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  #3881  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:11 PM
Austin1971 Austin1971 is offline
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Future Runway Locations

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  #3882  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freerover View Post
The proposed 9,000 ft 3rd runway on the airport west end and necessary taxiways is between 70-100 million depending on the site plan which is way short of the 900 million he threw out.

Someone on shaggy said airport peeps were talking about a possible 4th runway but I can't imagine where that would go. Maybe at the far eastern side of the complex if they move the TxDot Flight services building. It's just that you have Onion Creek at the south end so you run out of space pretty quickly.

The new maintenance complex being built on the north east side of the complex is going to free up so much space in the center of the grounds. It would be really nice to build a new terminal now next to the current "south" terminal. I guess a burning question is if the Barbara Jordan terminal needs a northern expansion in order to adequately support the traffic is how now even without the piers. You could almost double the length of upper/lower loading decks of Pres. Blvd in front of the terminal. That option still makes practical sense but seems less exciting and could take longer to complete.

I haven't looked at the link Austin1971 posted but will do so in a bit.

I wonder if a 4th runway would be shorter? Maybe used by smaller aircraft like a dedicated runway for them that way the larger runways could be solely used by the larger aircraft.

Okay looks like the PDF has finally loaded so I'll take a look now.
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  #3883  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:46 PM
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Okay am I seeing this right? A possible future runway to the east? Like overlapping where SH130 is??? Would that mean SH130 would be realigned or would it be tunneled under??? This is very fascinating.


Also aren't those projections still off for total passengers flying through ABIA? It could hit 15 million this year not in 2019.
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  #3884  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin1971 View Post
Based on the Evaluation Summary, it looks like the first of any new runway additions will be located 1,200' east of the existing 12,500' runway - and will be 9,500' long.

The second highest ranked option would be to build the first of two new runways 1,200' to the east of the existing 9,000' runway - and be 10,000' in length.
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  #3885  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:53 PM
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Nvm it would be tunneled

Honestly I say go big or go home. Lets plan for the one that has the most potential.
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  #3886  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 7:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILUVSAT View Post
Based on the Evaluation Summary, it looks like the first of any new runway additions will be located 1,200' east of the existing 12,500' runway - and will be 9,500' long.

The second highest ranked option would be to build the first of two new runways 1,200' to the east of the existing 9,000' runway - and be 10,000' in length.
I wonder if they airport authority is looking at having 3 parallel runways that can all take landings at the same time. (Runway Alternative 3)

Probably the easiest option is to build a runway adjacent to the current 17R/35L, (17C/35C) it would not be able to land aircraft the same time as 17R/35L though. (Runway Alternative 2)

Later down the document it said that the current runway infrastructure we have can take 493,000 total air traffic movements and 44.3m annual pax. So they have plenty of time to look at runway alternatives.

In 2017 ABIA saw 199,632 (slightly higher than the Forecast Aircraft Operations (High Case)) total air traffic movements and 13,889,305m pax. We have a long way to go in this regard before capacity is reached.

Looking at the Evaluation Summary, runway alternative 2 scored the highest but would negatively impact future terminal developments.

If anything, all that could possible need to be done to our runways for a long time is add high speed exit taxiways to 17R/35L.
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Last edited by masonh2479; Feb 9, 2018 at 8:09 PM.
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  #3887  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 9:58 PM
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Here is the ViaAir press release for todays announcement.
http://blog.flyviaair.com/via-airlin...ity-and-tulsa/
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  #3888  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 10:21 PM
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THANKS SO MUCH FOR POSTING!

Tunneling a road in south austin huh? Better check for salamanders before Save Our Springs finds out. Environmental report could take a year. Still, really cool!


Quote:
Originally Posted by masonh2479 View Post
Looking at the Evaluation Summary, runway alternative 2 scored the highest but would negatively impact future terminal developments.
That would refer to either elongating the western concourse on the main terminal or the proposals to build a new terminal closer to the entrance of the airport. 2 of the 3 plans for a terminal in that area wouldn't allow a 3rd runway next to the western one. A poster here previously commented that they wouldn't build that option anyway because of how far it would be from the east runway.

I can see them elongated the west side if they also widen it at the same time to add people movers. The east concourse is now going to be considerably wider than the west.
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  #3889  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 10:31 PM
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Did someone say something once about one of the existing runways needing to be closed for repairs for a few months?
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  #3890  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by freerover View Post
Did someone say something once about one of the existing runways needing to be closed for repairs for a few months?
17L for the better part of one year. All I can say is that they better build us a third runway if they plan on doing that because it's going to cause widespread delays in and out of the airport.
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  #3891  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 11:02 PM
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17L for the better part of one year. All I can say is that they better build us a third runway if they plan on doing that because it's going to cause widespread delays in and out of the airport.
When are the repairs due? They must be pretty significant if the runway would be closed for almost a year.
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  #3892  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by masonh2479 View Post
When are the repairs due? They must be pretty significant if the runway would be closed for almost a year.
I haven't seen anything scheduled yet. I've only heard that they were possibly planning on it in 2019. I've seen the diagrams showing the poor conditions of some of the concrete. 17L (majority of it down the center) and taxiway Charlie north of taxiway Romeo are the worst portions.
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  #3893  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2018, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by ATCZERO View Post
I haven't seen anything scheduled yet. I've only heard that they were possibly planning on it in 2019. I've seen the diagrams showing the poor conditions of some of the concrete. 17L (majority of it down the center) and taxiway Charlie north of taxiway Romeo are the worst portions.
I always thought 17R would be the runway to need repairs first, seeing as it was the old runway from back when ABIA was Bergstrom AFB. Is the airport authority trying to have the third runway open before 17L needs repairs.

Do you think 17R35L will get high speed exit taxiways if 17L is going to be repaired without a third runway online?
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  #3894  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 12:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
Honestly I say go big or go home. Lets plan for the one that has the most potential.
Seriously? Pay to purchase and relocate a county prison, purchase and demo over 100 homes, build a 3 mile two lane tunnel for FM 973 and an 8 lane 1 mile tunnel for 130? You wouldn't have any money left over to build the actual runway or terminal or anything else.

The proposal for the two closer (1200') parallel runways would put capacity at more than twice what the high project is for 2037 traffic. That seems more than fine as long as the western runway doesn't hurt you too much with terminal expansion. There is so much other development land though that you shouldn't be desperate for extending the main terminal further west.
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  #3895  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 12:32 AM
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Originally Posted by masonh2479 View Post
I always thought 17R would be the runway to need repairs first, seeing as it was the old runway from back when ABIA was Bergstrom AFB. Is the airport authority trying to have the third runway open before 17L needs repairs.

Do you think 17R35L will get high speed exit taxiways if 17L is going to be repaired without a third runway online?
17R is sturdier. It's built deeper than 17L is, though I forget the specifics. I have yet to see any plans to build a third runway to help with 17L repairs.

High speeds off 17R help only if we run the arrivals tight together. We won't run them tight with one runway because we have to have room for departures. Arrivals will all be 5 miles in trail to allow 1 departure per gap.
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  #3896  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 2:21 AM
freerover freerover is offline
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Originally Posted by ATCZERO View Post
17R is sturdier. It's built deeper than 17L is, though I forget the specifics. I have yet to see any plans to build a third runway to help with 17L repairs.

High speeds off 17R help only if we run the arrivals tight together. We won't run them tight with one runway because we have to have room for departures. Arrivals will all be 5 miles in trail to allow 1 departure per gap.
The only runway that could be possibly be constructed before 2020 is the west runway right next to 17R. It's very straight forward, cheap and has negligible environmental impact.


The others? Tunneling highways under and building runways over FEMA Floodplains? good grief....
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  #3897  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 3:03 AM
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Originally Posted by freerover View Post
The only runway that could be possibly be constructed before 2020 is the west runway right next to 17R. It's very straight forward, cheap and has negligible environmental impact.


The others? Tunneling highways under and building runways over FEMA Floodplains? good grief....
Agreed, building, it doesn't make sense to waste all that money when our current runway system can handle 44m annual pax. IIRC the runway would be 9,000 or 9,500ft. I wonder if this can be extended to get super heavy jets enough room to safely take off.

I wonder if 17L/35R will have to be extended someday as well. Looks like the extension would have to be to the South.
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  #3898  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 9:13 AM
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But it looks sooo cool in the schematics, I'm all for building two additional 10,000 sq runways. If Austin becomes a hub, we will need them.

Man that's our longest runway too that needs repair, it's hard to imagine that they could keep that shut down for a year with only the 9,000 foot one handling increasing traffic. You'd think they would consider building another before starting work on that lovely monster of a runway.

So what exactly does that mean by ViaAir making Austin into one of its "major hubs"? still can't see it being Austin's hometown airline considering their corporate is in Florida. Also are their other major hubs in places like Branson??? If that's the case then I doubt this supposed "major hub" is really going to be much. Frontier seems more like they are about to hub it up though.
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  #3899  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 1:32 PM
ATCZERO ATCZERO is offline
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
But it looks sooo cool in the schematics, I'm all for building two additional 10,000 sq runways. If Austin becomes a hub, we will need them.

Man that's our longest runway too that needs repair, it's hard to imagine that they could keep that shut down for a year with only the 9,000 foot one handling increasing traffic. You'd think they would consider building another before starting work on that lovely monster of a runway.

So what exactly does that mean by ViaAir making Austin into one of its "major hubs"? still can't see it being Austin's hometown airline considering their corporate is in Florida. Also are their other major hubs in places like Branson??? If that's the case then I doubt this supposed "major hub" is really going to be much. Frontier seems more like they are about to hub it up though.
I think you misread a post. 17R is in better condition than 17L.
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  #3900  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2018, 6:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
So what exactly does that mean by ViaAir making Austin into one of its "major hubs"? still can't see it being Austin's hometown airline considering their corporate is in Florida. Also are their other major hubs in places like Branson??? If that's the case then I doubt this supposed "major hub" is really going to be much. Frontier seems more like they are about to hub it up though.
Austin is one of the connection points for ViaAir now, you can book connections through AUS on their website. Here is a quote from a ViaAir press release:

"“Austin is an amazing, fast-growing city. We are thrilled to bring the convenience of direct flights to the markets of Tucson and Oklahoma City as the start of expanded service in the region. We will roll out additional cities throughout next year as we hope to be known as Austin’s hometown airline,” said Matthew Macri, ViaAir’s Vice President of Operations.

ViaAir plans to base crews and maintenance at the Austin-Bergstrom International Airport, positioning its Austin based operations to expand, the carrier reports."

I think there is more to come from ViaAir in 2018, Austin now has the same number of destinations as their Charlotte hub and more than their Branson hub. So Austin already is a major hub in ViaAir's thinking, I don't know how many more cities ViaAir will announce in 2018 but I'll bet that they will announce more for 2018.

All of Frontier's flights added in their recent announcement are seasonal and not daily. I don't know if they are wanting to make AUS a hub, but I would think more flights would need to be year round to be called a hub by Frontier. Right now I think Frontier has Austin as a focus city. There are two focus cities that have more year round flight than AUS, Las Vegas and Orlando(MCO).

As time passes hopefully Frontier makes some of their flights year round, if they do, AUS will likely be their second largest destination after Denver.

Check out this website for an interesting read about Frontier: http://www.anna.aero/2018/02/09/fron...mestic-routes/
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