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  #61  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2007, 9:18 PM
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I know somebody posted the list of CSA's. Can anyone post the MSA numbers. I'm kinda interested to see where Boston is on that list.
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  #62  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2007, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jcathens View Post
I know somebody posted the list of CSA's. Can anyone post the MSA numbers. I'm kinda interested to see where Boston is on that list.

...if I have time, I will. It will be laborious, because it involves looking up the county components of each metro and then finding the 2006 estimate of each county, and adding up. I'd like to see that list too. I know the Atlanta MSA ranks higher on the MSA list than its CSA does on the CSA list. I think Atlanta is the 10th largest CSA but the 8th or 9th largest MSA.
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  #63  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 12:03 AM
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Atlanta didn't add counties going from 2005 to 2006, but it did add counties going from the 1990 to the 2000 census. I shudder to give the number of counties, because people always freak out, but the Atlanta MSA has a whopping 28 counties, and the Atlanta CSA has a whopping 33 counties! Of course, Georgia's counties are tiny compared to most other states, and Georgia has the most counties of any state in the country, save Texas. Having said all that, though, there's no denying that both the Atlanta MSA and the CSA encompass enormous swaths of land. The CSA stretches one county over into Alabama on the west side, and is within one county of the Chattanooga, TN, Athens, GA, and Macon GA MSAs, on the north, east and south sides, respectively. I'd like to see a chart like you mention also. Atlanta's CSA is roughly the same size as the Dallas and Houston CSAs, something a lot of people don't realize. Atlanta is the monster that ate north Georgia.
This is also considering Texas counties are large (especially the ones around Houston). Montgomery County (northern Houston metro), is basically half rural and half urban. The southern side is close to Houston's big airport, and home to the Woodlands, Conroe, and the almost booming Willis, Tx. After you get over this hill in Willis, it becomes real rural. I would like to see some urban area numbers.
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  #64  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 11:28 AM
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Here are the first post-Katrina/Rita stats for the metro areas directly affected by these two storms in 2005 for Louisiana and Mississippi.

New Orleans MSA
7/1/2006 7/1/2005 Change

Orleans Parish 223,388 452,170 -228,782
Jefferson Parish 431,361 451,049 -19,688
St. Tammany Parish 230,605 219,814 10,791
St. Bernard Parish 15,514 65,147 -49,633
Plaquemines Parish 22,512 28,903 -6,391
St. Charles Parish 52,761 50,554 2,207
St. John Parish 48,537 46,150 2,387

Total 1,024,678 1,313,787 -289,109

New Orleans CMSA

Washington Parish 44,750 44,277 473

Total 1,069,428 1,358,064 -288.636

Baton Rouge MSA

Ascension Parish 97,335 90,447 6,888
E. Baton Rouge Parish 429,073 409,809 19,264
E. Feliciana Parish 20,922 20,703 219
Iberville Parish 32,974 32,160 814
Livingston Parish 114,805 108,958 5847
Pointe Coupee Parish 22,648 22,288 360
St. Helena Parish 10,759 10,138 621
W. Baton Rouge Parish 22,463 21,634 829
W. Feliciana Parish 15,535 15,185 350

Total 766,514 731,322 35,192

Baton Rouge CMSA

Assumption Parish 23,472 23,108 364

Total 789,986 754,430 35,556

Houma-Thibodaux MSA

Lafourche Parish 93,554 91,910 1,644
Terrebonne Parish 109,348 107,094 2,254

Total 202,902 199,004 3,898

Lafayette MSA

Lafayette Parish 203,091 196,627 6,464
St. Martin Parish 51,341 50,228 1,113

Total 254,432 246,855 7,577

Lake Charles MSA

Calcasieu Parish 184,524 184,708 -184
Cameron Parish 7,792 9,611 -1,819

Total 192,316 194,319 -2,003

Gulfport-Biloxi MSA

Hancock County 40,421 46,546 -6,125
Harrison County 171,875 193,187 -21,312
Stone County 15,608 14,883 725

Total 227,904 254,616 -26,712

Pascagoula MSA

Jackson County 130,557 135,571 -5,014
George County 21,828 21,171 657

Total 152,385 156,742 -4357

Gulfport-Biloxi-Pascagoula CMSA

Total 380,289 411,358 -31,069
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  #65  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 3:07 PM
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I might try and to some math on the MSA's later. Its interesting because boston's CSA is over 7 million, and their MSA is just over 4 I believe. Quite a glom of metros come together for that statistic.
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  #66  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 4:43 PM
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July 1 2006 Top 20 U.S. MSAs

I took a couple hours this morning to compile this Top 20 MSA list based on the new census county estimates dated July 1 2006, and based on a prior poster's request.

1. New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA 18,330,835
2. Los Angeles-Long Beach-Santa Ana, CA 12,950,129
3. Chicago-Naperville-Joliet, IL-IN-WI 9,505,748
4. Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington, TX 6,003,967
5. Philadelphia-Camden-Wilmington, PA-NJ-DE-MD 5,826,742
6. Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown, TX 5,539,949
7. Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Miami Beach, FL 5,463,857
8. Washington-Arlington-Alexandria, DC-VA-MD-WV 5,290,400
9. Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Marietta, GA 5,138,223
10. Detroit-Warren-Livonia, MI 4,468,966
11. Boston-Cambridge-Quincy, MA-NH 4,455,217
12. San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont, CA 4,180,027
13. Phoenix-Mesa-Scottsdale, AZ 4,039,182
14. Riverside-San Bernardino-Ontario, CA 4,026,135
15. Seattle-Tacoma-Bellevue, WA 3,263,497
16. Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington, MN-WI 3,175,041
17. San Diego-Carlsbad-San Marcos, CA 2,941,454
18. St. Louis, MO-IL 2,820,377
19. Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL 2,697,731
20. Baltimore-Towson, MD 2,658,405


This was quite a laborious process so if anyone thinks I compiled any of the data in error please let me know. Let the wild MSA vs. CSA vs. Urban Area discussions begin!
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Last edited by SteveD; Mar 25, 2007 at 6:12 PM.
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  #67  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 4:53 PM
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Great work steve, appreciate the hard work.
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  #68  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 6:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveD View Post
I took a couple hours this morning to compile this Top 20 MSA list based on the new census county estimates dated July 1 2006, and based on a prior poster's request.

1. New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA 18,330,835
2. Los Angeles-Long Beach-Santa Ana, CA 12,950,129
3. Chicago-Naperville-Joliet, IL-IN-WI 9,505,748
4. Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington, TX 6,003,967
5. Philadelphia-Camden-Wilmington, PA-NJ-DE-MD 5,826,742
6. Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown, TX 5,539,949
7. Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Miami Beach, FL 5,463,857
8. Washington-Arlington-Alexandria, DC-VA-MD-WV 5,290,400
9. Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Marietta, GA 5,138,223
10. Detroit-Warren-Livonia, MI 4,468,966
11. Boston-Cambridge-Quincy, MA-NH 4,455,217
12. San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont, CA 4,180,027
13. Phoenix-Mesa-Scottsdale, AZ 4,039,182
14. Riverside-San Bernardino-Ontario, CA 4,026,135
15. Seattle-Tacoma-Bellevue, WA 3,263,497
16. Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington, MN-WI 3,175,041
17. San Diego-Carlsbad-San Marcos, CA 2,941,454
18. St. Louis, MO-IL 2,820,377
19. Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL 2,697,731
20. Baltimore-Towson, MD 2,658,405


This was quite a laborious process so if anyone thinks I compiled any of the data in error please let me know. Let the wild MSA vs. CSA vs. Urban Area discussions begin!
Thanks for putting this together Steve! Great job.

Looks like things have moved around a little since the last time I looked at the MSA rankings...is Dallas new in #4? That's not going to please Philly very much...Seems like Detroit has fallen quite a bit in the last few years.

#4-9 are bunched pretty close together...it will be interesting to see how things change at the current rate of expansion for some cities like Phoenix, Atlanta, etc.
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  #69  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 6:45 PM
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Yes...Dallas moving up to #4 on the MSA rankings is new with these latest census estimates. The Metroplex is a monster. However, the Philly CSA is still larger than the Dallas CSA. That will be changing soon too, though, with the relative rates of growth of the two. Atlanta drops from 9 to 10 on the CSA list, since both the Boston and San Fran CSA's are larger than the Atlanta CSA, but the Atlanta CSA is larger than the Miami MSA (which doesn't have a corresponding CSA). Dallas is the 4th largest MSA but the 8th largest CSA (the DC, Philly, Boston and San Fran CSAs are all larger). Houston is the 6th largest MSA but the 9th largest CSA.
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  #70  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 7:09 PM
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What exactly is the purpose of the CSA? Is it for commuting patterns between metros that touch?
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  #71  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2007, 8:08 PM
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What exactly is the purpose of the CSA? Is it for commuting patterns between metros that touch?
Essentially, yes. The Census bureau defines a CSA as follows: "A geographic entity consisting of two or more adjacent Core Based Statistical Areas (CBSA) (metropolitan and/or micropolitan areas) with employment interchange measures of at least 15. Pairs of CBSAs with employment interchange measures of at least 25 combine automatically. Pairs of CBSAs with employment interchange measures of at least 15, but less than 25, may combine if local opinion in both areas favors combination."

I'd say if the "Brain Train" ever gets built between Atlanta and Athens then the Athens GA metro would get wrapped up into the Atlanta CSA pretty quickly.
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  #72  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2007, 4:22 PM
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great job Steve. It will be interesting to see the UA populations now. I think the one everyone has posted the past few years are only from 2000. Wonder what it is now seeing as how many on this board actually think that is the true representative on how big or how urban a city or metro really is.
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  #73  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2007, 10:33 PM
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alright let me put my word in about the whole ATL thing, i go to school here now, and I do not like atlanta at all, and coming from florida, i miss water, palm trees, and longer periods of prolonged heat. i cannot wait to get out of here and either move back to florida or up to new york, chicago, or boston. If i was going to be any further north than jacksonville, then it would have to be in a real city like the ones mentioned. altanta sucks, i have some family that lives in east marietta or something along those lines, but it seems more like a road trip to get there, and if there is traffic, it is like 20 lanes of friday night south beach traffic, ridiculous! i have gone up to the one water area in the metro it seems like (lake lanier) to a friends house, and it took an hour and a half, and we were still in metro atlanta I SWEAR! there was a mall not too far down 400. while atlanta does have some cool parts in the inner core (the highlands and even decatur), buckhead is about the only nice place i would live here. people around here rave about buckhead all the time and how nice it was, well i forgot about how nice florida is and just got back from palm beach and coral gables, buckhead pales in comparison and is in fact cheaper than most average places in jacksonville, where i live, and moct of jacksonville isnt even "nice". i have a friend who's sister is moving to atlanta from new york (that has to be depressing, she does not know what she is getting herself into), and she is moving into a nice condo in buckhead for only 1400 or so a month! I guess that's why people move here because its sinful how cheap everything is, could it be because there are no palm trees, beaches, and rivers, and the intracoastal? The nightlife is better than where i am from, but barely, and im comparing a 5.something God knows by now metro to a 1.3 million person metro. Even the Greyhound station where i live is palatial compared to the one situated conveniently in a bad area by the garnett marta station. by the way a one way ticket on marta is $6.75, this is marta we are talking about here, not the new york subway where many people have no car. no f*****g wonder people ride their suburbans 100 miles from their house in the woods to work in atlanta!

people comparing miami to atlanta, live in the latter and visit miami all the time, there is a BIG difference. atlanta is 5 million people spread out over the size of a country whereas miami is 5 million people in what may equal out to be just fulton county. miami is an urban thriving city, atlanta is a suburban thriving metro. while i could not live in dade county, at least i could live in broward or palm beach (if i can afford them someday), but you could not pay me to live anywhere in the country of atlanta!
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  #74  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2007, 10:45 PM
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alright let me put my word in about the whole ATL thing,
The "whole ATL thing" ??? what in the world are you talking about? What "whole ATL thing"?? This is a thread about the census bureau's most recent county population estimates. Thanks for sharing your completely negative opinions about Atlanta! If you want to write several paragraphs doing nothing but ragging about a particular US metro why don't you start you own thread rather than pollute mine. Let me suggest a title..."Why I hate Atlanta". Thanks for nothing, bud.
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  #75  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2007, 10:55 PM
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uh, a one way ticket on marta is still 1.75, or at least it was last week when I rode all the way from Doraville to the airport....
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  #76  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2007, 11:36 PM
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One reason why Miami probably doesn't have a CSA is because it really is dense down there (in the metro as a whole).
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  #77  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2007, 12:09 AM
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One reason why Miami probably doesn't have a CSA is because it really is dense down there (in the metro as a whole).
Trae; I don't think it has as much to do with the density of the metro, which is impressive, as it does the linear layout. The metro is hemmed up against the coast by the Everglades, and since CSAs are created by adjoining metros which share a certain percentage of commuters, I think the likelihood of Miami having a CSA for the foreseeable future are slim. The MSA is already comprised of Dade, Broward and Palm Beach Counties, so the only way for Miami to have a CSA would be for an independent either MSA or micropolitan area to form in an adjoining county such as Monroe or Martin, which doesn't seem likely in the foreseeable future. And further, were such a metropolitan or micropolitan area to develop in one of those two counties, cross commuting would likely not occur due to the distances which would need to be overcome as a result of the linear nature of the existing MSA. The MSA already measures over 100 miles in the north-to-south orientation. Of course Collier, west of Dade and Broward, stretches all the way across the state to the Gulf, and includes developed areas such as Naples, but there will never be appreciable commuting between the Gulf and the Atlantic, and the two areas certainly don't identify with each other, which is the only other consideration the census bureau uses when forming CSAs.
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  #78  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2007, 2:51 AM
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in some ways, it seems like Atlanta shouldn't have a CSA...I mean Gaineseville is already basically in the MSA, at least in my mind, as well as Sandy Springs and Marietta.
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  #79  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2007, 3:00 AM
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in some ways, it seems like Atlanta shouldn't have a CSA...I mean Gaineseville is already basically in the MSA, at least in my mind, as well as Sandy Springs and Marietta.
John, I understand the point you're making and it puzzles me too. I believe it basically revolves around peripheral areas that have characteristics of standing on their own, but which still send a percentage of their workers to the adjoining MSA, or, areas which send a lower percentage of their workers to the adjoining MSA but which strongly identify with the adjacent MSA. I don't have the census stats, but I'd bet Gainesville probably fits into the latter of those two, with respect to the Atlanta CSA.
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  #80  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2007, 3:25 AM
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I don't think Atlanta should have a CSA either, Gainesville is now a suburb basically. If anything the CSA should include Athens.
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