Canada's Tallest U/C #11 - #30

[wild wild west]

Jeremy's numbers sound about right to me. As I recall Calgary has slightly less office space than Ottawa, and Vancouver a bit less than Calgary.

Anyways, not to start a debate or anything - my point is that Ottawa is a pretty big office market and as such, has probably been screwed by height limits more than any other large Canadian city.

[Rusty van Reddick]

Originally Posted by Boris2k7

Re: Height limits, etc.

Here in Calgary, we do not have height limits or view cones. What we do have is a shadowing bylaw (for the Bow River Pathway) as well as density restrictions (mainly FAR).

Actually Boris if you can get your hands on the Bankview area plan (the one that resulted in Nimmons Park closing 19th Ave at 17 St), there are "view corridors" that do limit heights and restrict new structures to R5 or whatever. These zoning rules are indeed to preserve views, and I'd be surprised if there aren't similar ones in other hilly parts of town. The tallest buildings in Bankview are just 6 storeys.

[craner]

I really hate height limits
(Generally speaking)

[Boris2k7]

Originally Posted by furrycanuck

Actually Boris if you can get your hands on the Bankview area plan (the one that resulted in Nimmons Park closing 19th Ave at 17 St), there are "view corridors" that do limit heights and restrict new structures to R5 or whatever. These zoning rules are indeed to preserve views, and I'd be surprised if there aren't similar ones in other hilly parts of town. The tallest buildings in Bankview are just 6 storeys.

Well I'll be damned...

Guess I'll have to dig out a few ARP's and look through them...

EDIT: And surely enough...



Although, it seems to me that these view rules are entirely discretionary on the part of the approving authority. In other words, they don't seem to be "hard" rules like you would find in the Land Use Bylaw...

6) View and Urban Design Considerations
a) In order to maximize the use of view
potential, the Approving Authority:
• should require information on how the
building responds to potential views. Figure 4 shows all sites in Bankview
which have a view potential.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by goodlookin'

who says I'm talking about floorspace

Sorry, very poorly worded by me, what I meant was that I wasn't talking about an entire floor being 10 feet higher than allowable, but a little antenna like structure being 10 feet higher... just to clarify my poorly worded statement.

Originally Posted by goodlookin'

No dude ... you're missing the point. The list's cutoff would undoubtably be 30 to 50m higher were it not for Toronto fear of heights. The whole, "getting chopped down to a level that is still in the top 30" is nonsense. While I could see more 40 to 50 storey buildings in Vancouver were the limits lifted, I really don't see that many more 50 to 70 storey buildings.

I guess thats where we differ, I see the demand in Vancouver allowing for many 50+ storey buildings. I mean just look at what happened to the few sites that were allowed to go higher than the max height through the higher buildings policy, immediately two buildings donated enough money and jumped through the cities rings to be allowed to build to the new maximum height well over 50 storeys. The demand is here so I do not know why you dont think they would not be built... afterall it is profitable to keep building high until you it 800 ft or so depending on land prices, and considering Vancouver's incredibly high land prices I see this threshold being an even higher height.

[WhipperSnapper]

800 feet is far above the threshold you're talking about especially with the floorplates you are so accustomed to in Vancouver. In Toronto, the Aura development is just another 1000+ unit project (albeit in one tower) however, in Vancouver, it would represent a significant portion of the downtown market.

Believe what you want, I'm done with this




Ottawa definitely has suffered the most

[noodlenoodle]

Originally Posted by goodlookin'

Ottawa definitely has suffered the most

Edmonton continues to suffer under the ceiling imposed by YXD.

[WhipperSnapper]

Edmonton continues to suffer under the ceiling imposed by YXD.

No offense, but "suffer" is a little over exaggerated. I doubt the Edmonton skyline would look all that different than it does today based solely on the close proximity of YXD.

[wild wild west]

Developers in Edmonton can build over 100' higher than in Ottawa, even though they have less downtown office space and a smaller inner-city residential population.

[240glt]

I doubt the Edmonton skyline would look all that different than it does today based solely on the close proximity of YXD.

In five years it could make a big difference

[craner]

Originally Posted by 240glt

In five years it could make a big difference

Any specifics ??

[240glt]

Well Procura has a new tallest in the plans, plus we've got a ready-made podium for Manulife 2, which was originally slated to be taller than Manu 1 (which is at the overlay ceiling), There are condos to the west of the CBD which could go a lot taller if allowed to, not to mention future developments as the city grows

[craner]

thanks man.

[caltrane74]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

I guess thats where we differ, I see the demand in Vancouver allowing for many 50+ storey buildings. I mean just look at what happened to the few sites that were allowed to go higher than the max height through the higher buildings policy, immediately two buildings donated enough money and jumped through the cities rings to be allowed to build to the new maximum height well over 50 storeys. The demand is here so I do not know why you dont think they would not be built... afterall it is profitable to keep building high until you it 800 ft or so depending on land prices, and considering Vancouver's incredibly high land prices I see this threshold being an even higher height.

Because of the Natural Beauty of Vancouver, I don't think you'll be seeing many more "talls" after Shangri La, Ritz and Wall Centre. - It would really clutter the view of the mountains. Vancouver will still build many between 40 and 50 storeys though. Shangri La is a one time exception to the rule, and I doubt we'll be on this forum long enough to see another building go up that is any taller.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by goodlookin'

800 feet is far above the threshold you're talking about especially with the floorplates you are so accustomed to in Vancouver. In Toronto, the Aura development is just another 1000+ unit project (albeit in one tower) however, in Vancouver, it would represent a significant portion of the downtown market.

Believe what you want, I'm done with this

Exactly, Vancouver towers dont have to have alot of units in them to be tall... ie Ritz Carlton with only 123 suites and 127 much smaller hotel suites in 61 floors. Ludacrisly high real estate rates make these towers financially viable, as condos in Vancouver go for much more than those in Toronto. This is especially true for those suites with unobstructed views located in tall towers.

A lack of space on the downtown penincula also makes building tall towers much more realistic and financially viable, as there is almost no space left for towers, so those which are built can be sold at a premium. In fact I would go so far to say that the developers of all the double towers seen in vancouver could make more profit on one tall building on the site, than 2 half sized buildings due to the premium on view spaces in the Vancouver market.

I dont understand how you can see it so impossible that vancouver can support tall towers... recent projects have told us the economics work and the demand is there...

But you can believe what you want.

[caltrane74]

The economics and the demand support tall towers in Vancouver.

The culture and politics in Vancouver do not.

[LeftCoaster]

^precisely

[Maldive]

Apparently Hamilton has done a superficial audit of The Harry (Harry Stinson) and will be giving him the boot.

In the meantime, Harry apparently has found a "view cone" legal gap and will be announcing Vancouver's "Sapphire" as soon as financing is finalized.

[WhipperSnapper]

Ritz Carlton with only 123 suites and 127 much smaller hotel suites in 61 floors.

Yeah ... that an average condo development in Vancouver

[WhipperSnapper]

The economics and the demand support tall towers in Vancouver.

60+ storeys though!?! maybe one or two every development cycle but no where near the number Toronto's market could support if developers were given free reign