[Halifax] Nova Centre | 65-58-58 m | 16-15-14 fl | Completed

[coolmillion]

I agree - neat buildings, but I'm not sure the design is right for that location. Imagine the impact of that slab high rise on Argyle st. The herald building seems imposing as it is and it's only 5 storeys. The set back helps a bit, but i think overall it will seem out of context with the surrounding area. It was only a few years ago that the midtown tower was proposed and shot down due to its height. Arguably the impact of these buildings will be greater because of their width. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out. I guess my main complaint is with the location. A site in near the cogswell interchange or near the Sea Port redevelopment would be much better.

[someone123]

I would say that it looks fairly good from an urban design perspective but well behind the times in terms of architecture.

What's the beige wall with "Nova Centre" on it? Precast? The design reminds me of a cheap resort hotel to be honest.

The glass canopy over Grafton Street is I think the best single feature of the proposal. Downtown Halifax needs more sheltered/covered areas, awnings, arcades (not sunk below street level), etc. They add interest and make it more pleasant to be outside.

I don't mind the location, but it seems like the 18 storey tower would look better if it were more slender..?

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by Takeo

It's ok. Nothing spectacular. But better than it could have been. The best part of it is that they are maintaining the street grid. That awning looks a little iffy to me however. Why does it need those skinny columns? Surely you could span that distance without the added supports.

They need something to string the electrical and phone cables on...

Anyway... major points for not creating a super-block... for having retail... and for replacing the bombed out parking lot and it's hideous cousin... the Herald Building. Overall, a good project.

Actually upon further review it reminds me of an updated Scotia Square. Not a good connection.

[Takeo]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Actually upon further review it reminds me of an updated Scotia Square. Not a good connection.

Well... it certainly is big... and tall... but at least it's not creating a super-block... like Scotia Square did. It's also not turning it's back on the street... quite the opposite.

The canopy seems odd to me. A covered street with cars and trucks. I don't know. Seems odd. Better than closing it off though and making the street pedestrian-only. Maybe. Not sure. I think I'd ditch the canopy. Then again... I guess it's all in the execution... and those renderings are really rough.

[someone123]

I don't think it's very comparable to Scotia Square. It has retail fronting onto the street and there are pedestrian paths between blocks. Its footprint is also only about 1/3 as large.

I think it would tie together both ends of Grafton and probably won't hurt Argyle Street. Not sure what would go on Market Street, but it's currently totally dead.

I don't mind that it is farther up the hill. I think it will be a nice addition to the skyline and will tie together the downtown and Spring Garden Road areas a bit.

Hopefully there will be some tweaking.

[Empire]

One of the big questions is how much view is it blocking from the citadel even though HRM by Design rules will apply and major fights at public hearings will be minimized. The Midtown was shot down at 17fl but the HT said they might be able to live with 13fl. The midtown was orientated at 90deg to this building on the same site so less view was blocked of the Georges Island area. The layout does resemble Scotia Sq. with the tower heights similar. I hope the precast can be changed before we add more to our growing precast inventory in HRM. This project will be a major shot in the arm for a downtown in need of a boost.

[sdm]

New convention centre
Proposed $300-million Nova Centre, with 14-storey hotel, 18-storey office tower in downtown Halifax faces heritage challenge
By JUDY MYRDEN Business Reporter
Tue. May 5 - 6:12

Plans are underway by the Nova Scotia government and Halifax to bring a $300-million convention centre development to the downtown core by 2013.

Occupying two city blocks, Nova Centre would consist of the convention centre, a 14-storey hotel and 18-storey office tower, along with retail and residential units. It will have 600 parking spaces and 1.6 million sqaure feet of new construction.

Premier Rodney MacDonald said the city needs a new convention centre to replace the 25-year-old World Trade and Convention Centre.

"Every other province in the country has moved forward on a new convention centre," Mr. MacDonald told reporters Monday after a news conference. ""We are the ones that haven’t. This is going to provide a tremendous boost to the downtown. It’s going to revitalize the downtown."

Mr. MacDonald and Halifax Mayor Peter Kelly signed a memorandum of understanding to work toward making the convention centre a reality. Financial consultant Deloitte has been hired to prepare an independent cost estimate and business plan, and make an application to the federal government for funding.

Last month, the province and the city chose Nova Scotia-based Rank Group, led by developer Joseph Ramia, to build the complex.

Mr. MacDonald said the two levels of government must still work out the financial arrangements and get federal money for the project.

"In order to build this by 2013, we are going to have to see shovels in the ground over the next 12 months," said the premier.

He said a recent study shows that more than 60 international conferences have gone elsewhere with an estimated loss of $65 million in business.

Following financing arrangements, the Rank Group will submit a formal proposal to develop the new facility. It is expected that a report and recommendations regarding the award of a construction contract will be submitted to both governments for a decision by the fall.

Mr. Ramia told reporters after the news conference that he hopes to start putting shovels in the ground before July.

Heritage Trust of Nova Scotia opposes the proposed development and will be speaking against the project at a city council meeting tonight.

At that meeting, the city’s new planning strategy called HRM by Design will be reviewed for approval. If approved, the new convention centre will abide by the new height restrictions.

"The two towers would have a devastating impact on the view of Citadel Hill," said Phil Pacey on Monday.

"They would be higher than the ramparts of the Citadel."

Mr. Pacey said this proposal by Rank Group would block more of the view than the Midtown Tower that was rejected.

Eric Grant and members of his family applied to develop their Midtown Tavern site almost six years ago.

But although the Peninsula community council approved a plan for a 17-storey hotel for the property, heritage groups successfully appealed the decision.

The Midtown, located on the corner of Prince and Grafton streets, has been sold to Mr. Ramia as part of the land for the complex, and Mr. Ramia has extended an invitation for the tavern to be incorporated in the development.

Mr. Grant was on hand for Monday’s announcement and welcomed the proposal.

"It would be very interesting to see what could happen, maybe. At the moment, we’re having a hard time finding something that makes sense to relocate. We’ve been looking. It’s not as easy everyone thinks it is."

( jmyrden@herald.ca)

[steve61]

3 photos from this morning's paper. The first two are a bit redundant; just larger versions of the ones I posted yesterday. The third is a new angle with a street level view of the arch.

[Jonovision]

And time for a tiny rant.....

I'm getting really pissed off by the paper lately. They are horrible at reporting development news. And that makes me think what the hell am I reading on issues that I don't know so much about. First off the hotel is 18 stories and the financial centre is only 14. And the fact that they printed misleading facts from Pacey is not cool at all. These will not affect the rampart views at all. No matter what happens in this city no one will be allowed to build within the View planes or within the ramparts. That will never change. They should really get people who care about these things to do the reporting as oppose to someone who is just jotting down facts and spewing them back out, whether right or wrong. And does it not seem odd to anyone else that there was no story today about HRM By Design going to council?

Market street will become pedestrian only. No vehicles will be underneath that canopy. They were also talking of putting public art or even an ice rink in the middle of the street in the winter time.

I don't think this will have a negative effect on Argyle. Right now I think the Herald building is so imposing because of its long full block without any store fronts. Once you get the convention centre entrance, the hotel entrance, and a store or restaurant or two then this will not feel nearly as overbearing as the Herald building does now. Even with the additional floors on top.

And with regard to a few of the precast comments. I'm praying that a project of this scale and magnitude will not be using precast. The design is still in a very fluid state and no materials have actually been chosen. I'm hoping that they will actually use a quality stone on the facade. Perhaps a nice limestone.

[beyeas]

I think the glass canopy is the most interesting feature by far.
Based upon the photos in the Herald, I would say they are planning on making it pedestrian only (based on the fact that they appear to have a fountain in the middle of the street). I personally feel that that is a great idea. Halifax is distinctly lacking in pedestrian streets/malls. I also like the canopy from the perspective of extending the season a bit given our maritime climate. I have seen this done really well in other places (Japan, California etc) and it can really work well.

[sdm]

[QUOTE=Jonovision;4232810]And time for a tiny rant.....

These will not affect the rampart views at all.


Actually i believe there is some concerns on the rampart views. This is where they won the Midtown appeal.

Furthermore the papers have quoted Ramia as saying it meets HRM by design, which is false and misleading. The project in fact does need to be passed by HRM by design.

[Barrington south]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

And time for a tiny rant.....

I'm getting really pissed off by the paper lately. They are horrible at reporting development news. And that makes me think what the hell am I reading on issues that I don't know so much about. First off the hotel is 18 stories and the financial centre is only 14. And the fact that they printed misleading facts from Pacey is not cool at all. These will not affect the rampart views at all. No matter what happens in this city no one will be allowed to build within the View planes or within the ramparts. That will never change. They should really get people who care about these things to do the reporting as oppose to someone who is just jotting down facts and spewing them back out, whether right or wrong. And does it not seem odd to anyone else that there was no story today about HRM By Design going to council?

Market street will become pedestrian only. No vehicles will be underneath that canopy. They were also talking of putting public art or even an ice rink in the middle of the street in the winter time.

I don't think this will have a negative effect on Argyle. Right now I think the Herald building is so imposing because of its long full block without any store fronts. Once you get the convention centre entrance, the hotel entrance, and a store or restaurant or two then this will not feel nearly as overbearing as the Herald building does now. Even with the additional floors on top.

And with regard to a few of the precast comments. I'm praying that a project of this scale and magnitude will not be using precast. The design is still in a very fluid state and no materials have actually been chosen. I'm hoping that they will actually use a quality stone on the facade. Perhaps a nice limestone.

I agree jono with everything you said ....the skating rink would be a brilliant idea....especially since those douchebags in city hall will not give up their parking spots...


the F***up state of reporting is exactly the reason we need this new development group that wordly is proposing....we need to stand and fight for what we believe in...and we need to be just as vocal as the HT.....I have no qualms with fusion....and am considering joining, but there urban planning elements are not doing the job that needs to be done....I have no doubts that their intentions are good, but it's time to declare war on the enemies of a thriving Halifax

[Barrington south]

Originally Posted by steve61

I just love this aspect of the proposal...and the other retail that is involved....exactly what the core needs...and in fact that's why I favored the cogsewll site...downtown needs retail and residential,not just business.... however, if they think those nice birch tree's are going to get the proper amount of sunlight to live, I have some unfortunate news for them.....

[Barrington south]

[QUOTE=sdm;4233058]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

Actually i believe there is some concerns on the rampart views. This is where they won the Midtown appeal.

Furthermore the papers have quoted Ramia as saying it meets HRM by design, which is false and misleading. The project in fact does need to be passed by HRM by design.

doesn't it fall under the cultural loophole of HBD,and therefore not have to be passed like a traditional development...that's how I understood it, I'm not sure though....ohhh and my arch nemesis....Tim Bousque....hates the cultural loophole and Say's it is large enough to drive a truck through.....so I hope that it does indeed fall under this stipulation, just to piss him off....and no doubt I'll be reading about it next Thursday

[beyeas]

My understanding of the issue of whether this project has automatic approval or not is the following:
All that the amendment proposed by council stated was that HRMbyDesign have its height restrictions relaxed to permit the proposed development. Basically, all it did was alter the allowed height on that site. However, it still much go through the standard HRMbyDesign approval process as spelled out in the document, in the same way that any proposal will go through the new process. That is, as long as it meets the height requirement, it can only judged upon it's design and massing elements etc. In fact, if you read the amendment it explicitly says that the convention centre will have to be submitted to the design panel that is created by HRMbyDesign, and will be judged on materials, massing etc etc etc.

[Dmajackson]

I really hope they do include the skating rink idea in this there aren't any cool winter features downtown right now.

As for the arch I do like it and it does look neat but trees would never survive in there because there's no sunlight and no rainfall.

What might be a cool idea is where the towers step back on the third or so floor it would be neat to open that up to the public somehow (like a garden, cafe, plaza). It would have some cool views to the Harbour.

[Nilan8888]

Interesting...

Just as a cautionary note -- the fall of the provincial government over not wanting to pay down the debt over funding services -- would that potentially have an effect on the timeline to seeing this built? Or are those funds a done deal?

[Takeo]

If there are no cars on that street, I'm okay with the canopy. Could actually be pretty cool. It would be weird to have cars there. It needs some work design-wise... but these are just rough 3D mockups.

[someone123]

They could easily put in irrigation for the trees.

I am tired of this obsession with rampart views, things being as high as the Citadel (this is NOT protected, only views from inside the courtyard from my understanding -- obviously you can see all kinds of modern buildings by looking out over the ramparts), etc. There are viewplanes that already severely restrict what can be built downtown. That is the compromise between development and preservation of views from the Citadel, not viewplanes plus whatever Phil Pacey happens to dislike.

HbD needs a cultural loophole, because from time to time there should be exceptional buildings to make the city more interesting. Again, it is about balance.

Finally this is a major project that looks like it could actually be built sometime soon and move the downtown out of 1986. I really hope this doesn't get messed up.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by Bedford_DJ

I really hope they do include the skating rink idea in this there aren't any cool winter features downtown right now.

As for the arch I do like it and it does look neat but trees would never survive in there because there's no sunlight and no rainfall.

My concern with the arch is that it really does look dark and dingy in there. Maybe the renderings don't do it justice.

What might be a cool idea is where the towers step back on the third or so floor it would be neat to open that up to the public somehow (like a garden, cafe, plaza). It would have some cool views to the Harbour.

Agreed, though in the places where that has been tried (i.e. the Homburg Bldg) it does not seem to be well-done or used properly.