Atlanta|Dreaming Thread I

[Libertarian]

Although this is a dream thread, let's get real for a minute....Given all the transportation needs, the money to replace the existing downtown connector with a tunnel or cap is never ever gonna happen. What I would recommend you focus on is a tunnel or viaduct loop around the Westside under or over the RR tracks. It would originate at Brookwood and terminate at I-20 a couple miles west of the I-20 interchange. I would also like to see an eventual interstate to Huntsville which terminates about midway on this loop and feed traffic north and south. This loop would also greatly help with Falcons and GWCC traffic and overall easy access to the Westside. It would need only maybe two or three access points.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

I agree! Total tunneling is preferable, because infrastructure of significance can be built over it. Costs are high though and I don't know how much rock lies under the connector and at what depth. One can look at the MARTA tunnel at Peachtree Center to see that going deep might be quite an undertaking. I guess this is something for the techies to figure out. I think of the huge and long auto and train tunnels through mountains in Europe which managed it.

oh yes, the cost would be high, initially. but the payoff would be better than anything it might cost in dollars. also, i can't imagine it would be more difficult to drill through granite than it would be to tunnel underwater, which is what they did in boston with the big dig.

[ATLSkyPalaceOwner]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

oh yes, the cost would be high, initially. but the payoff would be better than anything it might cost in dollars.

Seriously? Geez. Possibly one of the most ignorant comments I've ever read.

[TarHeelJ]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

oh yes, the cost would be high, initially. but the payoff would be better than anything it might cost in dollars. also, i can't imagine it would be more difficult to drill through granite than it would be to tunnel underwater, which is what they did in boston with the *big dig.

*the most expensive highway project ever

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by ATLSkyPalaceOwner

Seriously? Geez. Possibly one of the most ignorant comments I've ever read.

and this is why it won't happen for another 40 years.

[thebigATL]

Any other dreams???

[smArTaLlone]

Originally Posted by Libertarian

Although this is a dream thread, let's get real for a minute....Given all the transportation needs, the money to replace the existing downtown connector with a tunnel or cap is never ever gonna happen. What I would recommend you focus on is a tunnel or viaduct loop around the Westside under or over the RR tracks. It would originate at Brookwood and terminate at I-20 a couple miles west of the I-20 interchange. I would also like to see an eventual interstate to Huntsville which terminates about midway on this loop and feed traffic north and south. This loop would also greatly help with Falcons and GWCC traffic and overall easy access to the Westside. It would need only maybe two or three access points.

I agree which is why I think something similar to what was done at 5th street where the freeway is already below grade would get the most bang for our limited transportation buck. A portion of the stretch between 17th and North could be covered to create a huge linear park.

[cabasse]

was casually discussing this with someone recently who mentioned that atlanta would be perfect if it were on an ocean. barring rapid acceleration of global warming and melting of the ice caps, that isn't happening... nor is any far fetched idea like a lake/stream in the connector, a'la cheonggyecheon.

the next best thing would have to be high speed rail to savannah, which is only be a short hop to tybee. i also dream of us cleaning up and beautifying our creeks, which seems to already be happening on a limited basis. we need to stop treating them like part of the sewer system. there's a lot of potential to enhance our natural beauty on a more intimate scale versus the grand rivers and lakes of other cities.

[thebigATL]

Originally Posted by cabasse

was casually discussing this with someone recently who mentioned that atlanta would be perfect if it were on an ocean. barring rapid acceleration of global warming and melting of the ice caps, that isn't happening... nor is any far fetched idea like a lake/stream in the connector, a'la cheonggyecheon.

the next best thing would have to be high speed rail to savannah, which is only be a short hop to tybee. i also dream of us cleaning up and beautifying our creeks, which seems to already be happening on a limited basis. we need to stop treating them like part of the sewer system. there's a lot of potential to enhance our natural beauty on a more intimate scale versus the grand rivers and lakes of other cities.

That's a good idea, but the global warming part,no if you think All these flooded Cities,means water pollution how we are going to take that unless you have a great Idea.

Oro

If you were saying a man-made real beach that will be better and we can find ways to make the waves but that's a lot of land for COA or the developers to buy for the project, and if it does happen, i'll be excited. But wouldnt this make be considered as a DRI PROJECT???

[thebigATL]

We could get a Man-made Mountain With A nice waterfall w/ a water park... We really do not have theme parks...for a tropical city I think we do....

[thebigATL]

It will be nice if we had an new signature Tower For Atlanta!!! Like I found this picture and the dream for Atlanta in 1986 it suppose to look like this in 25 years (2011)!!!
But in this photo you see that supertall tower just their, Thats what we need, but if you look at it and think about it....Dont you think that was the proposed tower that was suppose to be 2,014 ft tall (1980's proposed tower).
Also I think theres potiential for Atlanta's skyline as you already see the (Westin Plaza) (Georgia Pacific) and a few more!!! But we should go to the COA and ask to bring back the wholesale tower,what ever it was called back in business...Because that would, let me change that ""WILL"" be a great signature tower for us and would be funny to laugh at some of these developers around the world...And out do the WTC/NYC DEVELOPERS and see if they want to start building towers down here....

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by thebigATL

It will be nice if we had an new signature Tower For Atlanta!!! Like I found this picture and the dream for Atlanta in 1986 it suppose to look like this in 25 years (2011)!!!
But in this photo you see that supertall tower just their, Thats what we need, but if you look at it and think about it....Dont you think that was the proposed tower that was suppose to be 2,014 ft tall (1980's proposed tower).
Also I think theres potiential for Atlanta's skyline as you already see the (Westin Plaza) (Georgia Pacific) and a few more!!! But we should go to the COA and ask to bring back the wholesale tower,what ever it was called back in business...Because that would, let me change that ""WILL"" be a great signature tower for us and would be funny to laugh at some of these developers around the world...And out do the WTC/NYC DEVELOPERS and see if they want to start building towers down here....

that's pretty wild. however, i bet they never expected the skyline midtown has today.

when it comes to supertalls, for the most part, i think they're like a city's penis. the bigger it is, the better the city can claim it is. however, look at the cities that have the biggest towers: Shenzhen, Dubai, Taipei, Kuala Lumpur... these are not cities that have their shit together, in layman's terms. they certainly aren't the world's biggest or most important cities. for the most part, they're cities with a large impoverished population that has had some recent financial gains and is trying to prove itself.

i'd hate to see atlanta join the ranks of those cities, just to prove itself. i'd rather see atlanta grow until it actually *needs* another supertall building. to build ourselves another supertall would be like giving ourselves an undeserved trophy. we don't need another supertall for practical purposes; however, the current development is being demanded by the market and is working very well.

look at the BoA tower, for example, of a building that is tall but not needed. it looks beautiful on the skyline, and i hope it stays there for a very long time. however, it was constructed without a real need for vertical construction in the city; now a large portion of the building is completely vacant, since there are much better and cheaper locations for office space, even in the core.

hopefully in the next 10 or so years, the BoA tower will truly *deserve* its space in the atlanta skyline by filling up with tenants, and then *maybe* we can talk about another supertall. for now, i'm perfectly satisfied with the wonderful, shorter, buildings we're getting now.

[Tuckerman]

[QUOTE=bryantm3;6460277]that's pretty wild. however, i bet they never expected the skyline midtown has today.

when it comes to supertalls, for the most part, i think they're like a city's penis. the bigger it is, the better the city can claim it is. however, look at the cities that have the biggest towers: Shenzhen, Dubai, Taipei, Kuala Lumpur... these are not cities that have their shit together, in layman's terms. they certainly aren't the world's biggest or most important cities. for the most part, they're cities with a large impoverished population that has had some recent financial gains and is trying to prove itself.

Agree with most of this, Shanghai, which you didn't mention may be an exception, but even there the problems created by density and pollution are horrific. There is an old saying, well maybe not so old because we have only had skyscrapers for a century or so, "any building over 55 stories is all ego."

[gunnerjacket]

Originally Posted by thebigATL

We could get a Man-made Mountain With A nice waterfall w/ a water park... We really do not have theme parks...for a tropical city I think we do....

Perhaps instead of a waterfall we pursue a variant of the modern reflecting-pool and/or fountains theme? The new Olympic Plaza in Adler (Sochi) features the cauldron hanging over a reflecting pool with an animated Olympic ring fountain system. Basically a Bellagio pool done at 1/8 scale.

How about this: We pursue the "Green Line," the linear park space that would cover MARTA's 5 Points station and lead all the way to Phillips Arena. If that were done we could redevelop the Underground Atlanta side of Peachtree Street to feature a similarly scaled fountain and artistic feature. Maybe move the Atlanta's Olympic Cauldron there, or include an artistic tower that incorporates a light show and waterfall? The whole stretch could serve as something like Rockafeller Plaza, complete with Macy's Tree Lighting come Thanksgiving!

Originally Posted by thebigATL

It will be nice if we had an new signature Tower For Atlanta!!!

Indeed. The City lacks iconic spaces and structures, so anything to stand out would be phenomenal.

I've often suggested that we get Turner productions to develop a version of CN Tower, but with a more interactive base.

Originally Posted by bryantm3

when it comes to supertalls, for the most part, i think they're like a city's penis. the bigger it is, the better the city can claim it is. however, look at the cities that have the biggest towers: Shenzhen, Dubai, Taipei, Kuala Lumpur... these are not cities that have their shit together, in layman's terms. they certainly aren't the world's biggest or most important cities. for the most part, they're cities with a large impoverished population that has had some recent financial gains and is trying to prove itself.

i'd hate to see atlanta join the ranks of those cities, just to prove itself. i'd rather see atlanta grow until it actually *needs* another supertall building. to build ourselves another supertall would be like giving ourselves an undeserved trophy. we don't need another supertall for practical purposes; however, the current development is being demanded by the market and is working very well.

Oh goody! Phallic references!!

While I don't agree with all of your reasoning I think it is inarguable that many of these showcase buildings are indeed more points of ego and pride than actual necessity, and that often means the designs tend to be plastic and gaudy. I agree that would be bad for Atlanta.

It would be nice, however, if some of Atlanta's prominent businesses did indeed make their mark on/in urban Atlanta. It's a shame that Fortune 500 companies like Home Depot and Delta don't feature in the skyline the way, say, you see in NY (Citi, AT&T) or Chicago (Sears). And regrettably Coca Cola's home is decidedly mundane and removed from the bulk of other skyscrapers. I'd certainly enjoy being able to point to the skyline and say "There are the hq's for Coke, Delta, Equifax, Holiday Inn..."

look at the BoA tower, for example, of a building that is tall but not needed. it looks beautiful on the skyline, and i hope it stays there for a very long time. however, it was constructed without a real need for vertical construction in the city; now a large portion of the building is completely vacant, since there are much better and cheaper locations for office space, even in the core.

To be fair, when C&S first proposed the structure they were going to occupy most of it, if not all. Then the financial winds changed, NC became a haven for banking institutions and C&S would be bought into NationsBank, thereby eliminating a lot of the middle managers that would've occupied those floors.

[thebigATL]

Originally Posted by gunnerjacket

Perhaps instead of a waterfall we pursue a variant of the modern reflecting-pool and/or fountains theme? The new Olympic Plaza in Adler (Sochi) features the cauldron hanging over a reflecting pool with an animated Olympic ring fountain system. Basically a Bellagio pool done at 1/8 scale.

How about this: We pursue the "Green Line," the linear park space that would cover MARTA's 5 Points station and lead all the way to Phillips Arena. If that were done we could redevelop the Underground Atlanta side of Peachtree Street to feature a similarly scaled fountain and artistic feature. Maybe move the Atlanta's Olympic Cauldron there, or include an artistic tower that incorporates a light show and waterfall? The whole stretch could serve as something like Rockafeller Plaza, complete with Macy's Tree Lighting come Thanksgiving!

Indeed. The City lacks iconic spaces and structures, so anything to stand out would be phenomenal.

I've often suggested that we get Turner productions to develop a version of CN Tower, but with a more interactive base.

It would be nice, however, if some of Atlanta's prominent businesses did indeed make their mark on/in urban Atlanta. It's a shame that Fortune 500 companies like Home Depot and Delta don't feature in the skyline the way, say, you see in NY (Citi, AT&T) or Chicago (Sears). And regrettably Coca Cola's home is decidedly mundane and removed from the bulk of other skyscrapers. I'd certainly enjoy being able to point to the skyline and say "There are the hq's for Coke, Delta, Equifax, Holiday Inn..."

I agree, and this would be a great plan for all of us to start an Idea...And send it to COA Who knows they probably will say yes to the Idea. If so we can start an online meeting on aim.com

[thebigATL]

What about a skytrain or something.... Like a train you can take stops through buildings that would be so cool for us to have something like that + people will really like to come to ATLANTA...



Here's another dream

We can make 2 districts I called them Las Megas District (still thinking of some names) and bright city/DOL (DISTRICT OF LIGHTS)


Las Megas district will be a popular mixed use developments with huge Casinos and luxury hotels like vegas but creative this will have street entertainment and indoor entertainment for the whole family....It will host some theme parks,water-parks,min. golf and etc. and maybe something like atlantis and sea world... this will have many stores giftshops and etc. This project will be considered were The underground or near BOA with a few towers 50+ stories of residential,office and etc.

DOL DISTRICT WILL BE SOMETHING REALLY GREAT FOR THE CITY...IT MEANS (DISTRICT OF LIGHTS)
We will make the city skyline better than it is now, for this it will be a timesquarish like area with taller towers and this the area for people to come shop & lots of entertainment to do with or w/o family local bars and everything you can think of...To add on this you will have towers that will be looking a lot like this :




But even in a creative and better way

but this will be like a tourish like development but it can be for both residence and tourist.
This area will be live 24 hours claimin our new nick name 24hours of non stop sleepness or city that never sleeps.I will add residential etc. to make this area dense on ground walking all parking will be underground,also have live music and stores that will be open for 24 hours... Also it will have a huge lake around the city so people can get tans,ride boats and maybe call lake ATL AND MAKE IT CLEAR as SKY BLUE ....adding lights to trees and maybe some palm trees to make us feel tropical/beach life
And would be cool to add a chinatown.

This idea is for us to change people thinking of atlanta and:
Making our skyline dense
More mix-used development towers
More tourist
More developers
More Retail
More stores
More ground walking
More fun to our great city...

And this idea will bring streetcars,maybe marta and beltline connections. And some greenspaces around.

[gunnerjacket]

I think the casino thing is a bit played out. Thanks to the popularity of gambling on Native American Reservations it's not hard to make a get away to someplace more devoted for such entertainment, and thanks to online options and fantasy leagues the market is relatively thin for casual gamers. Perhaps if ATL went that way earlier, when strip clubs were still the prominent draw for convention business.

Either one of your scenarios relies on having an entertainment district - a clustering of attractions and retail. Your light district is comparable to the Time Square - South idea that was floating about when people saw more media and entertainment options grouping around the south end of Centennial Park. That's still inheritly possible but it relies on the commitment from Turner Networks. Get them to have a more visible, interactive presence along the most trafficked pedestrian corner in the city and you can begin something. Especially if they emphasize all of their live productions as coming from the CNN Center.

Ideally I'd try to cluster other media outlets in the same area, as well. Cox Communications, radio stations, local TV... Would also seek to establish a downtown production studio to couple with Georgia's growing film production efforts. I heard tell that GA is the #3 or 4 state for movie production these days, so I wonder if there's a market for a generic, open in-town studio? (As opposed to doing location shots here and then going elsewhere to film for, say, just 20 more days.)

Either way it would help if we created a few more spaces to help anchor the district. Parks, art work, fountains. Anything to help build the appeal of wanting to go to the area. (If other than Centennial Park)

[TarHeelJ]

Millions of people already like coming to Atlanta each year.

[Tuckerman]

How about a more simple dream.

1. Connect the Midtown Promenade to the WholeFoods et al complex on Ponce and make multiple access points by car and from the Beltline. The current situation is simply stupid. 2.Make public the ridiculous private roads around Buckhead, particularly the one near the Buckhead Church area that is often closed during rush hour to purposely make traffic on Piedmont messy. .

[gunnerjacket]

I'd direct any ideas of this sort to Central Atlanta Progress. They're the ones who seek out and promote progressive ideas for downtown while the City itself is busy with the day-to-day aspects of planning and permitting. CAP's existing ideas are already, IMO, spot on for what Atlanta realistically needs, and they have some pull with the wealthier patrons of the area.

I've offered several suggestions to them regularly, which they'll add to their inventory of ideas for when developing updated plans for the city. I'd wager that there are few ideas, however, that they haven't considered and weighed against practicality. That's why the formal proposals we see are understated compared to our internet whimsies.

To wit, what does Atlanta need? What would make it really great? A few billionaires willing to fund these things and allow us to move on to the next fantasy!