SAN FRANCISCO BAY AREA: Transit/Transportation News

[CyberEric]

I thought this article in the Chronicle was interesting:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...CPJI.DTL&tsp=1

[San Frangelino]

i hope this hasn't already been posted somewhere, but I found some very interesting maps on this website http://wilshirevermont.com/

From:http://wilshirevermont.com/2010/10/0...san-francisco/


From:http://wilshirevermont.com/2010/05/1...as-dense-core/


From:http://wilshirevermont.com/2010/12/2...n-metro-style/

[CyberEric]

Wow, that's pretty cool, thanks for posting. I would love to see even some of that happen. Mainly the North-South stuff, and the Geary line.

[drifting sun]

Wow, BART is getting ambitious, did they recently report something like a $20 million surplus? I like the idea of a north/south BART line that runs between Inner and Outer Sunset, and then swings over to the financial district. What potential impact in the eyes of the public does this put upon the already maligned central subway MUNI is building? Would the City benefit from MUNI halting any future plans and let BART build and maintain any subway lines on the peninsula from here on out? Why does the first map show the stretch of N-Judah between Van Ness and 19th/Judah as "proposed" and not existing?

Edit: I see, they are proposing to bury that whole length?

[electricron]

Originally Posted by drifting sun

Wow, BART is getting ambitious, did they recently report something like a $20 million surplus? Would the City benefit from MUNI halting any future plans and let BART build and maintain any subway lines on the peninsula from here on out?

No! They wouldn't because there is no guarantee BART would actually build the lines MUNI wants to build. BART is a Regional transit agency, not a Municipal one.
How would San Francisco feel about their BART taxes going to support a streetcar line less than 2 miles in length in Richmond or Oakland? They wouldn't. Just turning the situation around we arrive at the truth.
BART should continue to be a Regional transit agency while Muni should continue as a Municipal one. Let Oakland and Richmond fund their own Municipal buses and trams.

[drifting sun]

We aren't talking about streetcar lines. BART is all about heavy rail, but just because it is a regional system, does not mean it can't be useful to commuters on the peninsula in the areas that it passes through. I have ridden both MUNI and BART multiple times, BART had far superior service where it went (despite nasty car interiors). Maybe MUNI should stick with street level transit (buses and street car/light rail) to fill in the gaps between BART's heavy rail lines. Let BART do what it has proven to be better at, I say.

[electricron]

Originally Posted by drifting sun

Maybe MUNI should stick with street level transit (buses and street car/light rail) to fill in the gaps between BART's heavy rail lines. Let BART do what it has proven to be better at, I say.

Why? Don't MUNI's existing streetcar lines run in subways in part already? One of the advantages of light rail transit is that it is flexible, it can operate at grade in streets, and above and below grade. Restricting MUNI to light rail lines that only run at grade is taking all the flexibility they need away to design, build, and operate efficient light rail lines.

[drifting sun]

Because the at-grade portions of the MUNI lines are a big part of what hinders the underground sections, and the whole thing, from operating efficiently and reliably. I like where MUNI goes, the N-Judah is a useful line, as is its parallel sister line, but these need to be buried for a longer length to avoid the intersection snarls at street level that back stuff up all the way to Van Ness, sometimes. I was told that due to an overriding state requirement that is preferential to automobiles, intersection preemption by the light rail (something that I think would have solved a lot of the problems) is not going to happen. I was thinking if BART ever wanted to build a couple more heavy rail subway lines through the peninsula, let them. As to your claims of the inherent flexibility of a hybrid buried/surface light rail route, I have seen it work out fine in other cities, but it doesn't seem to in S.F. After decades of MUNI fumbling with these chronic issues with no real solution, maybe it is time for a bigger change.

[fflint]

Just so everyone is on the same page, those maps above are not from BART or Muni--they are fantasy maps, and good ones, but they're *not* proposals or plans.

[CyberEric]

Originally Posted by fflint

Just so everyone is on the same page, those maps above are not from BART or Muni--they are fantasy maps, and good ones, but they're *not* proposals or plans.

Yeah, I appreciate the conversation but these are not real proposals.

I love that people are interested and starting these conversations though, we need to work towards better public transit here.

Does anyone know a good place to see the stance the mayoral candidates have on transportation?

[drifting sun]

Well, Bevan Dufty has something on his webpage, supporting MUNI. It is not really detailed with any ideas of how to improve MUNI, but he does claim that he, himself is a frequent rider of the MUNI subway.
Even though I've been talking up BART, I do think MUNI has great potential, that is why it is so painful to watch as it continually suffers from so many operational problems. I just think that whichever agency is better poised to improve downtown's public transit situation in the near future, should be afforded the opportunity.

Edit: I am planning to make a move to San Francisco in less than ~2 years, which is why I am so interested in the public transit scene there.

Edit2: If you go to the link below the YouTube video on Dufty's site, there is some more information on his ideas related to MUNI. I read through and it didn't feel like to me that he was merely paying lip service to MUNI related issues; he sounds serious about this.

Edit3: Oooohhhh.....he supports the Central Subway, does that mean the Save Muni folks aren't going to like him?

[Clevelumbus]

So many transit agencies in the Bay Area.

I have the most experience with:

BART: Almost perfect from where I live, can get anywhere I would want to go easily. Will be even better when they get late night trains and the OAK connection. Would love some type of express train, but this requires more tracks. Wish they would offer discounts for regular commuters, it is an expensive system to ride (compared to similar systems).

AC Transit: Love the 1R for quick local trips. Hopefully Oakland/AC Transit will develop some streetcars/bus rapid transit in the future. Seems like you can get most anywhere by bus, and the 800/Transbay is awesome for getting back from 'The City' after BART shuts down.

MUNI: Haven't used too often, and don't really see the mass reliability issues I hear about because of that. I think the T and Judah line's are really good for getting places BART can't.

[northbay]

sign the petition in support of smart and in opposition of any recall efforts!:

http://www.signon.org/sign/decline-t...b&r_by=1286081

[peanut gallery]

Done......

[fflint]

Capitol Corridor trains chalk up record ridership

By Tony Bizjak
The Sacramento Bee
By Tony Bizjak

Tuesday, Oct. 18, 2011 - 12:00 am | Page 2B

More than 1.7 million passengers rode the Capitol Corridor inter-city trains in the last year, breaking ridership and revenue records, officials said Monday....

http://www.sacbee.com/2011/10/18/398...#ixzz1b7DhXAlW
------------------------------------------

These figures work out to about 6,500 Cap Corridor riders each work day.

[CyberEric]

Some interesting news from Curbed about new bike lanes on Polk and Valencia streets.
http://sf.curbed.com/archives/2011/1...eader_comments

[drifting sun]

Originally Posted by CyberEric

Some interesting news from Curbed about new bike lanes on Polk and Valencia streets.
http://sf.curbed.com/archives/2011/1...eader_comments

Very intriguing. At least most of the commenters in that linked article seemed willing to offer up constructive criticism, with only a couple of "commie bicyclists are crossing the line with this one!" style comments. I am a little unsure myself if taking over the entire middle of the street will be to everyone's benefit. However, bicyclists having one main conduit through the city that they dominate on is not so bad is it, considering that everywhere else is dominated by automobiles?

[peanut gallery]

^The thing about that approach that made me scratch my head is that bicyclists will have to cross through a traffic lane to enter and exit it. I thought the preferred layout is to have bike lanes at the curb, then parking, then traffic lanes. Is this stretch of Valencia basically a bike freeway where almost everyone is passing through?

[drifting sun]

Yes, it seems like this particular design would cause a lot of confusion. I think that they should stick with what has been shown to work in countless examples, that of bike lanes between the parking lane and sidewalk, with some sort of barrier streetside. Motorists just need to be reminded that there is a bike lane to their right when they (the motorist) wants to turn right. As for when a bicyclist needs to make a left hand turn, well, that one isn't as easy. The safe way would be for the person on the bike to cross the intersection (still going straight) make their way to the curb on the right hand side, swing 90 degrees to their left (paying close attention to pedestrians milling about on the same corner), and wait for the light to change their way, whereupon they either get into the formerly-perpendicular-with-respect-to-themselves separated bike lane, or, if there is not a bike lane going in the other direction, check for traffic and get out into the roadway.

[fflint]

Originally Posted by drifting sun

Yes, it seems like this particular design would cause a lot of confusion. I think that they should stick with what has been shown to work in countless examples, that of bike lanes between the parking lane and sidewalk, with some sort of barrier streetside. Motorists just need to be reminded that there is a bike lane to their right when they (the motorist) wants to turn right. As for when a bicyclist needs to make a left hand turn, well, that one isn't as easy. The safe way would be for the person on the bike to cross the intersection (still going straight) make their way to the curb on the right hand side, swing 90 degrees to their left (paying close attention to pedestrians milling about on the same corner), and wait for the light to change their way, whereupon they either get into the formerly-perpendicular-with-respect-to-themselves separated bike lane, or, if there is not a bike lane going in the other direction, check for traffic and get out into the roadway.

I'm not sure what works in Denver, but on the Valencia corridor--which I bike daily--the current parking-lane adjacent bike lane has *not* been shown to work. Motorists constantly shut down the bike lane to bikes--the CA and SF moving violation motorists call "double parking"--and the SFPD is too auto-centric to enforce the laws against that, so cyclists are *already* being forced into mixed traffic. There's no alternative to that mixing, given the widespread lawbreaking by motorists, but at least with the new proposal cars won't just slow, stop, and shut down the bike lane like they do now.

This is how a cyclist really experiences today's Valencia Street "bike lane"--all of these were taken on Valencia:


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12299.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_17385.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_13253.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12314.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12642.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12301.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12292.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...ost_12159.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...post_8971.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...post_2728.jpeg


http://d1nud0pthq5kwl.cloudfront.net...post_2727.jpeg

We clearly need infrastructural improvement--because SFPD refuses to keep the bike lanes open to bikes.