Calgary Roads

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by nik8063

However, overall I just don't think it's a great idea. This is a major cross town roadway, summer or not. I don't even drive anymore and I think this would suck.

Look at it this way, how is this any worse than the closures of both centre street and 6th avenue for construction? This will still allow traffic, be it only 1 lane each way.

Or how is this any different than 9th, 10th, 11th, and 12th avenues with all the lanes closed for construction for the last 3 or more years? Traffic is still flowing. This closure is going to 'restrict' traffic (not shut it out entirely) for 5 days in the entire year!

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Look at it this way, how is this any worse than the closures of both centre street and 6th avenue for construction? This will still allow traffic, be it only 1 lane each way.

Emphasis mine. Normally my first instinct is to scoff at these ideas, especially in a city with such poor east-west road coverage, but...

THE ROAD ISN'T CLOSING.

On a Saturday this would be insanity but Sundays are usually pretty quiet on Memorial. I'd be inclined to agree that 2 lanes could handle all the traffic.

[canlefty]

^still, it's an exercise in redundancy...pointless redundancy.

The pathway is right there, and even worse, for that stretch of memorial, there is a decent embankment between the road and the pathway / view of the river... whomever chooses to stray off onto the road will be strolling through a barren concrete "pit" in the middle of a divided roadway... I really don't understand the appeal.

I've lived all 23 years of my life in Hillhurst, during that time i've never had the desire to walk about in the middle of memorial when the pathway is right there, and you can actually see the river from it. (and just so the Druh lovers don't come bearing down on me, I am a full supporter of the ped. bridges)

What I want to see done (as i've already said in this thread), is for Kensington road to be closed off for a time (say, 8am to 6pm) on Sunday. Now, there's an area I would want to walk around in, because hey, there's actually something there to walk to.

I understand Ms.Farrhel's (sp?) "argument" is that she wants Calgary to "become more active" or something to that effect --- Isn't that what the pathway there, directly adjacent to memorial, for???

Why not push for an expansion / refurbishment of the pathway on the North bank like on the south / eauclaire side. At least then it would look attractive, not a disconnected road way in a valley.

[MichaelS]

^ Exactly. I don't think the issue is weather the existing traffic is too much for only 2 lanes. Probably won't be an issue. I think more people have an issue with this as there is little to no benefit from what most can see. Is the pathway really so crowded that you simply can't fit one more person on it? Will people actually choose to walk down an empty half of a major roadway, simply because they can? I just don't see the reasoning for wanting to do this in this location.

[frinkprof]

Nevermind.

[h0twired]

I can see the closed lanes of Memorial being dead with the exception of the occasional cyclist avoiding the bike path.

I highly doubt that it will become some pedestrian paradise. Most would probably still rather walk along the shops of Kensington or along the river.

[Bigtime]

Does anyone really think if the plan was to close down 10th street in Kensington suddenly everyone would be all for it? Because in that scenario the ENTIRE road would be closed (that sound you hear is a thousand keyboards angrily typing responses about "social engineering, silly hall, McIvor for mayor, etc" on comment sections of online news everywhere).

McIvor would still have his panties in a knot and be pandering to John & Jane Q. Public with his remarks like "I'm all for active living, but not in this case.".

Tell me, when has McIvor actually done more than just flap his gums to get yet another soundbite on the news or quote in the papers?

The business' in Kensington would absolutely flip out about how this will destroy them once and for all.

So we close down 2 of 4 lanes, and it turns out to be quite popular. Perhaps that will allow the city some leverage to actually try and close down an entire street like 10th next summer on Sundays? Or it is a collossal failure and we learn from it and move on with a different try somewhere else next time.

You have to start with something, and at least this strikes a balance of still keeping a roadway open at the same time.

[frinkprof]

Nevermind.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

P.S. I hate to be "that guy," but you habitually misspell McIver as McIvor.

Woops! Thanks for the heads up!

As for this closure I will definitely head over there with wife and baby in stroller to see how this works out.

[reflexzero]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

8 months of winter? Really? According to Envrionment Canada and their historical data from 1971-2000 we have 7 months of the year with an average temperature above 0 degrees. Call it what you want, but I am tired of the cop-out excuse of "Calgary is in winter all the time".

Agreed, Environment Canada doesn't lie, but being above freezing doesn't mean basking in warmth either. It's Calgary, and it usually gets miserable just in time for the weekend. I love that wind that picks up all the dirt from construction and blows it directly into my eyeballs.

Not to mention the green grass turns brown and dead from oppressive heat in July, and the leaves start falling off the trees in August.

[Bigtime]

How can I cheer you up buddy?

[mooky]

Not sure whether this goes under the airport thread or roads, sorta deals with both so I will cross-post. I love how in the embedded video the airport aurthorities basic understanding of the situation is that they are in the business of aircraft, not roads. Now that's how to be a good neighbor and community partner

http://www.metronews.ca/calgary/loca...-expansion-ceo

----------------------------------------
Expansion plans for the Calgary International Airport will fly despite continued calls to build a commuter tunnel beneath a future runway, stakeholders were told yesterday.

Garth Atkinson, president and CEO of the Calgary Airport Authority, told those who attended the airport’s annual general meeting that it’s still full steam ahead on a $3-billion, 10-year expansion that will include a new runway, taxiways and a new terminal.

And despite northeast Ald. Jim Stevenson’s push to extend Airport Trail by tunnelling beneath the proposed four-kilometre run­way to ensure communities aren’t cut off by the planned closure of Barlow Trail, Atkinson said the expansion won’t be delayed.

“The time for this has come and gone — we’re spending money so any change now would set us back and cost us money,” he said.

“I’m not personally aware of any interest in committing public funds to this project.”

Atkinson said the major parts of the expansion, the new runway and international terminal, are set to begin construction in 2011 with completion expected in 2014.

Stevenson said he hasn’t given on up on hope for getting the access built and is optimistic that the provincial and federal governments will chip in when the true cost to provide a temporary solution is sussed out.

“I’ve never been as optimistic as I am right now,” he said noting a report on the full cost of a temporary extension of Airport Trail will come to a city committee in June.

“The plan we have right now, to build three bridges at the runway and taxiways will only cost in the neighbourhood of $100 million to $150 million and we can do that.”

Stevenson said he’s hoping to get answers about matching the city’s already committed $50 million from the other orders of government by the fall.

SHAWN LOGAN
METRO CALGARY
April 16, 2009

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by mooky

I love how in the embedded video the airport aurthorities basic understanding of the situation is that they are in the business of aircraft, not roads. Now that's how to be a good neighbor and community partner

I disagree, the parallel runway has been on the books for at least 2 decades now. It was only a matter of time until it needed to go ahead, all levels of government are guilty of not preparing for this to happen.

I don't want to see the Airport Authority have to foot a bunch of the bill for a tunnel if it is just going to hit us in a higher Airport fee, landing fees, etc.

[mooky]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I disagree, the parallel runway has been on the books for at least 2 decades now. It was only a matter of time until it needed to go ahead, all levels of government are guilty of not preparing for this to happen.

I don't want to see the Airport Authority have to foot a bunch of the bill for a tunnel if it is just going to hit us in a higher Airport fee, landing fees, etc.

Well I never said they should, but to be so dismissive on their part is sort of a big F-U to the area. I mean taking out Barlow really limits the access points to that whole area of town.

[Bigtime]

They are not doing anything to the surrounding community, all they are doing is going forward with plans that have been on the books for 20+ years. Are we to expect them to stop everything while we wait for the different government levels to squabble over the funding even further?

The airport is a huge economy generator. For example UPS has started building a new processing warehouse on the field, we need to expand to keep competitive and continue to generate a positive to the Calgary economy.

They are dismissive because they are tired of waiting around for the other parties to figure something out. Time to start building.

[reflexzero]

Well, if Metis trail was finished to Country Hills Blvd, it would help with the Barlow closure.

Those of us who use 36st NE north of 80th Ave to get to Country Hills know it looks like a goat trail that was carpet bombed, and it probably can't sustain much more heavy traffic than it already does without exploding.

I think a tunnel would be cool at the airport, very Dallas Fort Worth International, but probably not on the radar of all levels of government until it becomes a huge afterthought.

[MalcolmTucker]

Not having airport trail go east bound saves the airport a ton of cash in not building a crazy system of spaghetti ramps for terminal access. In fact, they won't really need any ramps at all, and will be able to eliminate traffic lights with only one bridge, south bound Barlow into the terminal.

[mooky]

Would the proposed tunnel be cut-n-cover or require a hole-boring machine? I assume if it's done in conjunction with the expansion a cut-n-cover would work.

I'm just worried that the funding won't come through in time for cut-n-cover and the hole-boring will be deemed too expensive after-the-fact, and yet another project in this city gets completed, but not the way that is most efficient in the long run.

I'm in no way blaming the airport authority, with the amount of traffic it sees on a daily basis another runway is a must in the near future or else we risk losing air business. How much consultation has the airport authority done with all levels of gov't on this matter? I have no clue, maybe you know Bigtime?

[mersar]

Originally Posted by reflexzero

Well, if Metis trail was finished to Country Hills Blvd, it would help with the Barlow closure.

The latest plan I've heard is that it should be completed between 80th and Country Hills by this fall in some form (whether only 2 or all 4 lanes is likely the question). The section between Country Hills and 128th is half open already with traffic running on the NB lanes and the SB lanes are paved but not open, and they are nearly ready to start the final work before paving 128th to 144th and the interchange at Stoney. South of CHB they've already done the earthwork for a ways, I suspect all the way to the edge of the one property that the city was forced to expropriate.

[freeweed]

The airport has some responsibility here, period.

If this was a competitive environment (ie: we had 2 competing airports in Calgary) you damned well better believe they wouldn't let a good chunk of the city cut be so cut off from getting to their facilities. No access = people just go to the competition.

Having a monopoly means they can literally say "FU" to the NE, and I'm sure legally they're entitled to do that as well, but it's a pretty a-hole move.

Sadly, everyone wants to only follow the letter of the law these days. Sorry, airport folks, but a LOT has changed in 20 years.

That being said, the City/Province/Feds are being completely stupid here. Billions are being thrown around like candy right now, I'm sure we could come up with a reasonable way for half of a city to access Canada's 3rd biggest airport (Montreal's Hollywood accounting aside).