, onto the concrete curb. The bus operator within 20 secs radioed in for help, and about 5 mins later fire rescue arrived and another 5 mins afterwards, the paramedics.

It was rather disturbing, and none of us could help. The husband was sobbing, the wife was hysteric and crying her eyes out.....for what seemed the longest time, the baby didn't make any sound at all. No cries, nothing.

About 15 mins after the paramedics arrived, the bus driver told us to get off the bus and catch the one that is arriving behind us.

[vango]

Did you try contacting Global and the Sun newspaper? Global's local news has the largest audience by far and this very unfortunate story needs to be heard.

[zivan56]

Ah, good to know people helped. I have seen cases where people just pass/stand by and do nothing (or try to run away from the scene). I hope they do report about it (didn't see anything on tonight about the incident).

I have seen something similar 10 years ago, when a lady was running with groceries to cross Georgia at Cardero and just ran into the intersection when the hand was flashing. All of a sudden, a car hit her going ~60 km/h and she flew over the car and landed on the road. I don't know what happened to her, but someone rushed to help within seconds (driver probably). Nothing was ever reported on the news about it.

[vanhattan]

Well, maybe this incident will encourage some who were there or on here to take a CPR / first aid class. I am a former ICU/ER Registered Nurse and used to teach these classes to lay people and to professionals. It is a relatively small time investment that can one day save the life of a stranger or even a loved one. The classes are not hard and it is very valuable information for one to have.

[cornholio]

Frankly I dont see what the big fuss is about, sounds like buddy had a massive heart attack and chances are CPR wouldn't of done squat. Also skytrain attendant are not first aid attendants, im sure they all have a class 1 first aid certificate but those things are pretty much useless. If anyone should be blamed it should be all the people on the skytrain car who were there from the begining who could of taken him off at the station and attempted help, but then again this is Canada and no one has any sort of balls around here to stand up and help because you know, eww he has puke all over him, or he is pissing himself blah blah blah.
I guess I just dont see the big deal except the fact that people out here are like sheep, always expecting someone else to help and do the work for them.

[Volksboi]

Originally Posted by vanhattan

Well, maybe this incident will encourage some who were there or on here to take a CPR / first aid class. I am a former ICU/ER Registered Nurse and used to teach these classes to lay people and to professionals. It is a relatively small time investment that can one day save the life of a stranger or even a loved one. The classes are not hard and it is very valuable information for one to have.

Yea I am going to take a First Aid course now, I have never felt so helpless...And for Cornholio I knew you of all people would be the one to be the ignorant jerk about this, but thanks for you insight.

[Mike K.]

Let's keep this respectable from both sides.

There is a good chance the media may find its way to this thread and I would appreciate it if everyone from both sides of the debate kept things professional.

Volksboi, that's a horrible experience but it looks like an eye-opener for you, too. IMO for the train to have traveled through several stations before finally stopping and you having to change the location for emergency personnel is inexcusable. It is obvious that whatever procedures Translink has setup for these types of situations, they were not carried out appropriately and the attendants lacked the skills to assert themselves.

[Canadian Mind]

Originally Posted by zivan56

Although I agree the attends should have first aid training, someone in the train should have helped. If you (not you specifically, in the general sense) don't know what to do, you could just try to perform CPR the best you can.
You cannot be sued or held liable for trying to help someone without knowing what to do...even if you do it improperly. There is a BC law which prevents you from even being sued unless you knowingly did harm.

You sure about that? I remember being told that without my First Aid Qualification, I can be sued even trying to help. Only province where this isn't so is Quebec, where legally you must help.

And doing CPR improperly CAN make it worse. You could very well break a rib and send it through buddy's lung, or that little tip off the bottom of the breast-bone into an artery or the diaphragm, or throw a perfectly good heart off it's rhythm. Also, if buddy pukes, you gotta know to get all the gunk out of the way before starting again. But check the vitals, if buddy isn't breathing, start CPR.

As for the woman not knowing how to check for vitals, I smell a lawsuit brewing. She should be at least Standard First Aid qualified under the St. Jean program... and frankly vitals aren't hard to find.

Wish I was qualified to tell people how to do First Aid. I could type the basics out here directly out of my textbook. but I could be sued. Go figure.



And why the hell can't the emergency services issue a stop-order on all transit vehicles effective immediately? what if someone had a bomb on one of the trains determined to light the thing off downtown come 2010?

[Mike K.]

Yup, this incident highlights just how disorganized operations must be.

If Translink personnel cannot cope with a medical emergency on a skytrain, what else could they be doing wrong or not have the capability to do when it is required of them?

As for first aid, Canadian Mind is correct. Attempting to give first aid to someone when not having the proper training can make a situation much worse than it is. If you "know" what to do but don't have a certificate, give verbal advice only.