What makes the Mid-Atlantic, New England and the Southeast different from each other?

[jd3189]

I guess the answer may be obvious, but I am curious what you guys might think.


For more insight for those who aren't familiar, the Mid-Atlantic States includes New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, Washington DC, Virginia, and West Virginia.


New England includes Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire.


The Southeast includes Florida, Georgia, North and South Carolina, and usually Virginia, Delaware, West Virginia, and DC.

[Shawn]

New Englanders are about as direct and blunt as you can get in the English speaking world. The Tri-State region of the Mid Atlantic is slightly less blunt, but still moreso than the rest of the country. We're also the most sarcastic and we love biting humor which puts "big shots in their place." This is why at any given moment half the SNL staff is from New England, both cast members and writers. We hate small talk. This comes across as rude to a lot of people outside of the region. I can see that. But it's usually not the intent.

New Englanders are the least religious people in the country. Conversely, we are the most culturally catholic in the country (lower-case used on purpose).

New Englanders frequently think of themselves as New Englanders first. Even before the state they're from. I personally think of New Hampshire, Coastal Maine, Rhode Island, Mass, the non-Fairfield Co parts of CT, and southern Vermont as one continuous cultural entity. I am a New Englander first, a Masshole second, and an American third. I really love New England.

New Englanders (along with Louisianans) are generally Francophones, which is at a sharp contrast with the rest of the country.

New Englanders have always put a massive emphasis on education. Puritan roots and all. Mark Twain's famous quote sums it up well: "In Boston they ask, how much does he know? In New York, how much is he worth? In Philadelphia, who were his parents?”

New Englanders are understated. We think flashy signs of wealth are embarrassing and an indication of a poor upbringing. Rich New Englanders don't flaunt their wealth - that's a California thing.

Also, "Yankee thrift" is a real thing. I had this message beaten into my head, over and over as a kid and into adulthood: never, ever pay full price for anything. Even if you're part of the rich I mention above.

New England is also super-white. And it's not even very diverse among the white population. If you're a white New Englander not living on the coast, you're either Irish, English, French, or a combo of the three. If you live on the coast, you're either Irish, Italian, Portuguese, or a combo of the three. Regardless, you're going to CCD every Saturday from the age of 8 through 16. Even though your parents don't believe in any of it.

Finally, a large Dunkin iced, extra-extra. In February. It's par for course.

[north 42]

Originally Posted by jd3189

I guess the answer may be obvious, but I am curious what you guys might think.


For more insight for those who aren't familiar, the Mid-Atlantic States includes New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, Washington DC, Virginia, and West Virginia.


New England includes Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire.


The Southeast includes Florida, Georgia, North and South Carolina, and usually Virginia, Delaware, West Virginia, and DC.

No Alabama, Mississippi, Arkansas, Louisiana, Tennessee or Kentucky in the Southeast?

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Shawn

New Englanders are about as direct and blunt as you can get in the English speaking world. The Tri-State region of the Mid Atlantic is slightly less blunt, but still moreso than the rest of the country. We're also the most sarcastic and we love biting humor which puts "big shots in their place." This is why at any given moment half the SNL staff is from New England, both cast members and writers. We hate small talk. This comes across as rude to a lot of people outside of the region. I can see that. But it's usually not the intent.

New Englanders are the least religious people in the country. Conversely, we are the most culturally catholic in the country (lower-case used on purpose).

New Englanders frequently think of themselves as New Englanders first. Even before the state they're from. I personally think of New Hampshire, Coastal Maine, Rhode Island, Mass, the non-Fairfield Co parts of CT, and southern Vermont as one continuous cultural entity. I am a New Englander first, a Masshole second, and an American third. I really love New England.

New Englanders (along with Louisianans) are generally Francophones, which is at a sharp contrast with the rest of the country.

New Englanders have always put a massive emphasis on education. Puritan roots and all. Mark Twain's famous quote sums it up well: "In Boston they ask, how much does he know? In New York, how much is he worth? In Philadelphia, who were his parents?”

New Englanders are understated. We think flashy signs of wealth are embarrassing and an indication of a poor upbringing. Rich New Englanders don't flaunt their wealth - that's a California thing.

Also, "Yankee thrift" is a real thing. I had this message beaten into my head, over and over as a kid and into adulthood: never, ever pay full price for anything. Even if you're part of the rich I mention above.

New England is also super-white. And it's not even very diverse among the white population. If you're a white New Englander not living on the coast, you're either Irish, English, French, or a combo of the three. If you live on the coast, you're either Irish, Italian, Portuguese, or a combo of the three. Regardless, you're going to CCD every Saturday from the age of 8 through 16. Even though your parents don't believe in any of it.

Finally, a large Dunkin iced, extra-extra. In February. It's par for course.

This was a good read, thanks. I love these regional cultural identity descriptions.

Sounds right on for New England to me... and since it's coming from a native New Englander, I'll take your word for it.

Having grown up in Pennsylvania, a lot of the characteristics you mention are apt descriptions for PA and NY as well, with differences of course.

Sarcasm is so natural, I wouldn't know any other way. When I moved to other parts of the country, people didn't know how to take me at first... not understanding if I was serious. Cultural catholicism is also deeply ingrained... so non-religious, but ever so catholic... I hated CCD. The understated, non-flashiness also fits the bill... William Penn Quaker values permeate.

Differences... non-Francophone, not super-white, keep the Irish and Italian but swap Englilsh/French for Polish/Slavic, not a strong "Pennsylvanian" or regional "mid-Atlantic" regional association at all... the state is just too big in comparison and NYC/Jersey are their own thing entirely, and definitely not the Dunkin part (I imagine that's only because it's a Mass. company).

[JManc]

New England as a region has a strong identity and somewhat of a common history but differences do vary between northern NE and southern NE. Burlington VT is worlds away from Newport RI. They also inflicted Belichick onto the world. The Mid-Atlantic has a less cohesive identity as New York State has parts in common with the Midwest/ Great Lakes, lower Mid-Atlantic and New England. States like DE and MD as well as DC have a southern flair about them.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by north 42

No Alabama, Mississippi, Arkansas, Louisiana, Tennessee or Kentucky in the Southeast?

No way.

Alabama and eastern TN are the closest to fitting in the "southeast" description due to location, but they're more Deep South along with MS, LA, parts of AR and TN. Western TN and eastern AR fit in with the Deep South, but they're more transition zone states.

Kentucky is more Appalachian and Midwestern with a touch of Southern, than Southern really.

[Docere]

There also seem to be two "Mid-Atlantics": the Census subregion (NY/NJ/PA) and the "unofficial" one (DC/MD/VA). It's the latter that seems to actually identify with the term Mid-Atlantic more (more use on businesses etc.), I'm guessing most people in the former would just say they live in the Northeast.

[Centropolis]

Originally Posted by Shawn

New Englanders are about as direct and blunt as you can get in the English speaking world. The Tri-State region of the Mid Atlantic is slightly less blunt, but still moreso than the rest of the country. We're also the most sarcastic and we love biting humor which puts "big shots in their place." This is why at any given moment half the SNL staff is from New England, both cast members and writers. We hate small talk. This comes across as rude to a lot of people outside of the region. I can see that. But it's usually not the intent.

New Englanders are the least religious people in the country. Conversely, we are the most culturally catholic in the country (lower-case used on purpose).

New Englanders frequently think of themselves as New Englanders first. Even before the state they're from. I personally think of New Hampshire, Coastal Maine, Rhode Island, Mass, the non-Fairfield Co parts of CT, and southern Vermont as one continuous cultural entity. I am a New Englander first, a Masshole second, and an American third. I really love New England.

New Englanders (along with Louisianans) are generally Francophones, which is at a sharp contrast with the rest of the country.

New Englanders have always put a massive emphasis on education. Puritan roots and all. Mark Twain's famous quote sums it up well: "In Boston they ask, how much does he know? In New York, how much is he worth? In Philadelphia, who were his parents?”

New Englanders are understated. We think flashy signs of wealth are embarrassing and an indication of a poor upbringing. Rich New Englanders don't flaunt their wealth - that's a California thing.

Also, "Yankee thrift" is a real thing. I had this message beaten into my head, over and over as a kid and into adulthood: never, ever pay full price for anything. Even if you're part of the rich I mention above.

New England is also super-white. And it's not even very diverse among the white population. If you're a white New Englander not living on the coast, you're either Irish, English, French, or a combo of the three. If you live on the coast, you're either Irish, Italian, Portuguese, or a combo of the three. Regardless, you're going to CCD every Saturday from the age of 8 through 16. Even though your parents don't believe in any of it.

Finally, a large Dunkin iced, extra-extra. In February. It's par for course.

great read, except have a question/comment for the highlighted part. i know lousiana better than new england, and louisiana is not generally francophone. i must say, i'm surprised to hear that new england is generally francophone! i wasn't aware of that...

[Centropolis]

Originally Posted by pj3000

No way.

Alabama and eastern TN are the closest to fitting in the "southeast" description due to location, but they're more Deep South along with MS, LA, parts of AR and TN. Western TN and eastern AR fit in with the Deep South, but they're more transition zone states.

Kentucky is more Appalachian and Midwestern with a touch of Southern, than Southern really.

kentucky is kentucky is kentucky. hard to characterize but it's also sort of like missouri in that different portions reflect to an extent the nature of adjacent states with the exception of the bluegrass "soul" of the state centered around lexington and louisville which is old enough and interesting enough to be it's own thing.

i probably shouldnt have even said that, though, and stuck with kentucky is kentucky, but with three flavors, western, bluegrass, and appalachian (and the northern half-region).

[JManc]

Originally Posted by Centropolis

great read, except have a question/comment for the highlighted part. i know lousiana better than new england, and louisiana is not generally francophone. i must say, i'm surprised to hear that new england is generally francophone! i wasn't aware of that...

News to me as well. I never knew that area to go out of its way to be bilingual unless its was already part of the cultural fabric; northern Vermont, New Hampshire or even New York where they all border Quebec and are within an hour or so from Montreal.

As for Louisiana, it all but lost it's bilingualism that's why there is an initiative to reintroduce French back into schools and integrate it back into greater southern LA culture. That's still a weird ass state. I went to Japan one year and had to go to Louisiana and month so after that...the latter felt more alien than Japan despite being a 3-hour drive away.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by Docere

There also seem to be two "Mid-Atlantics": the Census subregion (NY/NJ/PA) and the "unofficial" one (DC/MD/VA). It's the latter that seems to actually identify with the term Mid-Atlantic more (more use on businesses etc.), I'm guessing most people in the former would just say they live in the Northeast.

To my experience (growing up in Maryland, spending time in school in North Carolina), the cultural dividing line between the "Mid-Atlantic" and "Southeast" is somewhere in north central Virginia between Richmond and DC. Richmond was the capital of the Confederacy after all and most old-time Virginians feel themselves "southerners" but the more recently arrived DC commuters living in far northern VA identify more with the DC/Maryland axis than with the rest of Virginia. When one gets well south of Richmond, culturally there's very little difference between southern VA and North Carolina.

And then there's Maryland. Once again the influence of DC and its attraction of people from elsewhere has really changed things. When I was a child, the DC suburbs extended 5 or 10 miles into Maryland and that was it. Southern Maryland--the part south of DC but west of the Chesapeake--was still quite culturally southern, again like southern VA and North Carolina. The main industry was even tobacco farming. But now it's gone pretty much suburban from what I hear (haven't been back there in a long time). And the DelMarVa Peninsula was then all chicken farms, vegetable crops and, along the Chesapeake, seafood-related industry (commercial and sport) as well as large swaths of wildlife refuge.

Most interestingly, then (late 1950s, early 1960s) the enclaves of little-changed Elizabethanism remained (I hope they still do but I wouldn't know):

• Video Link

[pj3000]

^ It's an island of Trump lovers. And it will likely be underwater relatively soon.

[Sun Belt]

Originally Posted by jd3189

I guess the answer may be obvious, but I am curious what you guys might think.


For more insight for those who aren't familiar, the Mid-Atlantic States includes New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, Washington DC, Virginia, and West Virginia.

The states I bolded, you have placed in two regions.

Originally Posted by jd3189

New England includes Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire.

Ok. NE is a small region in comparison to the Southeast.

Originally Posted by jd3189

The Southeast includes Florida, Georgia, North and South Carolina, and usually Virginia, Delaware, West Virginia, and DC.

Delaware and West Virginia are not apart of the Southeast, IMO and D.C. is on the extreme fringe of the southeast, but is definitely a mid-Atlantic city.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by pj3000

^ It's an island of Trump lovers. And it will likely be underwater relatively soon.

It's pretty sad that people have to inject politics into everything and worse that they would sound happy about the tragic loss of a cultural treasure.

[Citylover94]

New England is not generally Francophone per se but it is one of the most likely languages for someone to speak other than english especially in Northern New England. In Southern New England Spanish is the most common. There are also very strong ties in New England to the Canadian Maritimes and to Quebec to a degree that does not seem common in other regions near Canada with ties dating back hundreds of years.

With Spanish included


Without Spanish included

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

It's pretty sad that people have to inject politics into everything and worse that they would sound happy about the tragic loss of a cultural treasure.

Please, save the righteousness... and I'm not sure where you're getting the "sound happy" translation from.

It was in response to your... "enclaves of little-changed Elizabethanism remained (I hope they still do but I wouldn't know)".

Tangier Island was in the national news last summer -- specifically about how 90% of its population voted for Trump and are all seemingly in denial of sea level rise, even as their land is disappearing into the ocean. The mayor (named "Ooker") even famously questioned Al Gore last summer on climate change/sea level rise... stating that "he just doesn't see it (meaning sea level rise)... he just sees his island eroding into the sea". Gore was classy enough not to point out the mayor's yokel ignorance on national television.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...801-story.html

http://www.earthisland.org/journal/i.../washing_away/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.79e0f8b868ed


Residents of Republican-dominated US island refuse to acknowledge climate change despite rising sea level
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a8016566.html


Tangier Island is one of the last two inhabited offshore islands in Chesapeake Bay. Residents, many of whom do not believe in human caused climate change, are fighting for survival as flooding becomes more and more common.

[JManc]

You have to consider the population you're dealing with. Tangier Island is an isolated population (hence their ability to retain that accent) with low levels of formal education so they're not going to have so have the most sophisticated views on the world but we should try to avoid politics in this subforum.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by JManc

You have to consider the population you're dealing with. Tangier Island is an isolated population (hence their ability to retain that accent) with low levels of formal education so they're not going to have so have the most sophisticated views on the world but we should try to avoid politics in this subforum.

They are also hard working, honest watermen for the most part. They do have electronic media access (TV and radio) of course so they have the ability to get all the information anybody else does if they want it. Unfortunately, the same technology that is giving them this information is probably also homogenizing their culture with the rest of the area on the DelMarVa which is, itself, getting heavily influenced by nearby metros (DC, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Norfolk, Wilmington).

It is actually the sneering disdain for people like these from the urban elites that brought populist candidates into existence and maintains them.

[Shawn]

Sorry guys, I meant “Francophile”, not “Francophone.” You’ll get French-speaking families in Maine along the border, but not down by the coast.

[Docere]

^ Well, you'd never see an ad like this run in New England:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuzu6iS036Q