Ottawa Rapid Transit Network developments

[waterloowarrior]

LRT costs concern federal officials
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/ot...107/story.html

[McC]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

LRT costs concern federal officials
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/ot...107/story.html

first:
‎"The cost to build Ottawa’s light rail line could still go up when private companies bid to build it, the federal government says, despite major changes the city has made in the past few months to rein in costs" ...

soon after:
"The documents, obtained by the Citizen under the federal Access to Information Act, were written before city officials adjusted the project to provide more certainty that the budget would be met."

What terrific editing; what a non-story.
(emphasis mine)

[S-Man]

Cancel it! Something might happen!! Bad stuff, too - unforeseen stuff in the future that hasn't been predicted because studies haven't found it to be true.

Plus, it will cost money and take time to build, so best to just never start. Besides, the buses are running just fine.

[waterloowarrior]

transit union to get LRT maintenace contract if latest proposal to union goes through
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...nspo-deal.html

[McC]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

transit union to get LRT maintenace contract if latest proposal to union goes through
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...nspo-deal.html

wasn't the public-private partnership supposed to include maintenance?

[S-Man]

I believe it was....so what's with this? Honestly, I don't trust the reliability of OC Transpo to do basically anything.

[MalcolmTucker]

All I have to say is sigh.

[McC]

Choose the route that works


OTTAWA CITIZEN OCTOBER 15, 2011



It looks as if Ottawa city councillors will have three unpalatable choices when it comes to picking the route for the western extension of light rail.

The Ottawa River Parkway route originally favoured by the city is still included in a just-released early version of the city's plan, but it faces strong opposition from the National Capital Commission and residents who live near the parkway. Ridership could be an issue, as there would be fewer opportunities to pick up passengers along the parkway.

Carling Avenue had been thought by many to be the logical alternative, as it would serve the hospitals and businesses along that route, but the study indicates that it will be expensive because most of the line will have to be elevated. Either that or the trains will poke along, stopping every couple of blocks.

The city is also looking at various options in the Richmond Road-Byron Avenue corridor, but these would take rail right through neighbourhoods that aren't going to like the noise, and the somewhat unsightly wires and tracks that rail involves. People sometimes say they want transit at their doorstep, but not literally.

To make a rational decision, councillors will have to decide what this particular part of the line is meant to accomplish.

If it is to move people quickly and relatively inexpensively downtown, the parkway route would still be the logical choice. If it is to encourage redevelopment, there are plenty of opportunities on Carling, relatively fewer on Richmond Road. Unfortunately, there is no route that offers both rapid transit and significant redevelopment benefits.

What councillors should not do is simply approve the rail route of least resistance.

We know that the NCC opposes the parkway route. One could certainly speculate that the Richmond-Byron route will not be applauded by the neighbours. That, in itself, is not a reason to choose Carling.

It is unfortunate that an unelected and unaccountable body will play such a major role in this decision. So far, the NCC has taken the easy way out. Its opposition could kill the parkway route, but it won't have to take responsibility for the cost or unpopularity of the alternatives.

Ottawa West-Nepean MP John Baird ought to take a position before council decides. If he backs the NCC's opposition to the parkway route, will he make up the higher cost of alternatives with a more generous federal contribution?

Whatever decision city councillors ultimately make, it should be based on clear cost/ benefit criteria, not merely on which group of opponents fights the hardest.

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen


Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Ch...#ixzz1awxiiC73

Some assumptions in this editorial that irked me:
1)overhead wires are no longer a requirement, see the new Alstom trams being built in French cities such as Reims. Apparently Bombardier has similar technology and Seimens has some third way of powering their CityVAL vehicles
2) The Parkway would not be a quicker route downtown than Richmond Byron for two reasons: it's longer and curvier, and the city's plans so far have expressed no interest in adding extra stations if the line goes through a densely built area instead of along the river
3)This "Extra federal money" they hope to shake John Baird down for is not "free money" that's magically donated by the federal government with no opportunity costs, etc... it's all tax money from us, whether today, tomorrow or in ten generations time.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by McC

Some assumptions in this editorial that irked me:
1)overhead wires are no longer a requirement, see the new Alstom trams being built in French cities such as Reims. Apparently Bombardier has similar technology and Seimens has some third way of powering their CityVAL vehicles
2) The Parkway would not be a quicker route downtown than Richmond Byron for two reasons: it's longer and curvier, and the city's plans so far have expressed no interest in adding extra stations if the line goes through a densely built area instead of along the river
3)This "Extra federal money" they hope to shake John Baird down for is not "free money" that's magically donated by the federal government with no opportunity costs, etc... it's all tax money from us, whether today, tomorrow or in ten generations time.

Any third rail-based system would be useless outdoors in an Ottawa winter. After about 25 cm of snow in a short time (like 12 hours), you would shut the whole system down...

[MalcolmTucker]

Well, the ground based selective powered rail yeah, would be pretty useless. I wouldn't want to put any salt down on it either (but engineers might know differently).

Given that they cost a lot more anyways, I don't think it would ever be done in Ottawa.

Why would it need to be anyways? You are never going to integrate ~125m long trains into a streetscape anyways. Given the headways the system needs to operate at at opening and in the future, the corridor is going to have to be rather separated from surrounding uses.

Just because the rolling stock is going to be low floor doesn't mean it is comparable to relatively low capacity low floor LRT and streetcar implementations elsewhere. It will be the highest capacity low floor system ever built. The only thing close is the still at the conceptual stage SE LRT in Calgary.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

Well, the ground based selective powered rail yeah, would be pretty useless. I wouldn't want to put any salt down on it either (but engineers might know differently).

Given that they cost a lot more anyways, I don't think it would ever be done in Ottawa.

Why would it need to be anyways? You are never going to integrate ~125m long trains into a streetscape anyways. Given the headways the system needs to operate at at opening and in the future, the corridor is going to have to be rather separated from surrounding uses.

Just because the rolling stock is going to be low floor doesn't mean it is comparable to relatively low capacity low floor LRT and streetcar implementations elsewhere. It will be the highest capacity low floor system ever built. The only thing close is the still at the conceptual stage SE LRT in Calgary.

Any system has to be designed with winter in mind. Consider the winter of 2007-08. Had an overhead LRT system been in place, most likely service would have continued normally or with minor delays as the snow would have melted with the continuous operation of the wires by passing trains (it may require running trains overnight). But with a surface-based third rail, there would have been shutdowns at least on 2 or 3 occasions lasting possibly for several days each in certain areas.

The only dangers with an overhead LRT are rare ice storms. They should be designed to hold up to about 25 mm of ice. However, constant operation would have melted some of the freezing rain and reduced the danger there.

Remember, articulated buses are terrible in heavy snow and ice. They should always be pulled after 25 cm of snow has fallen within 12 hours or in poor road conditions, even though that would result in modifying service. A possible snow plan could be:

1) Set detours on side streets for local and express routes (pre-planned for clear details)

2) After the pullout point, reduction in peak period service - i.e. no expresses or school trips since not enough buses would be available, somewhat similar to a Saturday service but more frequent overall (should only be done if school buses are cancelled and the federal government allows optional leave)

3) Shift in service to arterials and Transitways only, reduction/cancellation of local routes (should only be done if schools are closed completely and the federal government is closed, would have been ideal in Ice Storm '98)

4) Temporary suspension of all service (would require an extreme situation, AFAIK has never happened in Ottawa)

The O-Train would be completely separate and open or close on its own, regardless of whether the buses are at full service or not. I believe it has closed a few times due to weather (but not due to snow I don't think, just high winds and flooding).

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Any system has to be designed with winter in mind.

Maybe we could design a system using these principles:

• Video Link

[S-Man]

What councillors should not do is simply approve the rail route of least resistance.

Wouldn't that be messing with tradition?

[Cre47]

Latest BS coming from the Bulldog regarding the Richmond-Byron corridor
http://blogs.ottawacitizen.com/2011/...n-gray-column/

Originally Posted by Ken Gray

City Gets Light-Rail Route Wrong: Ken Gray Column

From the people who discovered sand in Sandy Hill, who had to build the downtown transit tunnel one-third longer for geological reasons, then one-third shorter for geological reasons and who have had plans for the tube varying from 10- to two-storeys deep, we now have City of Ottawa staff gravitating toward a new route for the western light-rail line.

What could go wrong?

Maybe a little something, because this is the staff and city council that wants to bore a tunnel yet hasn’t dug a pothole in more time than it took to construct the Canadian Pacific Railway. And all this for the paltry sum of about $100 million for legal damages, lost planning and preliminary construction work or the equivalent of 10 per cent on your annual property-tax bill. Why this planning fiasco has been worth twice the price in entertainment value. Were the Three Stooges still alive, they could turn this plan into a serial. I’m sure I owe the city money for column material over the years.

And so the winner in this four-idea quest for the perfect western light-rail route appears to be … the Richmond-Byron corridor. And keeping its record intact, city staff is wrong. Really wrong.

You see light rail is not just a mode of transport, but a tool of urban planning. That means the Richmond-Byron linear park is a bad spot for the line. First, Highland Park residents won’t want what they perceive will be a noisy line near their homes whose price will be diminished by rail. Of course, built properly, light rail is not noisy and the proximity to the line is likely to raise house prices by tens of thousands of dollars. But that won’t matter. Residents just don’t want it.

But second, worse and unfortunately correct, developers will want to construct intensifying high-rise towers along the route thereby destroying one of the nicest neighbourhoods in Ottawa. Furthermore, every time a new condo is proposed in the community, war will ensue. Meanwhile, the thin strip of land is the local dog-walking park. Driving a wedge between families and the family dog is political suicide. If Jim Watson wants to be a one-term mayor (and he doesn’t), this will help.

City planners, who’ve made it clear from Day 1 they don’t want the line along Carling Avenue, say the light-rail line would need to be elevated along that wide street and, therefore, it would be expensive. Of course, many examples of light rail exist on arterial roads that are quick, efficient and not raised. The problem Ottawa planners have is that they pray at the altar of the primacy of the car. The city could raise the line in a couple of spots to let vehicles through or create a few level crossings with gates, but Carling Avenue should give rail priority over the car. Ottawans must realize that the future of transportation in this city is light rail, not the automobile. Planning primacy for the car is the reason Ottawa is building an unnecessary, expensive rail tunnel downtown instead of creating a surface-transit corridor. If governments spend billions on light rail, maybe people should ride it rather than be coddled in their cars.

Meanwhile if developers want to intensify on tired old Carling, residents would encourage it rather than fight it as they would on Byron.

As for using the Ottawa River Parkway, one of the possible routes, it’s a non-starter. MPP Yasir Naqvi is against it, so is top local Tory cabinet minister John Baird and the National Capital Commission because it rightly doesn’t think enough people live near the route. Imagine the city being out-planned by the NCC. Embarrassing.

Supporting this plan is the unique Kitchissippi Councillor Katherine Hobbs, whose curious grasp of planning has city thinker Jane Jacobs performing triple salchows in her grave and urban critic Richard Florida buying a cabin in the woods. Hobbs is the person who wanted to widen the roads of the old west end to speed traffic after the city had just spent millions narrowing them to make sidewalks more pedestrian friendly and to calm roadways. Her support alone for the Byron corridor should be enough to stop that alternative cold.

Long ago, city council and staff proved themselves incapable of efficiently building light rail. Gravitating toward the Byron corridor further reinforces this point. Maybe the city could make designing the route for the system part of the request for proposal for the project. That way, private companies that build transit every day could create a functional line efficiently rather than have Ottawa dally endlessly with city staff.

Perhaps then Ottawans will be able to ride on light rail before they join Jane Jacobs in the hereafter.


—-

I guess Ken wants the average transit commute time from Barrhaven and Kanata to be increased by 30 minutes while using the much slower Carling corridor. Yet, there will be no where as much noise as what the people on King Edward or Bronson are enduring with all those trucks rocketing down their front lawns 24/7 at continuous times even at night as opposed to probably 2 trains per hour during the overnight hours through Richmond and it will be only like a handful that will be enduring this, not all the area.

[waterloowarrior]

Mayor Jim Watson to announce OLRT project’s RFQ results
Ottawa – Mayor Jim Watson, Councillor Diane Deans and Councillor Marianne Wilkinson will have a media availability on the subject of Ottawa Light Rail Transit (OLRT) project on Friday, October 21.
Date: Friday, October 21, 2011
Time: 9:30 am
Location: Mayor’s Office, City Hall, 110 Laurier Avenue West
For more information on the OLRT project visit www.ottawalightrail.ca

[JCL]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

Mayor Jim Watson to announce OLRT project’s RFQ results
Ottawa – Mayor Jim Watson, Councillor Diane Deans and Councillor Marianne Wilkinson will have a media availability on the subject of Ottawa Light Rail Transit (OLRT) project on Friday, October 21.
Date: Friday, October 21, 2011
Time: 9:30 am
Location: Mayor’s Office, City Hall, 110 Laurier Avenue West
For more information on the OLRT project visit www.ottawalightrail.ca

Here are the RFQ results, based on the media release from the City: http://ottawa.ca/cgi-bin/pressco.pl?...=17219&lang=en

[Deez]

^ Interesting, but not altogether surprising, that Siemens is not yet part of any of the consortia...

[Cre47]

Originally Posted by Cre47

Latest BS coming from the Bulldog regarding the Richmond-Byron corridor
http://blogs.ottawacitizen.com/2011/...n-gray-column/


I guess Ken wants the average transit commute time from Barrhaven and Kanata to be increased by 30 minutes while using the much slower Carling corridor. Yet, there will be no where as much noise as what the people on King Edward or Bronson are enduring with all those trucks rocketing down their front lawns 24/7 at continuous times even at night as opposed to probably 2 trains per hour during the overnight hours through Richmond and it will be only like a handful that will be enduring this, not all the area.

May I add, also those in Barrhaven along the Via Rail corridor to the list of those enduring louder noises.

[Cre47]

Vinci is considered to be the biggest construction company in the world in terms of revenues and is owner of a slew of parking garages here in the region. Maybe they will have a bit of an advantage with Bombardier in their consortium, Bombardier had the huge contract for the renewal of the Montreal subway cars and of course they are the makers of our O-Train. Aecon, also in the Vinci consortium seems to be well known here as well. Don't count the consortium with SNC-Lavallin out though.

Don't know much about the third consortium group though. Brookfield, probably is the most known since it owns a bunch of office buildings downtown.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Cre47

Vinci is considered to be the biggest construction company in the world in terms of revenues and is owner of a slew of parking garages here in the region. Maybe they will have a bit of an advantage with Bombardier in their consortium, Bombardier had the huge contract for the renewal of the Montreal subway cars and of course they are the makers of our O-Train. Aecon, also in the Vinci consortium seems to be well known here as well. Don't count the consortium with SNC-Lavallin out though.

Don't know much about the third consortium group though. Brookfield, probably is the most known since it owns a bunch of office buildings downtown.

Does Alstom have any local presence? Having the same company doing the new O-Trains and the mainline LRT would be beneficial.