How likely is it for you to encounter people who haven't been to the US?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

I've heard people talk about this... personally I don't get it. Yeah I think Trump is a dangerous goof who is quickly ruining the United States, but I don't see why I should deprive myself of a vacation on the Florida coast because of it. Nothing will change if I stay home.

I agree with this. I am going down to the U.S. for part of the Christmas holidays.

More Americans (of those who bothered to vote) actually voted for Clinton over Trump, and the number of Americans who are anti-Trump outnumbers the entire population of Canada many times over.

People will do as they please according to their own views, but personally I don't see why these Americans deserve to have their livelihood threatened by a massive boycott of the U.S. as a travel destination.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I agree with this. I am going down to the U.S. for part of the Christmas holidays.

More Americans (of those who bothered to vote) actually voted for Clinton over Trump, and the number of Americans who are anti-Trump outnumbers the entire population of Canada many times over.

People will do as they please according to their own views, but personally I don't see why these Americans deserve to have their livelihood threatened by a massive boycott of the U.S. as a travel destination.

The argument "I don't feel comfortable going there under the current conditions" is complete BS as well, there's no way to notice the "current conditions" as they're subtle and will only affect you if you live there (and even then, they might very well not).

Same way a Japanese tourist to Banff in 2014 under Harper won't notice any change when visiting Banff again in 2016 under Trudeau. Even someone like me, if I didn't pay attention I wouldn't have realized we changed federal governments two years ago.

[esquire]

When I was at Sunny Isles Beach last winter, the only "friction", such as it was, that I noticed with respect to the Trump administration were newspaper stories about a fight with the City of Miami over the repercussions of it becoming a self-declared sanctuary city.

Other than that it was pretty much business as usual. I don't think I even saw a single MAGA hat... although in Sunny Isles, between all the Russians, Canadians, Israelis and people from random South American countries, there probably weren't too many American voters anyway

[niwell]

I've been to the States twice since the 2016 election (so far) and it won't prevent me from going again in a few months. The areas I've gone to have been pretty anti-Trump, to say the least (Chicago, Vermont and New Orleans in the new year) and if anything people have been excited to trash him in bar conversations. Which to be honest can get a bit cringey and uncomfortable, but no more than American politics in the past.

That being said I do understand in certain situations why people may be more reticent. My best friend,s girlfriend for instance, who is a refugee from Northern Iraq and has been in Canada for about 25 years. Her job requires her to travel to NYC fairly often and she was feeling a bit worried about it in the months after the inauguration. Even if only for potential delays in clearing security I do think this was at least somewhat justified. I know certain people will go red in the face denying it, but there is a renewed rhetoric and dog-whistling against people from that part of world in the American public sphere. Even if this individuals family happen to be overwhelmingly atheist. Things as a white guy from Canada with one of the most British last names in history I don't really have to worry about.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

When I was at Sunny Isles Beach last winter, the only "friction", such as it was, that I noticed with respect to the Trump administration were newspaper stories about a fight with the City of Miami over the repercussions of it becoming a self-declared sanctuary city.

Other than that it was pretty much business as usual. I don't think I even saw a single MAGA hat... although in Sunny Isles, between all the Russians, Canadians, Israelis and people from random South American countries, there probably weren't too many American voters anyway

I was on the Florida Atlantic coast a couple hours north of there a few months before the last election, and I swear 90% or more of the oceanfront mansions had Trump signs on the lawn.

[north 42]

I don't think it's BS at all, the entire world has been watching the US struggle with mass shootings, extreme racial tensions and riots, racial profiling, immigration interrogation, thickening borders, an over the top and aggressive Homeland security, and the big orange monkey posing as it's president!
I am horrified at what is happening over there, and so are many others across the globe, and I love the place, especially the Detroit area, for obvious reasons. I wouldn't let it stop me from visiting the States if there was something I really wanted to see, but to me it makes going over there much less attractive than it used to be! Trust me, I hear this view from many different people, it's a very real phenomenon!

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by niwell

I've been to the States twice since the 2016 election (so far) and it won't prevent me from going again in a few months. The areas I've gone to have been pretty anti-Trump, to say the least (Chicago, Vermont and New Orleans in the new year) and if anything people have been excited to trash him in bar conversations. Which to be honest can get a bit cringey and uncomfortable, but no more than American politics in the past.

That being said I do understand in certain situations why people may be more reticent. My best friend,s girlfriend for instance, who is a refugee from Northern Iraq and has been in Canada for about 25 years. Her job requires her to travel to NYC fairly often and she was feeling a bit worried about it in the months after the inauguration. Even if only for potential delays in clearing security I do think this was at least somewhat justified. I know certain people will go red in the face denying it, but there is a renewed rhetoric and dog-whistling against people from that part of world in the American public sphere. Even if this individuals family happen to be overwhelmingly atheist. Things as a white guy from Canada with one of the most British last names in history I don't really have to worry about.

That's a good point. The same goes for me. My origins are not completely European but I definitely do look like a white guy. I have French first and last names, but with a slightly different twist I could have a last name that *might* raise some eyebrows from the keener U.S. border people.

Though relatives of mine who have that surname have never reported any issues at the border - their first names all tend to be French Christian names though like Pierre, Jean, Jacques, Marie...

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by north 42

I don't think it's BS at all, the entire world has been watching the US struggle with mass shootings, extreme racial tensions and riots, racial profiling, immigration interrogation, thickening borders, an over the top and aggressive Homeland security, and the big orange monkey posing as it's president!
I am horrified at what is happening over there, and so are many others across the globe, and I love the place, especially the Detroit area, for obvious reasons. I wouldn't let it stop me from visiting the States if there was something I really wanted to see, but to me it makes going over there much less attractive than it used to be! Trust me, I hear this view from many different people, it's a very real phenomenon!

If anything it's the low CAD that's been the issue for me.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

If anything it's the low CAD that's been the issue for me.

I think this is the decisive factor for all but a tiny handful of people. After all, it's not like all the condos that got snapped up by Canadians around the 2008 financial crisis were endorsements of GW Bush's policies...

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Acajack

If anything it's the low CAD that's been the issue for me.

My girlfriend and I just tallied up the costs for a 5 day Vermont trip. Granted we purchased a lot of fancy craft beer to bring home, but for the two of us it ended up costing a bit more than my 10 day solo trip to South Africa last month. And that's including airfare...

[MolsonExport]

I once knew a guy that lived in Lasalle (Quebec) his entire life (he was in his 40s) and he had never been to downtown Montreal.

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Las...!4d-73.6348015

[north 42]

Originally Posted by Acajack

If anything it's the low CAD that's been the issue for me.

Yeah me too, but the overall state of America is having a big effect on some people's desire to visit, I hear it all the time from many of my clients. It's unfortunate!

[MonctonRad]

I once encountered a patient at the Moncton Hospital (transferred for treatment from PEI) several years ago. He was in his 40's and this was his first time off island - ever.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lio45

The argument "I don't feel comfortable going there under the current conditions" is complete BS as well, there's no way to notice the "current conditions" as they're subtle and will only affect you if you live there (and even then, they might very well not).

Same way a Japanese tourist to Banff in 2014 under Harper won't notice any change when visiting Banff again in 2016 under Trudeau. Even someone like me, if I didn't pay attention I wouldn't have realized we changed federal governments two years ago.

When I was an undergrad in university for the type of people I studied and hung around with, the issue of apartheid in South Africa was a really big deal.

It was discussed a lot and there was even a guy I knew who was a card-carrying member of SWAPO - South West Africa People's Organization. They were based in Namibia but everything was all mixed in that part of the world, and SWAPO also fought against the South African defence forces.

Anyway, one of the things that was often said was the boycotts of South Africa and South African products, even if they hurt the majority population (eg blacks) economically, were still necessary and justified because the situation was so bad there and needed to change urgently.

The end justifies the means, basically.

I suppose there are some people who feel that way about the United States of America under Donald Trump.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

I once knew a guy that lived in Lasalle (Quebec) his entire life (he was in his 40s) and he had never been to downtown Montreal.

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Las...!4d-73.6348015

I remember a relative of mine who was a middle school teacher in Mississauga talking about a field trip into downtown Toronto, and how the kids were really excited about it.

I said: ''they live right next to Toronto, how exciting can it be for them to go there?''

And she said that the majority of kids in her class almost *never* went into the city. (Even if it was only a 20-minute drive.)

Some were born in Toronto 13 years before but hadn't set foot in that city since their birth.

And this wasn't in a poor part of Mississauga. (Actually it was a French school, so kids were drawn from all over a large part of the city.)

[Denscity]

Basically no one? Castlegar is only half hour from the US border and 2 hours or so from Spokane Wash. Spokane is where many of us go for shopping, concerts, hockey tournaments, and flying into the rest of the US or beyond.

[Xelebes]

It's quite common here. 2/3 of my siblings (including myself) have never traveled outside of Canada. One of those siblings has traveled east of Regina.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Xelebes

It's quite common here. 2/3 of my siblings (including myself) have never traveled outside of Canada. One of those siblings has traveled east of Regina.

I could see the numbers being a fair bit higher than the Canadian norm for Edmonton/Central Alberta... you guys are one of only major Canadian cities to be outside of easy driving distance to the US.

[1overcosc]

I've actually only been to the US once in my whole life, and that was to Rochester for a single 1-day trip to see a concert. Most of my trips out of the country are to Europe or the Carribean. And I was born and raised in Canada to an upper middle class family.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

That's a good point. The same goes for me. My origins are not completely European but I definitely do look like a white guy. I have French first and last names, but with a slightly different twist I could have a last name that *might* raise some eyebrows from the keener U.S. border people.

Though relatives of mine who have that surname have never reported any issues at the border - their first names all tend to be French Christian names though like Pierre, Jean, Jacques, Marie...

My dad inevitably raises a red flag at the border ever since 9/11 and the passport requirement as his passport shows in place of birth to be in an Arab country (French soil at the time, and the Air Force had chosen to station my grandpa there, but that's too subtle for the average 21st century U.S. customs officer).

However, he always manages to cross without trouble in the end, it's just always slightly less quick and less simple when he's there.