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  #81  
Old Posted May 20, 2008, 9:42 PM
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leif leif is offline
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Thanks realcity :-) I couldn't resist after reading RTH's complimentary remark about my letter to the ed:

"there's a fab letter in the Spec today telling Flambasterdas to basically take a hike or start looking after their own sick, homeless, criminals, parolees etc...."

This whole bizarre mass delusion has left me feeling stymied. My point in the letter nailed home once again by a Kirkendal email bulletin just received:

"Two male youths were arrested early this morning 4:30 am. They are responsible for most of the car entries in that area. They were arrested on Dundurn at Homewood. It is possible they were in the company of a young female but we do not have any more information at this time. One youth lives steps away from the club. They were caught by an off duty officer (who also had his car entered). The youths only confessed to 10 car entries. They stated they need money to buy cool stuff."

Hhmmm... let's see, at least three halfway houses packed with paroled young offenders in the neighbourhood - but that's probably just a coincidence...

Anyway, point being, that stuff is our burden to bear for the same or higher property taxes as Flam - but yes, we do get the snow plowed first, etc. etc. blah, blah, blah. Anyone up there wanna trade? ;-)
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  #82  
Old Posted May 24, 2008, 12:13 AM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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it's time to censur bigmouth mcCarthy or suspend her.
She's getting a lawyer involved now to fight the tax increase????? Hey bimbo, you guys pay the lowest taxes in the ENTIRE CITY!
This sort of behaviour shouldn't be allowed on council.
If it was Sam Merulla, people would be screaming bloody murder.
But because it's a smiling, suburban hick she thinks she can do whatever she wants and become a little pain in the backside.
Quit lying to your residents and quit being such a baby!
You guys have gotten a free ride for 3 decades and STILL are in 2008!!
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  #83  
Old Posted May 24, 2008, 4:23 PM
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realcity realcity is offline
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Let them waste their money on a lawyer. Any lawyer will see this as a cash-cow. They haven't got a case..... NOT AT ALL. But the lawyer will be happy to have meetings and provide paperwork, citing cases/precedents for a fee. And he/she should. The City has nothing to worry about.

Why are these 'councilors' even on Council? they absolutely hate Hamilton and vote against anything that would improve Hamilton's image. These people are like our very own local Parti Quebecois... It's time to get tough with them Fred.
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  #84  
Old Posted May 24, 2008, 5:08 PM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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the lawyer is working for free! He lives out there.
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  #85  
Old Posted May 24, 2008, 6:09 PM
hamiltonguy hamiltonguy is offline
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I know the lawyer too. Great guy.

He's said his involvement doesn't mean a lawsuit, only will if something illegal happened. (or at least that's what it says in the Spec.)

Don't judge him too harshly.
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  #86  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 12:46 AM
coalminecanary coalminecanary is offline
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Ahh, remember the days back on the grade school playground when the whiniest of all the sniveling kids threatened to "sue you" when they didn't get their way?

I'm glad real adult life isn't like that!
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  #87  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 3:04 PM
highwater highwater is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hamiltonguy View Post
I know the lawyer too. Great guy.

He's said his involvement doesn't mean a lawsuit, only will if something illegal happened. (or at least that's what it says in the Spec.)

Don't judge him too harshly.
If something illegal happened? A truly great guy wouldn't even hint at such a thing.
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  #88  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 5:14 PM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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something illegal has happened alright.
Hamilton has been screwed by these cheapskates for 3 decades.
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  #89  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 6:29 PM
hamiltonguy hamiltonguy is offline
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Originally Posted by highwater View Post
If something illegal happened? A truly great guy wouldn't even hint at such a thing.
I don't think the word "illegal" itself was used, i'd have to check the article.

But basically the gist was that as long as nothing legally questionable happened there won't be a lawsuit.
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  #90  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 8:18 PM
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Originally Posted by hamiltonguy View Post
I don't think the word "illegal" itself was used, i'd have to check the article.

But basically the gist was that as long as nothing legally questionable happened there won't be a lawsuit.
is McCarthy really that big of an airhead that she needed to contact a lawyer to figure that out??
When a lawyer says that, you know nothing happened. They sue for anything these days.
If anything, we should be suing Flambasterdas for keeping the slots revenue an extra 2 years instead of sharing it as originally planned.
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  #91  
Old Posted May 25, 2008, 10:40 PM
hamiltonguy hamiltonguy is offline
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Originally Posted by raisethehammer View Post
is McCarthy really that big of an airhead that she needed to contact a lawyer to figure that out??
When a lawyer says that, you know nothing happened. They sue for anything these days.
If anything, we should be suing Flambasterdas for keeping the slots revenue an extra 2 years instead of sharing it as originally planned.
He wasn't contacted as a lawyer (although McCarthy seems to want to play this up), she just found him when she was trying to drum up citizen support. He happens to be a resident who is a lawyer, not the other way around.

Lawyers only sue when they think they can win. Judges and lawmakers, who are responsible for (mis)interpreting and writing the law, are more to blame.

If judges stopped making stupid rulings, and lawmakers stupid laws, then lawyers wouldn't have as many stupid things to sue over.
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  #92  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2008, 2:49 PM
brett.electrician brett.electrician is offline
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Wow! I just read through this entire thread. Some people on here really have it in for suburbanities. Just a couple of questions. Why should people living in a rural place pay equal taxes to those living in the inner city? Shouldn't your taxes be based on the services you recieve? Why is there such a level of hatred expressed by certian member of the fourm towards the residents of flambourgh? What have they ever done to you? Isn't it true they were forced into amalgamation? If so of course they aren't going to be happy. Do the people of Flambourgh even feel a connection to Hamilton? I.E do they shop there, go to school or use the services?
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  #93  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2008, 4:22 PM
drpgq drpgq is offline
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Originally Posted by brett.electrician View Post
Wow! I just read through this entire thread. Some people on here really have it in for suburbanities. Just a couple of questions. Why should people living in a rural place pay equal taxes to those living in the inner city? Shouldn't your taxes be based on the services you recieve? Why is there such a level of hatred expressed by certian member of the fourm towards the residents of flambourgh? What have they ever done to you? Isn't it true they were forced into amalgamation? If so of course they aren't going to be happy. Do the people of Flambourgh even feel a connection to Hamilton? I.E do they shop there, go to school or use the services?
Yeah I feel your pain. I live downtown and wish I could create a little village consisting of just me and only paying for the services I use. I've never received welfare, so I don't see why I should contribute to the 20% the city does. I amost never take the bus anymore (although I once did in high school, undergrad and grad school), just like somebody out in Flamborough, so why should I contribute to that too? Hell I spend 35% of my time in Europe, so why should I pay for things like police services when I'm not even here? I like this picking and choosing of services based exactly on what I use. Sign me up!
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  #94  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2008, 5:04 PM
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Yeah I feel your pain. I live downtown and wish I could create a little village consisting of just me and only paying for the services I use. I've never received welfare, so I don't see why I should contribute to the 20% the city does. I amost never take the bus anymore (although I once did in high school, undergrad and grad school), just like somebody out in Flamborough, so why should I contribute to that too? Hell I spend 35% of my time in Europe, so why should I pay for things like police services when I'm not even here? I like this picking and choosing of services based exactly on what I use. Sign me up!
What are you saying? Yay for status quo?
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  #95  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2008, 4:02 AM
drpgq drpgq is offline
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What are you saying? Yay for status quo?
I was replying to the previous poster who, it seemed to me, was advocating only paying property taxes for the specific services you receive: "Why should people living in a rural place pay equal taxes to those living in the inner city? Shouldn't your taxes be based on the services you recieve?" I'm not a big fan of this mentality and I guess ideally, I would prefer if a lot of these services (transit and welfare) were funded exclusively by the province. How do you choose which services you should pay for? What if somebody from Flamborough at some point takes a bus in Hamilton?

I can understand someone moving out to Flamborough and feeling that they are leaving the city behind and should no longer have to pay for all its problems. I don't think that is right, and I'm especially not a fan of people trying to arrange boundaries so they pay less taxes. I don't particularly feel a "connection" to Stoney Creek, or Winona for that matter, but I don't go around complaining about my property taxes being used there.
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  #96  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2008, 1:27 PM
FairHamilton FairHamilton is offline
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Originally Posted by brett.electrician View Post
Wow! I just read through this entire thread. Some people on here really have it in for suburbanities. Just a couple of questions. Why should people living in a rural place pay equal taxes to those living in the inner city? Shouldn't your taxes be based on the services you recieve? Why is there such a level of hatred expressed by certian member of the fourm towards the residents of flambourgh? What have they ever done to you? Isn't it true they were forced into amalgamation? If so of course they aren't going to be happy. Do the people of Flambourgh even feel a connection to Hamilton? I.E do they shop there, go to school or use the services?
I think it's a generality to say those in the country receive less in services. I think they recieve the same in service amount/value, but those services are just different and not as clearly evident as some of those services 'consumed' in the city.

An example would be garbage pickup and snow removal. On my city street in only 300' (600' linear) the city can collect garbage and remove snow for 20 homes. If each home pays $3,000/year in property taxes that's $60,000 in tax revenue. I'm guessing in a rural setting that 600' linear feet of plowing or garbage pickup would perhaps cover 2, perhaps 3 properties. Are rural those properties paying their 'fair share' for that service, or are the city properties subsidizing them?

Same with city vs. rural school bus pickups, road maintenance, constructing water lines, sewage lines, police, and fire department coverage, etc......

Heck, a large portion of my property taxes are funnelled to education. My wife and I don't (and won't) have kids, so does that mean I should jump up and down shouting and screaming that I'm hard done by? And how about people who have large families shouldn't they pay more than those with smaller families?

I feel for those with increased tax bills, and I support their right to be angry and to voice their anger. That's democracy. I also know that sometimes life's not fair and whoever said it was fair, lied. But, they'll have their right to lobby their provincial MPP, and throw their support behind mayoral and councillor candidate that support their views in future elections. If there's a large enough voice, and a compelling reason to reverse decisions they should change.
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  #97  
Old Posted Jun 18, 2008, 2:18 AM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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Originally Posted by drpgq View Post
I was replying to the previous poster who, it seemed to me, was advocating only paying property taxes for the specific services you receive: "Why should people living in a rural place pay equal taxes to those living in the inner city? Shouldn't your taxes be based on the services you recieve?" I'm not a big fan of this mentality and I guess ideally, I would prefer if a lot of these services (transit and welfare) were funded exclusively by the province. How do you choose which services you should pay for? What if somebody from Flamborough at some point takes a bus in Hamilton?

I can understand someone moving out to Flamborough and feeling that they are leaving the city behind and should no longer have to pay for all its problems. I don't think that is right, and I'm especially not a fan of people trying to arrange boundaries so they pay less taxes. I don't particularly feel a "connection" to Stoney Creek, or Winona for that matter, but I don't go around complaining about my property taxes being used there.

I understand where brett.electrician was coming from with his post, but the fact is that the people in Flamborough are the ones only wanting to pay for what they use.
I don't agree with that sort of set-up since we're living in a society with societal responsibility.
I would love to end area-rating tomorrow. Flamborough people are the ones who want to keep it.
Rural residents are a different story....the McMansions in Greensville and sprawl in Waterdown are getting a free ride in our current set-up. They've paid hardly anything in taxes (compared with similar areas of Hamilton) for 30 years and STILL pay much lower tax than inner city homes. The city is slowly playing catch-up with them and they are acting like it's the end of the world. That's why some of us are laying into them good and hard. They are whiny, little sucks who deserve it.
Who pays all the new Waterdown servicing?? Who takes care of their sick? Who takes their criminals? Who takes their homeless? Whose roads/parking garages do they use when they go to work? Who comes to their rescue in case of an emergency/police call/major fire/accident etc......

No "hatred" towards Flamborough. Just calling them out on the carpet on all their bullcrap. They contribute almost nothing to this city financially. Why should inner city residents subsidize them at an unfair rate? Again, I don't mind people paying into a pool to support society as a whole, but to subsidize people who choose to live in far-flung suburbs because my money is making it artifically cheap is flat out wrong.
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  #98  
Old Posted Jun 18, 2008, 3:05 AM
Millstone Millstone is offline
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Is there really a homeless problem in Flamborough and Waterdown?
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  #99  
Old Posted Jun 18, 2008, 3:12 AM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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no. they all come to Hamilton.
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  #100  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2008, 12:31 AM
brett.electrician brett.electrician is offline
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So, since my first post in this thread, i have spoken to a few long time residents of Hamilton and Flambourgh and employees of the city tax and finance department about the opinions expressed in this thread. From what I've gathered a few people here don't have there facts to straight. From what I've heard prior to amalgamation there was the county of wentworth. The county looked after suchs things as roads, and schools. Each township in wentworth contributed taxes to this. While the rest of the township's expenses were covered by the townships themselves. Thus, Hamilton's taxes did not subsidize Flambourgh or anywhere else for the last 30 years. This leads me to believe there taxes were / are lower there due to the lower capital expenses compared to hamilton. I.E 100+ year old sewer and water system, highways, etc. Secondly and most likely more important from the residents of flambourghs point of view, without amalgamation the city of hamilton would have been bankrupt. Thus amalgamation was implemented to allow the rural areas to subsidize hamilton. So i can see why the residents are upset. Also, many residents of flambourgh feel they have a lot more in common with burlington and the gta the hamilton. They even tried to join them, but was forced to join hamilton due that bankruptcy issue.
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