CHICAGO | River Point | 730 FT | 52 FLOORS - Page 46

ChiPhi · #**901** Posted **May 2, 2012, 6:00 PM**

^^
The site also says that the new GSF is 850,000. With that kind of number, development doesn't seem impossible. It seems to me that if what this guy at Hines said is true, then they merely tested the waters with this lowered GSF proposal to show that the size can be cut down. I'd bet that they aren't really pushing this thing (advertising and such) but waiting for the market to improve first.

spyguy · #**902** Posted **May 2, 2012, 6:18 PM**

Just to clarify a few things:

When I say "It's back" that doesn't imply that Hines has signed any tenants, found financing, or that construction is imminent. Just that they've scaled back the proposal in order to position the project to take advantage of any new office demand. In that regards, it's no different than those proposed West Loop econo-boxes or any Buck/Tishman/etc. proposal.

This is consistent with what Hines has said publicly since last summer. For example, here's an excerpt from a December 2011 issue of Bisnow: "Now slated to be 850k SF in 45 stories, the 444 W Lake site will have a 1.5-acre plaza between the building and the Chicago River. Hines' Greg Van Schaack tells us they are concurrently seeking financing and marketing the building to potential tenants."

From Hines' website:River Point will be a state-of-the-art 45-story office tower located in Chicago's West Loop submarket. Designed by Pickard Chilton Architects, the project will offer dramatic world-class architecture, efficient interior design and outstanding views from all of the office floors. The 850,000-square-foot building will provide efficient 26,000-square-foot floorplates allowing maximum space planning flexibility.

Over time, Hines has used that same description but inserted different heights: first 52 stories, then 50, now 45.

Hines property brochure as of 12/31/2011:
RIVER POINT
Chicago, IL
850,000 sq. ft. office building
45 stories

(Side note: that brochure also contains a description of the potential Wolf Point apartment tower - "WOLF POINT WEST Chicago, IL 360,000 sq. ft. apartment complex containing 480 units 46 stories 4-level, 250-car garage Part of Wolf Point development")

And finally, the reason why I even updated this thread is because www.chicagoriverpoint.com was update in early April with a new website design and new renderings that seemed to back up all of the changes.

ChiPhi · #**903** Posted **May 2, 2012, 6:45 PM**

Thanks for killing our buzz Spy Guy... No, I'm just kidding, but thanks for keeping us updated. I think they are just lowering the size to respond to the fact that there is no real interest and that hopefully, eventually, they will hit a point at which a tenant who doesn't want an "econobox" / doesn't want to be in the west loop will sign here seeing construction as nearly as probable as a building only about 2/3 s big. Construction at a tower that is 1.2 million sq feet or bigger will take more than one anchor in this market, so maybe some anchors are shying away from these huge projects expecting the chance of another anchor from signing on to be too small to even bother...

BraveNewWorld · #**904** Posted **May 3, 2012, 3:49 AM**

Chicago office market starting to recover - http://www.rejournals.com/2012/05/02...y-to-continue/

the urban politician · #**905** Posted **May 6, 2012, 8:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiPhi

Thanks for killing our buzz Spy Guy... No, I'm just kidding, but thanks for keeping us updated. I think they are just lowering the size to respond to the fact that there is no real interest and that hopefully, eventually, they will hit a point at which a tenant who doesn't want an "econobox" / doesn't want to be in the west loop will sign here seeing construction as nearly as probable as a building only about 2/3 s big. Construction at a tower that is 1.2 million sq feet or bigger will take more than one anchor in this market, so maybe some anchors are shying away from these huge projects expecting the chance of another anchor from signing on to be too small to even bother...

^ This is not true.

The original proposal signed two large anchor tenants, but the timing was off and the project never obtained financing.

ChiPhi · #**906** Posted **May 6, 2012, 9:01 PM**

^^
That was in a very different economic climate. That was an economy slipping in to recession with many companies frightened, but not panicked. Many companies had not foreseen the banking seizure that killed this project coming. Now we've got a slow recovery with many tenuous and very careful companies afraid to unload any capital or make any commitments without serious assurances of return. There is a reason that class B office buildings have been increasing in value - companies aren't as willing to commit to huge class A space in this capital-dry economy.

SamInTheLoop · #**907** Posted **May 7, 2012, 1:57 PM**

^ In general, it's actually the highest-quality, best-located Class A buildings that have been increasing the most in value - by far...........no new construction yet because of a combination of 1) aggregate demand not being strong enough as of yet to push down overall vacancy to something at least approaching equilibrium-level for this market (we're gradually getting there), and although contiguous large blocks of available space in Class A towers have been steadily shrinking over the last couple years, there are still some out there, and 2) financing for new commercial development that's not build-to-suit is still challenging - it can be done, it just requires terms that are lower risk to the lender than 5-10 years ago.....things like more equity as a percentage of overall project cost, higher pre-leasing, etc....

With that stated, my guess would be that 1-2 office towers will begin construction by the end of 2013.....and of course 444 would be one of the stronger candidates of the 10-12? (I've lost count) reasonably serious proposals that are floating around....

ChiPhi · #**908** Posted **May 7, 2012, 2:25 PM**

^^^
I hope your right. I think that this could be my second favorite building built since the Hancock in Chicago if it gets done. I wonder if this market might give value to the more tested locations (some proposals in the loop, some in the west loop) over what is really the Fulton River District - a place that has seen little to know major office development. Obviously the office has great proximity to transit, but I wonder if the neighborhood might be stigmatizing? I suppose probably not as the place is already being advertised as West Loop...

BraveNewWorld · #**909** Posted **May 7, 2012, 10:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiPhi

^^^
I hope your right. I think that this could be my second favorite building built since the Hancock in Chicago if it gets done. I wonder if this market might give value to the more tested locations (some proposals in the loop, some in the west loop) over what is really the Fulton River District - a place that has seen little to know major office development. Obviously the office has great proximity to transit, but I wonder if the neighborhood might be stigmatizing? I suppose probably not as the place is already being advertised as West Loop...

This would be my favorite building since Trump International too. It's nice to see some 200m proposals in Chicago again. It's also great to see them building in the west loop. I can definitely see this getting built.

Andrew|W · #**910** Posted **May 8, 2012, 12:55 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiPhi

^^^
Sorry to get O/T, but does this mean that the 400 W Randolph proposal by Adrian Smith is dead? It was pretty bland and I tend to like Goettsch better than Smith though (which is strange, but I think that, while Smith may be great programatically, his designs are aesthetically lacking)...

I assume that we are discussing this 400 W Randolph proposal.

Sorry, to be O/T again, but it turns out I was incorrect. GP is actively working on the 400 W Randolph project right now, but the proposed office tower currently has a Riverside address, so I didn't find it last time I looked. Assuming it doesn't change between now and construction, I think you guys will be pleased with the height on this one.

BraveNewWorld · #**911** Posted **May 8, 2012, 1:26 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew|W

Sorry, to be O/T again, but it turns out I was incorrect. GP is actively working on the 400 W Randolph project right now, but the proposed office tower currently has a Riverside address, so I didn't find it last time I looked. Assuming it doesn't change between now and construction, I think you guys will be pleased with the height on this one.

That's awesome, it looks like the building is 200m+. It's great to hear from someone on the inside. Any idea when construction could start ?

Rizzo · #**912** Posted **May 8, 2012, 5:28 AM**

I have to admit though, the discussion in the Chicago threads has been absolutely exhausting lately. It's just gotten so text laden and repetitive. I appreciate the debates and discussion. Seriously there's a lot that can be learned here, but I feel like we've tipped the perfectly balanced scale here in the past month. Unfortunately I haven't been motivated to post construction updates, despite that I photograph nearly every downtown project on a bi-weekly basis. I go out during my lunch break and make rounds and when I get back to the office I'm overwhelmed by some of the trite commentary and just lose interest.

the urban politician · #**913** Posted **May 8, 2012, 5:50 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hayward

I have to admit though, the discussion in the Chicago threads has been absolutely exhausting lately. It's just gotten so text laden and repetitive. I appreciate the debates and discussion. Seriously there's a lot that can be learned here, but I feel like we've tipped the perfectly balanced scale here in the past month. Unfortunately I haven't been motivated to post construction updates, despite that I photograph nearly every downtown project on a bi-weekly basis. I go out during my lunch break and make rounds and when I get back to the office I'm overwhelmed by some of the trite commentary and just lose interest.

^ Well, don't feel that way.

We need photo updates badly. There are just a lot of nasty people who've joined this forum who have nothing better to do than bicker endlessly.

I always appreciate photos and hope you keep posting them!

BraveNewWorld · #**914** Posted **May 8, 2012, 6:02 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ Well, don't feel that way.

We need photo updates badly. There are just a lot of nasty people who've joined this forum who have nothing better to do than bicker endlessly.

I always appreciate photos and hope you keep posting them!

Same with me, would love to see some updates.

Steely Dan · #**915** Posted **May 8, 2012, 2:01 PM**

*posts deleted*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hayward

I have to admit though, the discussion in the Chicago threads has been absolutely exhausting lately. It's just gotten so text laden and repetitive. I appreciate the debates and discussion. Seriously there's a lot that can be learned here, but I feel like we've tipped the perfectly balanced scale here in the past month. Unfortunately I haven't been motivated to post construction updates, despite that I photograph nearly every downtown project on a bi-weekly basis. I go out during my lunch break and make rounds and when I get back to the office I'm overwhelmed by some of the trite commentary and just lose interest.

hayward, it's construction pics that could help get more constructive discussion going in the project threads and help keep the morons from their incessant, asinine, petty bickering. please post whatever construction pics you've got. PLEASE!

ardecila · #**916** Posted **May 9, 2012, 7:44 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

hayward, it's construction pics that could help get more constructive discussion going in the project threads and help keep the morons from their incessant, asinine, petty bickering. please post whatever construction pics you've got. PLEASE!

+1

Since I'm not in the city, I love to see updates whenever possible.

Chicago_Forever · #**917** Posted **May 16, 2012, 12:47 AM**

According to Crains Chicago, Financing is in place and Hines is preparing to break ground.

Hines set to kick off 45-story office tower

By: Ryan OriMay 15, 2012

A rendering of the planned River Point tower on the Chicago River. Design and tower rendering: Pickard Chilton. Photography and context rendering: ImageFiction

(Crain's) — Hines Interests L.P. is preparing to break ground on a 45-story office tower on Chicago River without lining up tenants in advance, the first so-called spec office development in downtown Chicago in 14 years.

Read more: http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.co...#ixzz1uzR0rjGP
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Buckman821 · #**918** Posted **May 16, 2012, 12:56 AM**

Whaaaat? This calls for one thing...

I have a feeling this bet will pay off for them, once construction is underway they will have a major leg up on landing some of those prize tenants looking for big spaces. Likewise I would imagine the odds just got a little longer on some of the other cool office renderings we saw over the last week.

BraveNewWorld · #**919** Posted **May 16, 2012, 1:22 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckman821

Whaaaat? This calls for one thing...

Time to Celebrate! First skyscraper(200m) in Chicago since Trump International Tower finished!

and the design of this is why I love it, it has beautiful architecture.

Kngkyle · #**920** Posted **May 16, 2012, 1:39 AM**

Surprised, financing with no tenets.

A mod should update the first post with the most recent renders.