HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Downtown & City of Hamilton


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #81  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 5:45 PM
TheHonestMaple's Avatar
TheHonestMaple TheHonestMaple is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,717
I think a lot of people are overreacting to this news. CN just wants an acoustic study completed, and likely some sort of acoustic barrier installed.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #82  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 6:15 PM
TheRitsman TheRitsman is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,026
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple View Post
I think a lot of people are overreacting to this news. CN just wants an acoustic study completed, and likely some sort of acoustic barrier installed.
I don't think it's an overreaction at all. The previous councillor told families that lived there that they would be able to move back in within 2 years. It's been 10, and we are in a housing crisis, especially for those in lower income levels.

Yet another delay is incredibly bothersome when there seemed to finally be movement on this very desperately needed file. It's also adjacent to transit and from my perspective it's incredibly unfortunate that in the years since the Go Station's completion not a single new development has been developed. The MacNab condo building seems stalled. The 41 Stuart St just got permission to put up a sign finally, and I'm not sure if they've started sales yet. The Jamesville development is a sad legacy of failure for the previous councillor to the community in the North End who have had to look at dilapidated vacant housing and the legacy to the lower income families of Ward 2 of which a large quantities of people fall into in the neighbourhood.
__________________
Hamilton Downtown. Huge tabletop skyline fan. Typically viewing the city from the street, not a helicopter. Cycling, transit and active transportation advocate 🚲🚍🚋

Follow me on Twitter: https://x.com/ham_bicycleguy?t=T_fx3...SIZNGfD4A&s=09
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #83  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 6:36 PM
Innsertnamehere's Avatar
Innsertnamehere Innsertnamehere is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 11,603
I'm really not sure how this specific delay can really be placed as blame against Farr though.

How in the world Jamesville has taken so damn long to get to the point where it can actually be appealed however, who knows. This proposal has been around for years and years. That's the part that needs to be questioned, this kind of appeal is pretty typical.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #84  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 6:38 PM
TheHonestMaple's Avatar
TheHonestMaple TheHonestMaple is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,717
Quote:
Also, CN wrote it would “welcome the opportunity” to resolve the matter outside the tribunal process and engage in more talks with the city.
This is not going to delay the project by much if any.

Also, Kroetsch/Nann supporters will use any opportunity to take a jab at Farr.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #85  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 6:55 PM
ccheck7 ccheck7 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple View Post
This is not going to delay the project by much if any.

Also, Kroetsch/Nann supporters will use any opportunity to take a jab at Farr.
If anything the blame should fall on the City and the development teams for this project, CN noise and vibration conditions are completely standard in Planning, how it got this far without those being addressed is pretty ridiculous. To be fair, if Farr was either aware of what was going on with the file or remotely interested in it's completion he would have been able to help work through the issues. Clearly he wasn't, so here we are. Not solely to blame, but part of the overall compounded issues with this project.

Last edited by ccheck7; Jan 9, 2023 at 1:30 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #86  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 7:04 PM
TheRitsman TheRitsman is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,026
Quote:
Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
I'm really not sure how this specific delay can really be placed as blame against Farr though.

How in the world Jamesville has taken so damn long to get to the point where it can actually be appealed however, who knows. This proposal has been around for years and years. That's the part that needs to be questioned, this kind of appeal is pretty typical.
That's the point. To your earlier paragraph, it's not Farr's fault but the entire second paragraph is Farr's fault. The question is why has this project taken this long to get to a basic appeal.

The city, Farr, sky daddy, I don't really care, it's bullshit that this project has taken this long.
__________________
Hamilton Downtown. Huge tabletop skyline fan. Typically viewing the city from the street, not a helicopter. Cycling, transit and active transportation advocate 🚲🚍🚋

Follow me on Twitter: https://x.com/ham_bicycleguy?t=T_fx3...SIZNGfD4A&s=09
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #87  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 7:29 PM
Chronamut's Avatar
Chronamut Chronamut is offline
Hamilton Historian
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRitsman View Post
That's the point. To your earlier paragraph, it's not Farr's fault but the entire second paragraph is Farr's fault. The question is why has this project taken this long to get to a basic appeal.

The city, Farr, sky daddy, I don't really care, it's bullshit that this project has taken this long.
Sky daddy? Lol.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #88  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 9:28 PM
TheRitsman TheRitsman is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,026
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronamut View Post
Sky daddy? Lol.
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/sky...hesaurus%3Agod
__________________
Hamilton Downtown. Huge tabletop skyline fan. Typically viewing the city from the street, not a helicopter. Cycling, transit and active transportation advocate 🚲🚍🚋

Follow me on Twitter: https://x.com/ham_bicycleguy?t=T_fx3...SIZNGfD4A&s=09
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #89  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 11:19 PM
Chronamut's Avatar
Chronamut Chronamut is offline
Hamilton Historian
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRitsman View Post
LOL I have NEVER heard that expression before.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #90  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 11:41 PM
King&James's Avatar
King&James King&James is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 1,263
Hope they can clean up this mess soon, crazy that this gap went on for so long. Why would CN throw a flag so late into the process.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #91  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 11:45 PM
matt602's Avatar
matt602 matt602 is offline
Hammer'd
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 4,760
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple View Post
I think a lot of people are overreacting to this news. CN just wants an acoustic study completed, and likely some sort of acoustic barrier installed.
Its not an overreaction because people were evicted for this project 4 years ago and the buildings haven't even been demolished in that time, let alone construction on the new project starting. This setback could mean that the site sits like that for another 2 years which is absolutely unacceptable when people are on the streets in record numbers.
__________________
"Above all, Hamilton must learn to think like a city, not a suburban hybrid where residents drive everywhere. What makes Hamilton interesting is the fact it's a city. The sprawl that surrounds it, which can be found all over North America, is running out of time."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #92  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2023, 11:55 PM
TheHonestMaple's Avatar
TheHonestMaple TheHonestMaple is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,717
It's an overreaction not because this project is taking too long, it has for the record. It's an overreaction because this hurdle will not slow the project down by much if at all, and certainly not two years.

"CN wrote it would “welcome the opportunity” to resolve the matter outside the tribunal process and engage in more talks with the city."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #93  
Old Posted Jan 7, 2023, 4:33 AM
ScreamingViking's Avatar
ScreamingViking ScreamingViking is offline
Ham-burgher
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 6,544
CN (and CP for that matter) are notoriously difficult to deal with, unless it's something someone else is doing that they also agree with. In this case, there's no incentive for them to be cooperative or accommodating, nor quick to work to resolve the issue.

They may want something from the city, more than just a noise barrier... perhaps other improvements or funding to improve the trench their rail corridor runs in.

Given all the other housing across the city adjacent to or within a few hundred metres of the tracks that has co-existed with the railway operations for decades and decades -- including this parcel -- it feels to me like they are gaming something. Maybe they are not. Or maybe they're trying to set a precedent for other intensification that's likely to happen in the north end near their corridor (e.g., I seem to recall them having a beef about potential residential uses in the mix for the Barton-Tiffany lands)
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #94  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2023, 6:30 PM
SFUVancouver's Avatar
SFUVancouver SFUVancouver is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 6,380
CN wants in writing that the City understands that the land will be subject to externalities associated with proximity to normal train operations. That way CN will have some protection when some new residents inevitably take occasional umbrage with train noise and complain to the City.

That's for normal operation, mind you. Should CN decide to install an 'everything is okay' alarm that blares at 130db 24/7, the residents and City have every right to throw the book at the railway.

With that said, absolutely right that the railways are always looking out for themselves and playing the long game with their host municipalities. They're federally regulated and largely engage with their host municipalities out of courtesy instead of obligation. I would not be surprised in the slightest if CN is angling to establish precedent with the City for demanding noise abatement or quid pro quo support for corridor improvement initiatives whenever there is substantial development proposed within its areas of influence.
__________________
VANCOUVER | Beautiful, Multicultural | Canada's Pacific Metropolis
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #95  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2023, 2:10 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 19,888
Builder optimistic CN appeal over Jamesville project can be resolved
Case management conference before the Ontario Land Tribunal has been set for late June

https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilto...amesville.html

A builder planning to demolish vacant CityHousing townhouses for a mixed-income redevelopment is holding out hope that Canadian National Railway will drop its project-stalling appeal.

Fram Building Group is part of a private consortium that has partnered with CityHousing and non-profit Indwell on the long-planned 447-unit Jamesville project near the West Harbour GO station.

Fram president Frank Giannone says a case management conference on June 29 before the Ontario Land Tribunal could reopen the door to talks and a potential resolution, averting a full-blown hearing. over the redevelopment along James Street North.

“Optimistically, we’re looking at not going to have to get to a full appeal on it,” Giannone said. “But we’re preparing ourselves for it.”

CityHousing started vacating 91 subsidized townhomes on the site as early as 2015 to clear the way for 160 affordable units in two seven-storey buildings between it and Indwell. The rest of the planned homes in the redevelopment are market-rate stacked townhouses.

City council approved the project last year, but CN appealed that zoning decision to the provincial tribunal in September, citing a potential “conflict” with its bayfront shunting yard on Stuart Street, which is less than 300 metres away.

CN hasn’t responded to The Spectator’s questions, but in its appeal letter, the rail giant’s lawyer noted her client’s concerns revolve around safety, odour, vibration and noise.

However, it’s CN’s “desire to resolve outstanding issues without the need for a contested hearing, and we welcome the opportunity for further discussions” with the city.

Giannone said the sticking point is how loud, crashing noises in the shunting yard could affect the future development’s residents. But many homes sit closer to the yard than the roughly 2.1-hectare Jamesville property between James, MacNab, Ferrie and Strachan, he suggested.

“What are you going to tell those people?”

In an email, CityHousing development manager Sean Botham told The Spectator the municipal housing provider and the project team are “continuing to work with CN towards resolving the appeal,” noting the parties last met in mid-February.

They had a “good meeting,” Giannone said, adding the developer presented a study with recommendations to mitigate the concerns over acoustics that CN was to examine. “They haven’t done that yet, and that’s why we’ve had to at least schedule the (tribunal) process.”

In the meantime, with demolition now halted pending the outcome of the appeal, residents have expressed outrage over the derelict Jamesville townhouses already sitting empty for years during a housing crisis.

That’s a problem to avoid in future development projects the city pursues, says Cameron Kroetsch, the area’s new councillor.

“The idea of emptying all the folks out of Jamesville before we even had some of the things in place, I think, has also been part of the problem.”

He also contends the city may have missed an opportunity to head off the appeal when CN raised concerns with the municipality in 2021.

Nonetheless, Kroetsch, who’s a CityHousing board member, likewise expressed optimism that talks could avert a long dispute before the tribunal.

“I don’t see this being stalled for years over an appeal. I just don’t see it,” he said, noting the redevelopment is a high-profile project that many support.

Moreover, previous CN appeals over other local projects, including the Witton Lofts on Murray Street and the city’s Barton-Tiffany development plans, ended without protracted hearings, Kroetsch noted. Giannone also cites those two examples and a more recent CN appeal in Vaughan as relevant.

In the east end, a similar CityHousing partnership with private developers that also involved the razing of townhouses to build a denser, mixed-income community is under construction.

In April, tenants started moving into a new CityHousing building in the area just north of Queenston Road near the Red Hill Valley Parkway.

The Jamesville delay is frustrating, especially given the importance of building the affordable CityHousing and Indwell units, Giannone lamented. “It’s meeting the core needs of the community.”

In fact, the consortium, had hoped to start construction a year and a half ago, but the COVID-19 pandemic upended those plans, he said. And if the project hadn’t been appealed, “we would have probably been on sale now.”
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #96  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2023, 2:48 PM
PaperSun PaperSun is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2022
Posts: 147
This project is embarrassing for every party involved in it.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #97  
Old Posted Jun 28, 2023, 6:52 PM
King&James's Avatar
King&James King&James is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 1,263
Kathy Renwald story in Bay Observer. Hope they get this thing resolved, sure this delay has cost millions in cost for needless delay.

https://bayobserver.ca/cn-rail-vs-ja..._8ZPdi1RmpwjsM
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #98  
Old Posted Jun 28, 2023, 9:57 PM
PaperSun PaperSun is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2022
Posts: 147
"CN is appealing the Jamesville housing development which is near their shunting yard in Hamilton’s North End over issues of safety, odour, dust, vibration and noise. Bottom line, CN doesn’t want to hear complaints from residents over railway operations."

Why cant they just add a bunch of warning clauses into the rental agreements to cover all these concerns?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #99  
Old Posted Jun 28, 2023, 11:20 PM
ScreamingViking's Avatar
ScreamingViking ScreamingViking is offline
Ham-burgher
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 6,544
And to think people lived on that property for decades, coexisting with rail operations. How did they ever survive???
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #100  
Old Posted Jun 29, 2023, 2:25 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 19,888
No decision today. There will be a second meeting; they are choosing a day currently, likely late August or early September, for the next meeting.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Downtown & City of Hamilton
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 6:46 PM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.