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  #1  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2012, 4:58 AM
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LA's Measure R - why haven't others followed suit?

Here in San Diego we are struggling to get an 8 mile extension of an existing light rail line built that mostly runs along a Amtrak/freight right of way. This crucial project has been postponed and will not be completed until 2018. Meanwhile LA County passed Measure R and seems to have reaped an "InstaRailBoom."

For those of you not familiar with Measure R it is a half cent sales tax in the county that is funding all of the lines currently under construction there. To me this seems like a no brainer, why aren't other US cities copying the LA model on this one?
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  #2  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2012, 5:09 AM
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Some are. Seattle for example. It's not perfect but it's pretty good, and voters have voted another 20 billion.
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  #3  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2012, 5:41 AM
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LA was hardly the first to institute a transportation sales tax. I think every county in the Bay Area has a transportation sales tax. Here in Sonoma and Marin Counties we just passed a quarter cent tax to fund the new SMART commuter train. (On top of the quarter cent we already pay in Sonoma to fund/accelerate the freeway widening).

A quick online search reveals Fulton County in Georgia, Riverside in CA, Boulder County in CO, St Charles MO, Charleston County in SC, St. Louis County etc. etc. all have transportation sales taxes and some have been collecting them for DECADES.

The reason they aren't as ubiquitous as you may wish is America's distaste of any (new) tax.
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  #4  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2012, 7:41 AM
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Measure R isn't really responsible for LA's instarailboom. It's more that LA decided to dedicate itself to having an instarailboom, as opposed to most other cities where transportation isn't as pressing of an issue or the focus is still of roads.
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  #5  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2012, 2:51 PM
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I posted this under the City Compilations section and someone else mentioned it there but one of the big differences that can't be overlooked is political leadership and how each respective region views itself.

Former mayor, Tom Bradley's leadership was very important in getting the Red line built and the commitment of Antonio Villariagosa to the current rail expansion has been very important. LA County has 10M - 11M people and LA and the surrounding counties have approximately 18M people. From what I've read (http://www.oup.com/us/catalog/genera...E5NTE1Mzc3NA==), San Diego has long had a conflicted view of itself between a large metropolitan city and a small-town coastal area. San Diego County in recent decades has also been more politically conservative than Los Angeles County.

I also think auto congestion on LA's highways is worse than that of San Diego. LA residents have been more willing to tax themselves to pay for alternatives to highway congestion.
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  #6  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 4:33 PM
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mello, I believe SD actually built a surface transit line----the red trains that run towards tijuana----before LA got its blue line train, which goes between dtla & long beach, in 1990. SD also started to revive its dt in a really significant way around 10 yrs before the same thing started to happen in LA.

I think the greater congestion of streets & fwys in LA compared with SD finally forced more ppl to take the need for better transit more seriously. So if only out of desperation, they approved the transit tax a few yrs ago. If you look back at the history of similar taxes on the ballot, going back to the 1970s, ppl in LA----esp out in the burbs, or throughout the county----never gave even a simple majority of their support to the idea of increasing sales taxes for transit.
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  #7  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 4:36 PM
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Because, obviously, LA is the only city that really wants new mass transit!

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  #8  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 5:23 PM
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The Phoenix metro area started actively seeking light rail funding in the mid 1990s. Two local successful votes (Tempe in 1996 and Phoenix in 2000) helped paved the way, followed by a successful Maricopa county-wide vote in 2004:

September 1996: Tempe voters approve a permanent half-cent sales tax dedicated to transit. Major investment study initiated for the 20-mile light rail starter line.

March 2000: Phoenix voters approve a four-tenths cent sales tax increase to fund transit over 20 years.

November 2004: Maricopa County voters pass Proposition 400, which provides funding for additional transportation improvements Valleywide, including 27.7 miles of light rail extensions to the planned system.

Latest milestone of Phoenix's light rail system:

October 2011: METRO experiences its highest ridership month on record serving more than 1.25 million riders, resulting in an average of 45,000 daily. City of Phoenix and METRO receives a $1 million federal grant to conduct an Alternatives Analysis on the South Central Phoenix corridor.

Source: http://www.valleymetro.org/about_lig...tones_archive/

--don
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  #9  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 6:22 PM
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Miami passed a transportation1/2 cent sales tax 10 years ago. They're talking about repealing it now, because absolutely nothing that was promised has materialized.
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  #10  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 6:45 PM
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What happened?
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  #11  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 7:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mello View Post
For those of you not familiar with Measure R it is a half cent sales tax in the county that is funding all of the lines currently under construction there. To me this seems like a no brainer, why aren't other US cities copying the LA model on this one?
Sure, just because LA copied Denver's FasTracks since California is out of original ideas.

Joking aside, there are a number of cities that have passed sales tax measures to accelerate a build-out of mass transit systems. Salt Lake City, Seattle, Denver are just a few of them.
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Last edited by wong21fr; Apr 16, 2012 at 8:19 PM.
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  #12  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 7:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LtBk View Post
What happened?
Elected officials got a hold of the money and used it all for all sorts of other purposes (revamping bus stops, adding wheelchair ramps, repaving roads (seriously), maintaining current metrorail fleet...).
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  #13  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 8:10 PM
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I started this thread because LA is experiencing the largest rail building boom of any US metro area in the last 30 years. I understand that the Bay Area built a lot of lines from the 60's through the 80's but what is going on in Los Angeles right now is pretty amazing. The formula seems pretty simple, get the politicians to use the money properly after the tax is passed and presto rail lines are sprouting up all over the LA basin.
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Last edited by mello; Apr 16, 2012 at 9:57 PM.
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  #14  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 9:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mello View Post
I started this thread because LA is experiencing the largest rail building boom of any metro area in the last 30 years.
Any metro area in the U.S. There are dozens of places throughout the world with metro construction activity that would put L.A. to shame.
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  #15  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2012, 10:06 PM
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I wish the East Coast cities would , we have over 290 Billion in backlogged projects...
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  #16  
Old Posted Apr 23, 2012, 6:20 AM
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I'm almost sure San Diego passed a half-cent tax towards Public Transportation projects and that's how we're paying for the mid-coast extension.
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  #17  
Old Posted Apr 23, 2012, 1:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mello View Post
Here in San Diego we are struggling to get an 8 mile extension of an existing light rail line built that mostly runs along a Amtrak/freight right of way. This crucial project has been postponed and will not be completed until 2018. Meanwhile LA County passed Measure R and seems to have reaped an "InstaRailBoom."

For those of you not familiar with Measure R it is a half cent sales tax in the county that is funding all of the lines currently under construction there. To me this seems like a no brainer, why aren't other US cities copying the LA model on this one?
Most people will point to the fact that LRT can not sustain itself, and is a "boondoggle". To get the sales tax increase support you need to win the voters over, and the voters -- right or wrong -- need to understand the true ST and LT benefits and implications of having a REGIONAL rail network.
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  #18  
Old Posted Apr 23, 2012, 5:00 PM
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We have a quarter cent sales tax in the Minneapolis metro dedicated to transit. We have one light rail line under construction(Central/Green line), and one in preliminary design(SW corridor).
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  #19  
Old Posted Apr 23, 2012, 9:21 PM
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In Houston, the exact opposite is taking place. The city continues to "borrow" from the sales tax revenues that are supposed to go exclusively to METRO and for transit use. Which leaves METRO begging the Feds for rail funding...

http://blog.chron.com/thelist/2012/0...es-on-transit/
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  #20  
Old Posted Apr 24, 2012, 1:16 AM
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LA has a mayor who is earnestly, honestly a supporter of transit - not because he wants lucrative contracts to hand out to contributors, and not because he wants to buy votes from lower-income communities; but because he understands that an efficient transit system will give people time-effective alternatives to the freeways and will pull LA out of its economic doldrums.

Because his support for transit is honest and principled, Villaraigosa can go to the people and successfully convince them that they need to pay more in taxes to support a transit system. Obviously LA has a lot of educated, well-traveled people who have seen first-hand how transit systems allow for fast efficient movement around a city. Obviously there were naysayers but Villaraigosa's principled support allowed him to build a coalition to shush the naysayers.
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