POLL: What line do we build next?

[G-Slice]

The next 10-15 years will bring us the Canada Line, then God-willing the Evergreen and UBC line. But after that, what happens next?

In the plethora of fantasy map threads, it seems that most people see the same lines getting built eventually, but I'm more curious to see in what order people think they should be constructed.

Here's a little picture to show what I'm talking about. Some lines might be a little off and I didn't include any Expo extensions, but you should get the idea.



I've put up three options that make some kind of sense to me. If you agree with one, vote for it. If not, post how you would go about it. If I've missed your pet line completely, feel free to complain.

[mr.x]

(not necessarily the routes in the map above)

Evergreen Line: 2014
UBC M-Line extension: 2017
Surrey Expo Line extension: 2020
---------------------------------
Surrey SkyTrain extension down King George to Newton and new Surrey LRT network: 2024
North Fraser Perimeter LRT: 2024
Hastings LRT/SkyTrain: 2028
Arbutus LRT: 2028
North Shore SkyTrain: 2033
41st Avenue LRT: 2038

[deasine]

I chose none of the above 'cuz it was missing many important routes. I shouldn't have voted though. Anyway, I'm doing a transport 2040 plan as part of drafting & urban design course in high school right now and so far, I've come up with this timeline [years in opening dates]:

2009 ~ Whiterock RapidBus
2012 ~ King George RapidBus [with centre medians] & Fraser Highway RapidBus
- End of 2012: Port Mann Twin
2013 ~ Gateway RapidBus & Hastings RapidBus [with centre medians]
2014 ~ Evergreen Line
2016 ~ 41 st Avenue [with centre medians]
- 2018: New Pautello Bridge [double deck]: 6 lanes top deck, rail & future LRT second deck (you'll see why later)
2019 ~ 200st RapidBus
2020 ~ UBC Line
- End of 2020: Massey Tunnel Twin/Upgrade Oak Street Bridge/Highway 99 Upgrade

2024 ~ Interurban LRT/DMU
2027-2029 ~ Hastings LRT to West Vancouver via Lions Gate [phases]
- 2029: West Vancouver Tunnel replace Lions Gate
2030-32 ~ King George LRT to White Rock
2031 ~ Tsawwassen RapidBus
2033 ~ Extension of Arbutus LRT to 22nd Street Station via Fraser River
2034-36 ~ 41st Avenue LRT to Willingdon [phases]
2037 ~ North Vancouver LRT from Park Royal
2038 ~ New SeaBus
2040 ~ Further extend Arbutus/Fraser LRT through New West on Pautello Bridge connecting to Interurban, meaning it's all one LRT route

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by deasine

2031 ~ Tsawwassen RapidBus

Hey, I kinda think that that route was already introduced ~60 years prior to that date.

I'm referring to the 601, which was introduced circa 1974 and was known as the fast bus as a direct high-back seat, express bus service between Tsawwassen and downtown Vancouver (Granville St.).

I took it as a kid years later.

Or am I mistaken???

[spitkicker08]

what about a victoria line? the new articulated busses have been getting a lot of attention lately and demand there seems to be high. why not have a line going up victoria, across hastings to downtown, and then down arbutus?

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Stingray2004

Hey, I kinda think that that route was already introduced ~60 years prior to that date.

I'm referring to the 601, which was introduced circa 1974 and was known as the fast bus as a direct high-back seat, express bus service between Tsawwassen and downtown Vancouver (Granville St.).

I took it as a kid years later.

Or am I mistaken???

Yup. I'm aware of that. In fact, during rush 'hours, there is 601 602 603 and 604. They will all be terminating at Bridgeport come 2009. The WhiteRock RapidBus actually replaces many White Rock routes with a frequent, articulated bus service with many more "station-like" features. As the population of Tsawwassen increases, I think there should be a bus rapid transit system directly to Tsawwassen and the Ferry Terminal. Essentially, this bus route will replace 601 602 603 604 and 620. New Express routes will also be introduced in between Taswwassen and Ladner with Newton (via Highway 99) and Scott Road (via South Fraser Perimeter Road)

Originally Posted by spitkicker08

what about a victoria line? the new articulated busses have been getting a lot of attention lately and demand there seems to be high. why not have a line going up victoria, across hastings to downtown, and then down arbutus?

Excuse me sorry... forgot to include it. I would say a streetcar/tram like service from Downtown to East Fraserlands Village with signal priority at every intersection. I'm not going to say LRT because Streetcar service can serve the corridor properly and there isn't a lot of room for LRT. Plug that in somewhere form 2020-2035.

[bugsy]

Imagine how we'll all be when any of this may actually get done. I DONT WANT TO GET OLD!

[twoNeurons]

I'd like to Hastings next, but realistically, speaking, something on an existing ROW (Arbutus, Marine) would probably happen next.

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by bugsy

Imagine how we'll all be when any of this may actually get done. I DONT WANT TO GET OLD!

Yeah, I've decided not to grow old.

[g35]

Originally Posted by mr.x2

(not necessarily the routes in the map above)

Evergreen Line: 2014
UBC M-Line extension: 2017
Surrey Expo Line extension: 2020
---------------------------------
Surrey SkyTrain extension down King George to Newton and new Surrey LRT network: 2024
North Fraser Perimeter LRT: 2024
Hastings LRT/SkyTrain: 2028
Arbutus LRT: 2028
North Shore SkyTrain: 2033
41st Avenue LRT: 2038

This sounds most reasonable to me. I think Vancouver can wait for a while for more rapid transit after the UBC line is done.

[mooks28]

It'll be Skytrain out to Langley, no doubt about it.

[worldwide]

for some reason i cant picture skytrain running through the ALR... imagine a skytrain at fraser highway and 176

[deasine]

Originally Posted by mooks28

It'll be Skytrain out to Langley, no doubt about it.

Just to serve Falcon right? I really want him out the next cabinet shuffle.

[milescr]

Something to North Van would be good because right now they have one of the worst transit situations in B.C. and we need a easy way to get to capilano college.

[worldwide]

Originally Posted by milescr

Something to North Van would be good because right now they have one of the worst transit situations in B.C. and we need a easy way to get to capilano college.

i disagree i think they have it pretty good. the north shore may not have the best transit service in metro van, but they have much better service than the south of the fraser region, central fraser valley (valleymax) or anywhere else in BC outside of victoria. all north shore busses run relatively frequently, have timed connections at major hubs, bus service until well after midnight with 2 routes going much later, until about 3am, and express routes into the city. not to mention the seabus.

cap college has many routes running into it, and even if you dont live along the routes the connections are timed at phibbs and at lonsdale so youre not stuck waiting around.

[mooks28]

Originally Posted by deasine

Just to serve Falcon right? I really want him out the next cabinet shuffle.

I think Falcon will be long gone by the time planning for this starts up! If you look at the LRSP, Langley town centre will be the largest regional town centre not connected to the Skytrain system -- North Van has the Seabus, and Maple Ridge's town centre will likely be significantly smaller than Langley's.

None of this would preclude a light rail system for South of the Fraser to supplement the Skytrain, of course...

[LeftCoaster]

As the old addage goes, its not all about size.

Despite LTC's size advantage over other town centres it's role in the region and interconnectivity to other town centres must be taken into account when prioritizing mass transit. Employment types, commuting patterns and demographics all make up larger issues that size alone.

[mooks28]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

As the old addage goes, its not all about size.

Despite LTC's size advantage over other town centres it's role in the region and interconnectivity to other town centres must be taken into account when prioritizing mass transit. Employment types, commuting patterns and demographics all make up larger issues that size alone.

Fair enough, but I still think Langley is the superior choice to Maple Ridge.

And let's not forget politics -- the North Shore certainly doesn't have the political clout (and growing) the Valley has...

[deasine]

I would love SkyTrain to Langley if they had some density throughout the Fraser Highway cooridor. The cost of extending SkyTrain to Langley is not justified, at least not at the moment. I rather see Light Rail on the Interurban route from Scott Road to Newton to Cloverdale to Langley. =)

[twoNeurons]

Mississauga also doesn't have a Subway to Toronto... but they have Go Train.

Langley is better served by a Commuter Train.

I don't think even Langley residents want to stay for 75 minutes on a Skytrain to Downtown. I know a lot won't go downtown, but still... commuter rail is more comfortable and makes more sense.