The Shale boom has some in Philadelphia to imagine it as the next "Houston"

M II A II R II K · #1 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:09 PM**

The Energy Hub Architect Talks Politics and Plausibility

January 14, 2015

By Patrick Kerkstra

Read More: http://www.phillymag.com/citified/20...ine-rinaldi-qa

Quote:

Phil Rinaldi is the CEO of Philadelphia Energy Solutions, which runs the South Philly refinery. He’s also the public face of the campaign to make Philadelphia into a globally consequential energy hub. Last month, Rinaldi, the Chamber of Commerce and other energy executives hosted a summit at Drexel University designed to sell the region as a prospective energy hub and lure manufacturers from all over the world to Philadelphia.

- It’s a controversial vision, with many opponents. But it also represents a tangible and potentially huge economic opportunity for a city with a crippling 26 percent poverty rate and a severe shortage of quality jobs for workers without college degrees. --- Rinaldi proposes constructing a new, very big pipeline, with enough capacity not just to supply existing demand (which is how pipelines usually get built) but future demand as well. He imagines companies with high-energy needs moving to the city in big numbers, both driving up demand for gas and creating jobs.

- Further south, in Marcus Hook, Sunoco Logistics is in the midst of repurposing an old pipeline and wants to build an entirely new companion pipeline to transport natural gas liquids from the eastern Marcellus Shale fields. Together, the projects have the potential to fuel a major petrochemical boom in the region. --- Rinaldi sat down with Citified to talk about his plans. He was bullish on pipeline prospects, unconcerned about falling energy prices, dismissive of objections from energy hub opponents and highly displeased with how City Hall managed the PGW debacle.

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chris08876 · #2 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:10 PM**

That would be nice. Really nice actually.

A energy hub thats near NYC, and not humid, commutable for me, o man.

As a geoscience guy, I welcome this idea! Although right now, it might be a fantasy in the heavily regulated Northeast. (On the level of Houston)

While the environmental industry is okay, the lucrative nature of oil/gas without moving down South is a tease just thinking about it. Of course I am just being self centered at this point.

Kenmore · #3 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:36 PM**

PA really doesn't have that much oil or gas and with prices tanking it's even less attractive. This is pretty silly even by puff piece standards.

iheartthed · #4 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenmore

PA really doesn't have that much oil or gas and with prices tanking it's even less attractive. This is pretty silly even by puff piece standards.

Yeah, the company I work for provides bankruptcy services and they're watching the price of oil closely. The expectation is that there will be a few bankruptcies in the energy sector if the barrel price is sustained near or below $40 for an extended period of time. It's not a great time to be an energy hub...

nergie · #5 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenmore

PA really doesn't have that much oil or gas and with prices tanking it's even less attractive. This is pretty silly even by puff piece standards.

I am in the business, much more than a puff piece.

sentinel · #6 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 9:50 PM**

I think the bigger issue is why hydrocarbons are still considered the 'future' of energy, anywhere?

chris08876 · #7 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 10:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by sentinel

I think the bigger issue is why hydrocarbons are still considered the 'future' of energy, anywhere?

A shift towards green energy resources/techniques will occur slowly and over an extended time period. Right now though, we have to many things out there that require hydrocarbons. Its just not your cars or trucks, but plastics, infrastructure, solvents, and so on. We can't just give it up.

Jasonhouse · #8 Posted **Jan 19, 2015, 10:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Yeah, the company I work for provides bankruptcy services and they're watching the price of oil closely. The expectation is that there will be a few bankruptcies in the energy sector if the barrel price is sustained near or below $40 for an extended period of time. It's not a great time to be an energy hub...

If this drags on for a while, there will be thousands of BKs from the wildcatters and fly-by-night suppliers and subs that have set up to serve the frackers.

And the big firms (and new startups) will come out even stronger after they suck up all of those liquidated assets at 20-30 cents on the dollar.

rellott · #9 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 4:32 AM**

http://www.newgeography.com/content/...h-energy-costs

I work in natural gas pipeline compliance... There really isn't much to worry about if the company conducts continual surveillance like they're supposed to.

Jasonhouse · #10 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 6:20 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by rellott

There really isn't much to worry about if the company conducts continual surveillance like they're supposed to.

Yeah, but that's a big if.

mhays · #11 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 6:50 AM**

Yeah, no kidding. Any system that relies on constant surveillance and QC can go wrong all too easily, and often does go wrong. Soooo many examples of pipeline disasters, including many that kill people.

AaronPGH · #12 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 7:07 AM**

Why Philly? Pittsburgh is smack in the center of it all. Not Philly. And it hasn't even happened here like the gas companies promised. Like someone said, prices are tanking.

Urbana · #13 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 8:10 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by AaronPGH

Why Philly? Pittsburgh is smack in the center of it all. Not Philly. And it hasn't even happened here like the gas companies promised. Like someone said, prices are tanking.

Ditto, Philly is a minimum two hour drive from anywhere with shale gas.

Reverberation · #14 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 1:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by AaronPGH

Why Philly? Pittsburgh is smack in the center of it all. Not Philly. And it hasn't even happened here like the gas companies promised. Like someone said, prices are tanking.

Seaport.

Crawford · #15 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 1:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverberation

Seaport.

But what does a seaport have to do with central office functions?

And why would there be huge seaport needs? Aren't there restrictions on US energy exports? I know crude can't be exported (which is silly, but currently the rule, I believe).

Kenmore · #16 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 1:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by nergie

I am in the business, much more than a puff piece.

I work for a large engineering consulting agency and i'd estimate 60%+ of my billing was related to hydraulic fracturing...it's a puff piece

Larry King · #17 Posted **Jan 20, 2015, 2:21 PM**

If the fracking business is going to die then I guess this isn't happening - not an expert but as far as I know.. fracking doesn't make much sense when oil is <50 or so per barrell

TexasPlaya · #18 Posted **Jan 21, 2015, 4:13 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

If the fracking business is going to die then I guess this isn't happening - not an expert but as far as I know.. fracking doesn't make much sense when oil is <50 or so per barrell

Fracking isn't dead unless the world stops growing as it's a temporary slump.

As per the OP, Philly can certainly become a regional energy hub but like the Bay Area, Houston is where the talent and brains are (not to mention the infrastructure).

nergie · #19 Posted **Jan 23, 2015, 12:14 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenmore

I work for a large engineering consulting agency and i'd estimate 60%+ of my billing was related to hydraulic fracturing...it's a puff piece

And I work for a large oil/petrochemical technology licensing company what is your point? I am aware of projects that have been announced for Marcus Hook, Tiaoga and other parts of E. Coast. Philadelphia is key given there continues to be overseas demand for NGLs. Petrochemical business is loving low feedstock and energy costs.

nergie · #20 Posted **Jan 23, 2015, 12:26 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasPlaya

Fracking isn't dead unless the world stops growing as it's a temporary slump.

As per the OP, Philly can certainly become a regional energy hub but like the Bay Area, Houston is where the talent and brains are (not to mention the infrastructure).

Yet the Marcellus and Utica are booming, NGLs and the easiest route off shore is Philly. Furthermore major pipelines with lower tolls such as Mariner West, Mariner East I, existing, are MEII will move liquids and gas through E. Coast. Cove Pt, MD is export terminal, another will be Marcus Hook, PA, third possibly in Tiaoga. Yes Houston is O&G capital, but several large Midstream players driving the shale boom are based outside of Houston. Markwest, DCP in Denver. Sunoco Logistics in Philly. Several more in Houston. Mont Belvieu is NGL capital, but Philly can act in similar fashion in the NE