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  #12961  
Old Posted Apr 14, 2019, 4:33 PM
lio45 lio45 is offline
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Not at the ballot box ...
Actually, yes it does, at least in some areas of the country (such as here). The CAQ has always been perceived to be "equivalent, on the economy" to the PLQ to a good degree (unlike the PQ and QS) and they still won by a landslide. Note that they didn't reverse much from the previous government's cuts, and that they even went as far as to publicly praise their predecessors tight management of funds. And they're still extremely popular even after doing this.

FYI, what was suicide at the ballot box for the PLQ was their attitude. They took a page from Hillary Clinton (basically calling the Québécois "deplorable"; the analogy works quite well) and lost an election they normally should have won based on things going well and them being incumbents (and they lost with their single worst result since the creation of the country/party!) because they needlessly went and insulted most of the electorate.

They may, or not, learn that it's not a good strategy, eventually. (They haven't, yet.)
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  #12962  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 12:27 AM
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As some will recall, after Trump pulled out of the Trans Pacific Partnership, Trudeau kept at it and was successful in negotiating a deal without the US. Looks like it has been a real boon, particularly for Alberta.


LINK - https://twitter.com/trevortombe/stat...22429397372930

Why some Canadian farmers may soon tower 'head and shoulders' above their U.S. rivals in Japan
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/bee...ptpp-1.4978777

Canadian beef producers enjoy TPP trade boost in Japan
https://www.ft.com/content/667a5faa-...b-ff8ef2b976c7
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  #12963  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 3:39 AM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
Actually, yes it does, at least in some areas of the country (such as here). The CAQ has always been perceived to be "equivalent, on the economy" to the PLQ to a good degree (unlike the PQ and QS) and they still won by a landslide. Note that they didn't reverse much from the previous government's cuts, and that they even went as far as to publicly praise their predecessors tight management of funds. And they're still extremely popular even after doing this.

FYI, what was suicide at the ballot box for the PLQ was their attitude. They took a page from Hillary Clinton (basically calling the Québécois "deplorable"; the analogy works quite well) and lost an election they normally should have won based on things going well and them being incumbents (and they lost with their single worst result since the creation of the country/party!) because they needlessly went and insulted most of the electorate.

They may, or not, learn that it's not a good strategy, eventually. (They haven't, yet.)
And when people point out that it is politically unwise to insult the electorate (in Quebec, the US or any other place), the answer that is usually given is "well, the electorate deserves to be insulted, so fuck them if they do not like it!"

Hope they have fun in opposition!
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  #12964  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 5:13 AM
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And when people point out that it is politically unwise to insult the electorate (in Quebec, the US or any other place), the answer that is usually given is "well, the electorate deserves to be insulted, so fuck them if they do not like it!"

Hope they have fun in opposition!
This ties in with "motive attribution asymmetry".

https://www.pnas.org/content/111/44/15687

When there is a disagreement, people have a tendency to believe that they are on the righteous, selfless, or caring side and their opponents have negative motivations like hatefulness.

There definitely isn't much of a sense in English Canada that maybe voters in Quebec are equally compassionate toward various groups but merely come at these issues from an alternate perspective, or deal with day to day realities that simply make a different approach more practical. And most people don't know how to distinguish between objective reasoning about the world and rhetorical lines of reasoning that could be constructed to fit any desired narrative.

If you're Fox News (or maybe the New York Times or CBC) and you mostly care about ad revenue then motive attribution asymmetry is great and you can fan the flames to exploit it. If you're trying to solve political issues it's a problem.
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  #12965  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 11:13 AM
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Potential huge announcement this morning, but probably not.

This morning at 10 the Premier and Ministers for Natural Resources and Finance will announce the rate mitigation plan for Muskrat Falls. At the same time, Hydro Quebec's birthday bash suggested the far-larger Gull Island development in Labrador is going ahead to power Ontario. And the usual comments about how we have no choice but to take whatever deal Quebec wants.

We'll see what happens. I suspect nothing and today's announcement is just about taking money from general revenue and using it to subsidize electricity rates.
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  #12966  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 12:11 PM
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Wouldn’t there be huge transmission losses from a hydro station in Labrador to bring power to Ontario? Seems odd to me, but I’m no electrical engineer.
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  #12967  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 12:20 PM
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There's already a lot of power going that way from Churchill Falls. There are some losses but it's still worthwhile.
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  #12968  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 12:24 PM
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Wouldn’t there be huge transmission losses from a hydro station in Labrador to bring power to Ontario? Seems odd to me, but I’m no electrical engineer.
I take that you're not very familiar with Hydro-Québec grid network. We were the first in the world to develop the 735 kV power lines for travelling great distances with minimal loss.

http://nouvelles.hydroquebec.com/fr/...735-kv-50-ans/
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  #12969  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
Potential huge announcement this morning, but probably not.

This morning at 10 the Premier and Ministers for Natural Resources and Finance will announce the rate mitigation plan for Muskrat Falls. At the same time, Hydro Quebec's birthday bash suggested the far-larger Gull Island development in Labrador is going ahead to power Ontario. And the usual comments about how we have no choice but to take whatever deal Quebec wants.

We'll see what happens. I suspect nothing and today's announcement is just about taking money from general revenue and using it to subsidize electricity rates.
Bernard Drainville was talking about Gull Island on the radio this morning. He said this was one if not the untamed river with the biggest hydro potential.

I try to look it up on google maps but It gets me to a small village on the island of Newfoundland. Is this potential project on the Churchill or on another river?
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  #12970  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 1:26 PM
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Yes, it's on the Churchill River. I believe downstream from Muskrat Falls.

Announcement today wasn't that - just the expected plan to spend our provincial government revenues on subsidizing electricity rates.
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  #12971  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 1:34 PM
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Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
Yes, it's on the Churchill River. I believe downstream from Muskrat Falls.

Announcement today wasn't that - just the expected plan to spend our provincial government revenues on subsidizing electricity rates.
Plus $200million (annually?) from Canada, no?
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  #12972  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 1:52 PM
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That's their plan, yeah. Sigh.
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  #12973  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 3:30 PM
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I would not call it ''austerity'' but rather ''Spending slowdown''. The budgets were still rising by that time, but by a slower pace.
Agreed. Nothing about Quebec's budget says "austerity". They are doing a great job at managing debt while not cutting too many programs.
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  #12974  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 5:41 PM
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Alberta helping BC meet its climate goals!

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“The New Democrat mayor of Vancouver says that he wants a carbon-free Vancouver by 2040,” Kenney said. “Well, if he and the other British Columbia New Democrats continue to block our energy, we can give them a carbon-free Vancouver by 2020.”
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  #12975  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 5:43 PM
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Even though it's a monumentally stupid idea, I hope Kenney lives up to his promise to shut off the taps an hour after being sworn in. It will be hilarious.
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  #12976  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 5:47 PM
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Even though it's a monumentally stupid idea, I hope Kenney lives up to his promise to shut off the taps an hour after being sworn in. It will be hilarious.
It might be many things, but "hilarious" hardly seems one of them.
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  #12977  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 6:16 PM
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As a BCer, the word hillarious will hardly slip by my lips when my gas goes to over $2/litre. That said, you can't help but be amused by the irony of the situation. Vancouver wants to be carbon-free by 2040 so how can they possibly bitch that Alberta is helping them acheive those lofty goals? This is the same situation with the TM. BC doesn't want it due to environmental concerns but then demands that the current pipeline be kept running at full throttle so they can use the same dirty oil that they are protesting about. How can BC explain in court with a straight face that it has the right to the dirty oil Alberta exports but Alberta has no right to export anywhere else?

I am not looking forward to even more expensive gas as we already pay the most in NA but if I were in Kenny's position, I would cut off the taps the day after I get elected. It will make Victoria {and all BCers} put their money where their industrial-sized mouths are.............you either want our oil or you don't.
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  #12978  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 6:30 PM
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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
Even though it's a monumentally stupid idea, I hope Kenney lives up to his promise to shut off the taps an hour after being sworn in. It will be hilarious.
That's not what he promised to do. He said he wants to talk to Horgan first and have a reasonable talk. If Horgan continues to be unreasonable then Kenney will take action.
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  #12979  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 6:31 PM
WarrenC12 WarrenC12 is offline
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Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
As a BCer, the word hillarious will hardly slip by my lips when my gas goes to over $2/litre. That said, you can't help but be amused by the irony of the situation. Vancouver wants to be carbon-free by 2040 so how can they possibly bitch that Alberta is helping them acheive those lofty goals? This is the same situation with the TM. BC doesn't want it due to environmental concerns but then demands that the current pipeline be kept running at full throttle so they can use the same dirty oil that they are protesting about. How can BC explain in court with a straight face that it has the right to the dirty oil Alberta exports but Alberta has no right to export anywhere else?

I am not looking forward to even more expensive gas as we already pay the most in NA but if I were in Kenny's position, I would cut off the taps the day after I get elected. It will make Victoria {and all BCers} put their money where their industrial-sized mouths are.............you either want our oil or you don't.
The hypocrisy is on Alberta's end too. They want more pipelines because they can't ship enough, but they also want to stop shipping it.

I could not give a shit. Sure, dial it up to 11 Kenney. Put your money where your mouth is.

The days of oil & gas expansion are over. The sooner Alberta realizes that, the better. Or they just don't give a shit about the planet.

Also, we could build 7 more pipelines to BC and the price of gas wouldn't go down. Don't fool yourself.
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  #12980  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2019, 6:51 PM
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Vancouver is a dense city whose freeway network is extremely underdeveloped. If any place can realistically get off the concept of burning oil for energy, it's them. I'd say, go ahead, "shut off the taps". It will be Alberta's permanent loss because after BC moves to electric transportation, even if you want to reopen the taps they won't want/need it anymore.
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