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  #161  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 2:08 AM
vanlaw vanlaw is offline
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Would be nice, but there's still a shiny new(ish) arena in Kansas City without any major tenant. My money is on the next NHL and NBA relocations going there.
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  #162  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 3:23 AM
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I agree; I think the city fathers (and mothers) of KC will gladly bend over backwards to try to get a tenant in the new Sprint Arena. As far as Vancouver, I've said previously that Vancouver could definitely support an NBA team. Having said that, however, I think that Seattle--with its rich NBA history--deserves a team before Vancouver.
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  #163  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 6:30 PM
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The NBA has taken over ownership of the New Orleans Hornets and are looking for new owner(s).

The NBA has announced they purchased the New Orleans Hornets from owner George Shinn. The Hornets have struggled financially, with Shinn actively shopping the team locally without any success before finally selling to the league on Monday. The NBA will now move to sell the Hornets to a new owner.

The NBA would like to keep the franchise in New Orleans, but as we’ve seen in the past, it could all be lip-service. Perhaps we could see a bid coming from Vancouver.
Wouldn't that be quite something if Vancouver received a bid from the Aquilini's? They have a stadium ready to go, and have received upgrades since the Aquilini's took over. Seattle has a richer history for sure, and they probably do deserve another team before Vancouver does, but they need a new stadium. That's the reason the team left in the first place.
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  #164  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 9:03 PM
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Part of me doesn't want NBA back in Vancouver because well, 1. I hate NBA, 2. the NBA right now seems to be a dying sport, and 3. when the Grizzlies played at Roger's Arena formerly GM Place, the ice sucked worst than it doesnow due to the fiddling and converting they had to do over and above what they do already for concerts.

Another part though would like to see an NBA back in Vancouver to stick it to everyone that took the Grizzlies away in the first place and to have another pro sports team in Vancouver.

I don't think it will work though not because of support levels by fans but because of the demographic of your average NBA player. It's much different than Hockey. Hockey players for the most part come from Canada or Europe, so are ok playing up here since we stereotypically tend to be more open to other cultures. NBA players come from a very different world and while Toronto is one of the largest cities in all of North American and much closer in feel to big US markets than Vancouver is, even they have problems getting players to go there.

NBA players want to be in New York, Florida, or LA driving giant Escalades with chrome rims and bling around their necks. Unless they have a culture change, I don't see it working up here. It didn't work in Seattle with the Sonics, what makes people think it would work in Vancouver with roughly similar populations and lifestyles as you find in Seattle.

I dunno.
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  #165  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 9:42 PM
SpikePhanta SpikePhanta is offline
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Originally Posted by jhausner View Post
Part of me doesn't want NBA back in Vancouver because well, 1. I hate NBA, 2. the NBA right now seems to be a dying sport, and 3. when the Grizzlies played at Roger's Arena formerly GM Place, the ice sucked worst than it doesnow due to the fiddling and converting they had to do over and above what they do already for concerts.

Another part though would like to see an NBA back in Vancouver to stick it to everyone that took the Grizzlies away in the first place and to have another pro sports team in Vancouver.

I don't think it will work though not because of support levels by fans but because of the demographic of your average NBA player. It's much different than Hockey. Hockey players for the most part come from Canada or Europe, so are ok playing up here since we stereotypically tend to be more open to other cultures. NBA players come from a very different world and while Toronto is one of the largest cities in all of North American and much closer in feel to big US markets than Vancouver is, even they have problems getting players to go there.

NBA players want to be in New York, Florida, or LA driving giant Escalades with chrome rims and bling around their necks. Unless they have a culture change, I don't see it working up here. It didn't work in Seattle with the Sonics, what makes people think it would work in Vancouver with roughly similar populations and lifestyles as you find in Seattle.

I dunno.

We can make the ice better by installing dehumidifiers, i think.
Also remember GM place was built as a basketball arena.
The sport of basketball is growing in asia and other parts of the world, its simple, just dont draft americans with attitude.
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  #166  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2010, 9:47 PM
vanlaw vanlaw is offline
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Originally Posted by SpikePhanta View Post
its simple, just dont draft americans with attitude.
..Steve Francis - what a pouty dickhead.....

Edit: Just looked Francis up on Wikipedia. Apparently he is out of the NBA, and just signed in China. 10 year career for a 2nd overall pick??? Looks like his attitude got the best of him. Karma's a bitch. Not to mention the fact that his last stop was with the Grizzlies, and they waived him….LOL
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  #167  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 2:40 AM
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Originally Posted by vanlaw View Post
..Steve Francis - what a pouty dickhead.....

Edit: Just looked Francis up on Wikipedia. Apparently he is out of the NBA, and just signed in China. 10 year career for a 2nd overall pick??? Looks like his attitude got the best of him. Karma's a bitch. Not to mention the fact that his last stop was with the Grizzlies, and they waived him….LOL
Steve who?

Haha...jokes. anyways, i'm glad that he's out of the NBA, and it made my day when you said he was waived by the grizzlies. ah, there is justice after all. lol.
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  #168  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 2:47 AM
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Originally Posted by jhausner View Post
Part of me doesn't want NBA back in Vancouver because well, 1. I hate NBA, 2. the NBA right now seems to be a dying sport, and 3. when the Grizzlies played at Roger's Arena formerly GM Place, the ice sucked worst than it doesnow due to the fiddling and converting they had to do over and above what they do already for concerts.

Another part though would like to see an NBA back in Vancouver to stick it to everyone that took the Grizzlies away in the first place and to have another pro sports team in Vancouver.

I don't think it will work though not because of support levels by fans but because of the demographic of your average NBA player. It's much different than Hockey. Hockey players for the most part come from Canada or Europe, so are ok playing up here since we stereotypically tend to be more open to other cultures. NBA players come from a very different world and while Toronto is one of the largest cities in all of North American and much closer in feel to big US markets than Vancouver is, even they have problems getting players to go there.

NBA players want to be in New York, Florida, or LA driving giant Escalades with chrome rims and bling around their necks. Unless they have a culture change, I don't see it working up here. It didn't work in Seattle with the Sonics, what makes people think it would work in Vancouver with roughly similar populations and lifestyles as you find in Seattle.

I dunno.
I'd love to have another pro franchise come up to town, and stick it here for a long long time. There are a lot of franchises down in the states that are small markets. Really, places like Miami, NYC, LA are the only large markets in the NBA. And to be honest, I really do believe that an NBA franchise here CAN succeed. We have the fans here, and while the city never had a winning franchise (the team won a grand total of 23 games. it would've been moved had the team been anywhere else. you just don't get corporate, and fan support with THAT kind of win totals. sucks to see your team lose night after night), the fans still came out to support it. a losing vancouver grizzlies team outdrew a winning, or medicore memphis team. what does that say?

it says that this city, has NBA fans, and they loved their team when the team was here, even though they lost 50-60 games a year. SO, with having an upgraded Rogers Arena - Yeah, I think an NBA franchise would definitely work. not an expansion team, but a relocated team? yeah, it'd definitely work. and who says that we'd have to draft american players? there is plenty of growing talent in europe, and asia. draft from there.

AND, lastly, market to the chinese community. we love our basketball, and if future management is wise, they'd do the same.
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  #169  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 4:37 AM
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I would imagine that any move for another team in Vancouver would come with very heavy requirements from the league. I'm not sure the appetite would be there for them. I would not be surprised to see requirements imposed such as a 15yr no move clause with a very large financial deposit to the league to insure it. And that on top of buying an existing team and paying whatever would be required to break existing leases.
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  #170  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 6:34 AM
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I would imagine that any move for another team in Vancouver would come with very heavy requirements from the league. I'm not sure the appetite would be there for them. I would not be surprised to see requirements imposed such as a 15yr no move clause with a very large financial deposit to the league to insure it. And that on top of buying an existing team and paying whatever would be required to break existing leases.
The thing is. I don't think having a clause like that, would be a bad thing. That would give a sense of security to both the team, the city, and it's fans, that the team would be leaving. Having local ownership would not hurt, either (Aquilini's would come in play). Heavy requirements? No problem. As long as Stu Jackson's not in charge this second time around. Personally, having an NBA franchise again in this town, would be a great thing. C'mon. We'd have a star already, if New Orleans is the team to move up here. Who wouldn't want Chris Paul?
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  #171  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 6:46 AM
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Originally Posted by jhausner View Post
Part of me doesn't want NBA back in Vancouver because well, 1. I hate NBA, 2. the NBA right now seems to be a dying sport...
Totally agree - i suppose though although basketball is popular, the NBA in its current form is unwieldy and not amenable to locating in vancouver.


Quote:
it didn't work in Seattle with the Sonics, what makes people think it would work in Vancouver with roughly similar populations and lifestyles as you find in Seattle.

I dunno.
That i disagree - seattle is a larger city, with a larger corporate base than vancouver.

and they still couldn't hold onto the sonics.

That being said, it goes to the base economics of the NBA; the seattle ownership group tried to strong-arm the city to build a new arena, which the city wisely refused. and these were seattle stalwarts, like howard schultz of starbucks, when the city wouldn't go along, they sold the vaunted supersonics to OK city.
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  #172  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 9:08 AM
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Totally agree - i suppose though although basketball is popular, the NBA in its current form is unwieldy and not amenable to locating in vancouver.




That i disagree - seattle is a larger city, with a larger corporate base than vancouver.

and they still couldn't hold onto the sonics.

That being said, it goes to the base economics of the NBA; the seattle ownership group tried to strong-arm the city to build a new arena, which the city wisely refused. and these were seattle stalwarts, like howard schultz of starbucks, when the city wouldn't go along, they sold the vaunted supersonics to OK city.
The thing that Vancouver has going for them, is that they have a ready to go arena, in Rogers Arena. With some upgrades over the last few years to the stadium. It's in good shape. I hope the Aquilini's (which is the only hope of bringing an NBA franchise back here) consider it, seriously, to add to the Canucks Sports & Entertainment.
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  #173  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 5:48 PM
Zassk Zassk is offline
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As someone who actually attended a lot of Grizzlies games every year that they were here, I'd like to point out that the demographic at the NBA games in Vancouver was very different from the demographic at NHL games.

Canucks games - mostly male, mostly white, mostly adult, lots of beer sales.

Grizzlies games - more women, way more visible minorities, more children and young adults, less beer sales.

All you had to do was look at the women's washroom lineups at Grizzlies games vs. Canucks games to see that there was an obvious difference. The NBA games were drawing a different audience, a lot of market segments that simply aren't significant parts of the Canucks audience.

Then there is the TV situation: there are way more sports stations widely available today, so an NBA team could actually get competitive coverage to reach out to the casual fan, unlike the sad situation with Grizzlies broadcasting in the 90's.

Today I see way more teenagers and young adults playing recreational basketball than I did in the 1990's. At least in Richmond, there are way more outdoor basketball courts today, and way more basketball happening in gyms and community centres. Maybe that legacy belongs to the Grizzlies, or maybe it belongs to Steve Nash. But I predict that there would be more interest in NBA today here, not less, and that it would be easy to grow a following in the young generation.
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  #174  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 6:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Zassk View Post
As someone who actually attended a lot of Grizzlies games every year that they were here, I'd like to point out that the demographic at the NBA games in Vancouver was very different from the demographic at NHL games.

Canucks games - mostly male, mostly white, mostly adult, lots of beer sales.

Grizzlies games - more women, way more visible minorities, more children and young adults, less beer sales.

All you had to do was look at the women's washroom lineups at Grizzlies games vs. Canucks games to see that there was an obvious difference. The NBA games were drawing a different audience, a lot of market segments that simply aren't significant parts of the Canucks audience.

Then there is the TV situation: there are way more sports stations widely available today, so an NBA team could actually get competitive coverage to reach out to the casual fan, unlike the sad situation with Grizzlies broadcasting in the 90's.

Today I see way more teenagers and young adults playing recreational basketball than I did in the 1990's. At least in Richmond, there are way more outdoor basketball courts today, and way more basketball happening in gyms and community centres. Maybe that legacy belongs to the Grizzlies, or maybe it belongs to Steve Nash. But I predict that there would be more interest in NBA today here, not less, and that it would be easy to grow a following in the young generation.
Exactly. Thank you for those thoughts. I think, if the team marketed itself properly, it would have no problems attracting a particular, and specific crowd/following. I've always been a strong supporter of more pro franchises in this town. we have such a beautiful city, but the city itself is not a part of any big leagues, such as the MLB, or the NFL, or the NBA. Granted, we do have the NHL, and for that, we're grateful, now being owned by the Aquilini family, but I hope so too, that someone would step up and bring the NBA back to our city. I think there'd be a following for sure, especially if the team shows that it's progressing, and making strides. Unlike the Grizz of old, we didn't really have a superstar - if the Hornets were to relocate up here (I know, wishful thinking..), we'd at least have Chris Paul, who is a superstar in the making.

An NBA team would work here.
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  #175  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 7:29 PM
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And don't forget, with the Canada Line, there is now a direct pipeline between Rogers Arena and all those affluent, pro-basketball teenagers in Richmond.

If the team was owned by Aquilini, who also owns Rogers Arena and all the marketing infrastructure of the Canucks, NBA in Vancouver would be a financial slam dunk. Indeed, Aquilini would be a fool not to pursue a team. Owning multiple pro-teams that all play under a single roof, which you own as well, is the ultimate holy grail of modern sports business.

Last edited by Prometheus; Dec 9, 2010 at 7:39 PM.
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  #176  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 8:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Zassk View Post
As someone who actually attended a lot of Grizzlies games every year that they were here, I'd like to point out that the demographic at the NBA games in Vancouver was very different from the demographic at NHL games.

Canucks games - mostly male, mostly white, mostly adult, lots of beer sales.

Grizzlies games - more women, way more visible minorities, more children and young adults, less beer sales.

All you had to do was look at the women's washroom lineups at Grizzlies games vs. Canucks games to see that there was an obvious difference. The NBA games were drawing a different audience, a lot of market segments that simply aren't significant parts of the Canucks audience.

Then there is the TV situation: there are way more sports stations widely available today, so an NBA team could actually get competitive coverage to reach out to the casual fan, unlike the sad situation with Grizzlies broadcasting in the 90's.

Today I see way more teenagers and young adults playing recreational basketball than I did in the 1990's. At least in Richmond, there are way more outdoor basketball courts today, and way more basketball happening in gyms and community centres. Maybe that legacy belongs to the Grizzlies, or maybe it belongs to Steve Nash. But I predict that there would be more interest in NBA today here, not less, and that it would be easy to grow a following in the young generation.
Mostly white people at a Canucks game?! Have you been lately?
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  #177  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 9:06 PM
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And don't forget, with the Canada Line, there is now a direct pipeline between Rogers Arena and all those affluent, pro-basketball teenagers in Richmond.

If the team was owned by Aquilini, who also owns Rogers Arena and all the marketing infrastructure of the Canucks, NBA in Vancouver would be a financial slam dunk. Indeed, Aquilini would be a fool not to pursue a team. Owning multiple pro-teams that all play under a single roof, which you own as well, is the ultimate holy grail of modern sports business.
so, the question is, why wouldn't Aquilini not pursue an NBA franchise that might be in a little bit of hot water? it's a win-win situation, for him and for the city, I would think. Plus, owning two sports franchises under the arena that you own - that's a perfect situation.

Plus, I would think that the tickets for an NBA game may be more affordable (to begin with), than the Canucks. Might be more affordable for some families to go and see some live sporting entertainment.
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  #178  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Vancity View Post
Exactly. Thank you for those thoughts. I think, if the team marketed itself properly, it would have no problems attracting a particular, and specific crowd/following. I've always been a strong supporter of more pro franchises in this town. we have such a beautiful city, but the city itself is not a part of any big leagues, such as the MLB, or the NFL, or the NBA. Granted, we do have the NHL, and for that, we're grateful, now being owned by the Aquilini family, but I hope so too, that someone would step up and bring the NBA back to our city. I think there'd be a following for sure, especially if the team shows that it's progressing, and making strides. Unlike the Grizz of old, we didn't really have a superstar - if the Hornets were to relocate up here (I know, wishful thinking..), we'd at least have Chris Paul, who is a superstar in the making.
And how many of these superstars would not balk at playing here, or at least play with a big cloud of disappointment hanging over them?

Not sure the exact reason (probably varies with every one of them), but I've heard of excuses from the old Grizzlies not wanting to play here, ranging from the weather to the lack of ESPN, black community, soul food, etc.
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  #179  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Nutterbug View Post
And how many of these superstars would not balk at playing here, or at least play with a big cloud of disappointment hanging over them?

Not sure the exact reason (probably varies with every one of them), but I've heard of excuses from the old Grizzlies not wanting to play here, ranging from the weather to the lack of ESPN, black community, soul food, etc.
One word. Education. Plus, we don't necessarily have to draft players who don't want to be here. if they don't want to be here, and they've made it clear that they don't, then don't draft them. let another team draft them. pick a player from overseas. the game has come a long way globally since the last grizzlies franchise was here. players like nowitzki come to mind, yao from china, parker from france, etc. we need to educate these players. PLUS. look whose paying their salaries.

the good thing about the NBA now is that they have a development league. we can draft players who have a great deal of potential, but if they're not ready, then put them in the D league, where they can play a ton, and mature as a professional. these players can easily get ESPN from satelite dishes, or what not. that's not an excuse.
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  #180  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 11:05 PM
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One word. Education. Plus, we don't necessarily have to draft players who don't want to be here. if they don't want to be here, and they've made it clear that they don't, then don't draft them. let another team draft them.
I thought the whole idea of a draft was to fairly distribute the up-and-comers. They're supposed to work to impress, wherever they were placed, till they attained their free agent status.

This throws the whole point of a draft system out the window.
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