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  #401  
Old Posted Jul 19, 2017, 7:47 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by kevinbottawa View Post
There's a big chance this whole thing will fail, but what if this Moose plan actually works? This could be a Made in Ottawa model that other cities imitate- "Property-Powered Rail" (just visited their website). Either way, I commend them for thinking outside the box and actually doing something.
Ironically, Ottawa is about the worst possible place to establish proof of concept for "property powered rail." The rail network is highly degraded, road access for rural exurbs is relatively good and housing costs are relatively low.
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  #402  
Old Posted Jul 19, 2017, 9:44 PM
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Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
I agree with your overall point, but a double tracked line has a lot of capacity (service as frequent as every few minutes) and this would be maybe an hourly service. On the Via line, even existing infrastructure might be workable of the moose trains ran during the gaps in via service.
It's more that Moose would be stopping in way more places, which would mean that Moose trains would be "blocking the line" when stopped. VIA wouldn't want to have to deal with that. At minimum 3 tracks would be needed at stations.

Running in gaps between VIA trains might be feasible between Ottawa and Alexandria but definitely not between Ottawa and Smiths Falls where VIA currently uses pretty much all the available track time.. VIA's up to nearly 20 trains a day now, on a single track, with lots of compound schedule delays from other segments of the network making any sort of gap scheduling a logistical nightmare.
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  #403  
Old Posted Jul 19, 2017, 11:06 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by 1overcosc View Post
It's more that Moose would be stopping in way more places, which would mean that Moose trains would be "blocking the line" when stopped. VIA wouldn't want to have to deal with that. At minimum 3 tracks would be needed at stations.

Running in gaps between VIA trains might be feasible between Ottawa and Alexandria but definitely not between Ottawa and Smiths Falls where VIA currently uses pretty much all the available track time.. VIA's up to nearly 20 trains a day now, on a single track, with lots of compound schedule delays from other segments of the network making any sort of gap scheduling a logistical nightmare.
There are are no trains from Toronto hitting Smiths Falls until about 10:30 and only 2 westbound trains in the morning rush hour so morning rush hour has lots of gap. Evening could be a challenge but there are only 2 trains in each direction in the whole rush hour period, so it could probably be done with a little planning.
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  #404  
Old Posted Jul 19, 2017, 11:45 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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So after putting in several billion for LRT on the Ottawa side and hundreds of millions for BRT on the Gatineau side, the provincial and municipal authorities are supposed to encourage tens of thousands of residents to move to these small towns to make sure MOOSE has a customer base?

Yeah, that's happening...../s
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  #405  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 7:59 AM
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Originally Posted by kevinbottawa View Post
There's a big chance this whole thing will fail, but what if this Moose plan actually works? This could be a Made in Ottawa model that other cities imitate- "Property-Powered Rail" (just visited their website). Either way, I commend them for thinking outside the box and actually doing something.
I agree. There are definitely some unanswered questions in their proposal, but it's refreshing to see someone think of something new and to invest their time and energy in it. We spend so much time on this forum bellyaching that nothing innovative ever comes our way, but it would seem that as soon as someone does propose something, we can only think of why it can't/won't/shouldn't work.

That's not to say that it will work - I still have my reservations. But can we just appreciate for one second that something - anything - exciting was proposed regardless of its likelihood?
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  #406  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 10:53 AM
roger1818 roger1818 is offline
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Originally Posted by 1overcosc View Post
It's more that Moose would be stopping in way more places, which would mean that Moose trains would be "blocking the line" when stopped. VIA wouldn't want to have to deal with that. At minimum 3 tracks would be needed at stations.
VIA is able to share double track with GO in Toronto and I don't see MOOSE being much different. If a MOOSE train is stopped at a station, VIA uses the other track. VIA owns the track so they can tell any oncoming MOOSE trains to wait for the VIA train to pass.

Quote:
Running in gaps between VIA trains might be feasible between Ottawa and Alexandria but definitely not between Ottawa and Smiths Falls where VIA currently uses pretty much all the available track time.. VIA's up to nearly 20 trains a day now, on a single track, with lots of compound schedule delays from other segments of the network making any sort of gap scheduling a logistical nightmare.
With single track you are correct, but IF MOOSE pays to double track the line, there will be more than enough capacity. Double track provides significantly more than double the capacity of single track.

I'm a huge MOOSE skeptic but the Smiths Falls subdivision is actually one of the more feasible routes. They might even be able to get VIA to split the cost of double tracking it. They have stated a willingness to work with regional transportations services. The bigger issue will be the Canadian Northern Ontario Railway Federal Bridge as it will be much more expensive to replace and I believe VIA doesn't own it (I gather CN does).
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  #407  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 4:25 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by Aylmer View Post
I agree. There are definitely some unanswered questions in their proposal, but it's refreshing to see someone think of something new and to invest their time and energy in it. We spend so much time on this forum bellyaching that nothing innovative ever comes our way, but it would seem that as soon as someone does propose something, we can only think of why it can't/won't/shouldn't work.

That's not to say that it will work - I still have my reservations. But can we just appreciate for one second that something - anything - exciting was proposed regardless of its likelihood?
Except to the extent that pipe dreams distract from potentially more realistic proposals (commuter trains to Barrhaven, extension of the trillium line, etc).
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  #408  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 7:53 PM
zzptichka zzptichka is offline
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The only realistic scenario I can see for MOOSE is one line running from Smith Falls to Alexandria with connections to BRT at Fallowfield, O-Train at Confederation stn and Confederation line at Tremblay using only VIA tracks.
This way they might even get the City on board.
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  #409  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 9:56 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by zzptichka View Post
The only realistic scenario I can see for MOOSE is one line running from Smith Falls to Alexandria with connections to BRT at Fallowfield, O-Train at Confederation stn and Confederation line at Tremblay using only VIA tracks.
This way they might even get the City on board.
Via used to sell commuter passes for Smiths Falls and Alexandria (maybe they still do). Not sure there was much uptake.
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  #410  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2017, 10:01 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
Via used to sell commuter passes for Smiths Falls and Alexandria (maybe they still do). Not sure there was much uptake.
It was posted in another thread that they do sell monthly passes.
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