HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > Buildings & Architecture


40 Wall Street - The Trump Building in the SkyscraperPage Database

Building Data Page   • Comparison Diagram   • New York Skyscraper Diagram

Map Location
New York Projects & Construction Forum

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #1  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 11:47 PM
Pedestrian's Avatar
Pedestrian Pedestrian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 24,177
Trump plans executive order requiring federal buildings built in Classical style

Quote:
By Myron Magnet
Feb. 6, 2020 6:53 pm ET

‘Making Federal Buildings Beautiful Again,” a new executive order planned by the Trump administration, would thrill lifelong amateur architects George Washington and Thomas Jefferson. These Founders—who designed Mount Vernon, Monticello and the Virginia State Capitol—wanted the new nation’s public buildings to embody its ideals of self-governance, rooted in Greek democracy and Roman republicanism. They would surely applaud President Trump’s proposed order to build new federal buildings in the classical style . . . .

Modernist buildings, the expression of a mechanical, anonymous vision of a social leviathan that individuals are born to serve, might as well be designed by machines. In this computer age, they largely are.

What’s more, they are ugly. The Pritzker Prize in architecture, like the Nobel Peace Prize, almost guarantees the honoree will be the Yasser Arafat of architecture, the very opposite of what the prize claims to honor. Consider Pritzker winner Thom Mayne’s contribution to America’s national patrimony. His San Francisco Federal Building resembles a cyclops mated with a prison. The building is so hideously antisocial that, like Boston’s brutalist concrete City Hall, the homeless camp there permanently.

Of course the modernist establishment has already slammed the proposed executive order, which overturns the General Services Administration’s design excellence program, long a full-employment scheme for modernist architects. The debate now, says an arts critic in the Guardian, is between “those who trust architects and professionals to design whatever they think is best, and those who seek to control what they do.”
https://www.wsj.com/articles/drain-t...nion_lead_pos8
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 3:04 AM
nomarandlee's Avatar
nomarandlee nomarandlee is offline
My Mind Has Left My Body
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,328
Just flipped on Tucker Carlson for a half-minute and saw him talking about this. It was predictably cringe-worthy analysis and supportive of this Trump edict.

This is of course in no way surprising. Conservative minded people tend to over-romanize history and look to harken back to the mythologized past instead of the risking of a better future and innovation. And the real psychotic low-imagination ones will even outlaw all but singular forms of art/architecture not unlike what a few 1930's European regimes did.

The most ironic element regarding this issue is again the blatant hypocrisy of these federal officials and small clique of self-appointed art critics claiming that other "architectural elites" are ruining the country with these modernist buildings and that it is they can best decide what is good art/design (Grecco-Roman is their one and only) as opposed to local officials and the actual designers. So much again for the charade of an intrusive big government.

If these advocates wanted meaningful change to our cityscapes then pushing for guidelines that actually make more pleasant communities in regards to transit, walkability, livability, efficiency, community cohesion these bureaucrats think that good design means plopping a few more dozen, likely mediocre, Greek-Roman fakes around the country, of which is one style that is aplenty already in this country.

Last edited by nomarandlee; Feb 8, 2020 at 8:54 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 6:45 AM
Amanita's Avatar
Amanita Amanita is offline
Crane Goddess
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,228
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomarandlee View Post
Just flipped on Tucker Carlson for a half-minute and saw him talking about this. It was predictably cringe-worthy analysis and supportive of this Trump edict.

This is of course in no way surprising. Conservative minded people tend to over-romanize history and look to harken back to the mythologized past instead of the risking of a better future. And the real psychotic low-imagination ones will even outlaw all but singular forms of art/architecture not unlike what a few 1930's European regimes did.

The oh so ironic element regarding this issue is again the blatant hypocrisy of these federal officials claiming that "architectural elites" are ruining the country with these modernist buildings and that it is they who know what best is good art/design (Grecco-Roman) as opposed to local officials and the actual designers. So much again or the charade of hating big government.

Instead of actually pushing for guidelines that actually make more pleasant communities in regards to transit, walkability, livability, efficiency, social cohesion these clowns think that good designs means plopping a few more dozen, likely mediocre, Greek-Roman fakes around the country of which is one style that is aplenty already in this country.
So much this. Not only is this eerily reminiscent of some seriously fucked up past regimes, it's also painfully Eurocentric. I've seen some alt-right types who hate modern architecture, I'm sure they will love this. All the more reason to dump it.
__________________
"Build me to the heavens, and Life never stops"
"Live as if the world were as it should be, to show it what it can be"
-Angel
"Prayers are fleeting and wars are forgotten, but what is built endures"
-Ambassador DeLenn, Babylon 5
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #4  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 8:28 AM
Pedestrian's Avatar
Pedestrian Pedestrian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 24,177
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomarandlee View Post
Just flipped on Tucker Carlson for a half-minute and saw him talking about this. It was predictably cringe-worthy analysis and supportive of this Trump edict.
I read this in the Journal--it was an Op-Ed, not necessarily reflecting the paper's editorial opinion--a few hours before Tucker comes on the air, but I saw his piece nevertheless and you've got to admit the examples he showed of recent federal buildings were hideous.

Actually, Thom Mayne's San Francisco building is much more interesting and creative than what Tucker showed--they did all look like something from North Korea or, since North Korea sometimes puts up something interesting like that giant conical hotel, worse: Just quadrangular blockhouses.

In general, a program by the feds to foster beautiful architecture--not necessarily classic--seems like a very good idea but it's amazing how badly they have failed to do that (build attractive buildings). So I support Trump's idea just because the average Greek temple is far more attractive than the typical Communist prison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanita View Post
So much this. Not only is this eerily reminiscent of some seriously fucked up past regimes, it's also painfully Eurocentric. I've seen some alt-right types who hate modern architecture, I'm sure they will love this. All the more reason to dump it.
To suggest that some of these buildings represent any non-European culture is to demean that culture. Seriously. Look around the world at so many US embassies. They are designed to be fortresses but the problem is they mostly look like it.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #5  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 9:00 AM
Hed Kandi's Avatar
Hed Kandi Hed Kandi is offline
+
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,092
..

Last edited by Hed Kandi; Oct 4, 2022 at 4:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 1:00 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is offline
cle/west village/shaolin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,530
if trump proposed this obviously we should do what we aways do with trump, ignore it or do the opposite.

he have to run up more debt, his specialty, to pay for fancier fed buildings. oh wait mexico will pay for it, huh.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #7  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 4:29 PM
HomeInMyShoes's Avatar
HomeInMyShoes HomeInMyShoes is offline
arf
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: File 13
Posts: 13,984
As long as there's lots of gold and endangered animal furs inside it will be great.
__________________

-- “We heal each other with kindness, gentleness and respect.” -- Richard Wagamese
-- “Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.” -- Dr. Seuss
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #8  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 4:39 PM
Rooted Arborial Rooted Arborial is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 106
Vain deception has a long history in the most prominent architecture in Washington, D.C. The most fascistic celebration in this pompous tradition is probably

the capitol building - where the militaristic roman symbols are used to frame a great deal of cloyingly bad art and to try provide an air of righteousness to

politicians who regularly use misrepresentations for personal gain. It is a glorified sausage factory and its products are largely composed of ingredients which

have grossly debilitating effects around the planet. The Trump scam is a desperately greedy attempt at ignoring reality in order to suck the life out of any

possible attempts at social responsibility and it is also largely bipartisan. When modernism was endorsed for government buildings, it was also mainly a

tool whereby the sausage factory could try to brainwash its subjects into believing they were the "exceptional" people among all of the people on the

planet.

"American" vanity should never be underestimated and Trump's desire for fascist control over building design is reflected all over the mall.

I wouldn't be surprised to hear that he might want to bulldoze the Vietnam memorial. It is the only monument which even hints at the truth. Of course, it

also ignores the millions of poor Vietnamese who were slaughtered under the long-standing fascist corporatism which is widespread in architectural

disdain for socially and environmentally responsible behavior.

Maybe Trump can put a dome in the center of the pentagon because that building is the central cathedral and every year it gets greater and greater

funding for its "huge"ly wasteful effects.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #9  
Old Posted Nov 13, 2020, 8:12 PM
whatnext whatnext is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 21,995
Trump is going, but it looks like his dislike of modern architecture has permeated the GSA:

Trump’s Defeat Didn’t Stop His ‘Ban’ on Modern Architecture
The president never signed a controversial “Making Federal Buildings Beautiful Again” executive order. But a neoclassical-only building mandate is still happening.
By Kriston Capps
November 12, 2020

Back in August, the General Services Administration posted a solicitation for a $125 million federal courthouse set to be built in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. The language in the document included a telling requirement for the structure’s future architects: “Classical architectural style shall be the preferred and default style absent special extenuating factors necessitating another style.”

That language appeared verbatim in “Making Federal Buildings Beautiful Again,” a draft executive order that circulated in February. The mandate from the White House would have made classical architecture the house style for the federal government.

A similar decree appeared in an earlier GSA solicitation for an $86 million federal courthouse in Huntsville, Alabama. The bid, which was awarded back in 2019, is even more specific about the Trump administration’s vision: “GSA intends that the design of the new courthouse be neoclassical/greek revival in style, in keeping with other recent Federal courthouses in the State of Alabama.”

President Donald Trump never signed that executive order, which would have banned modernist designs for new federal buildings. After a spate of outrage — it was roundly condemned by the American Institute of Architects, the National Trust for Historic Preservation, the dean of architecture at the famously traditional University of Notre Dame and at least 11,000 architects who wrote to the White House — the order faded....


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...&sref=x4rjnz06
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #10  
Old Posted Nov 14, 2020, 1:47 PM
Jawnadelphia's Avatar
Jawnadelphia Jawnadelphia is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Wilmington, Delaware
Posts: 2,797
As a bit of a Joe Biden expert (I grew up in Wilmington, DE), I would not be surprised if Joe issued his own Executive Order to overturn anything Trump would do on this issue. While Joe is an old-fashioned guy, who loves older, colonial style homes and chateaus, he also loves Ray Ban aviators and his 1967 Corvette Stringray ... prime examples of mid-century mod coolness. I really think Joe returns a lot of things to normal.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Nov 14, 2020, 2:32 PM
caldor120la caldor120la is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 122
jawnadelphia: you know nothing about biden, DE, RayBans or Stingrays. Your a fake just like he has been for over forty years.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #12  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 2:50 PM
Duffstuff129's Avatar
Duffstuff129 Duffstuff129 is offline
Charismatic Stallion
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Manhattan
Posts: 579
I can't help but like a decision like this - I think if we are all being honest, we could imagine that voters, in whose hands the decision should more or less be made, would prefer classical architecture for their federal buildings over any other style.

I do think that in some ways the supremacy of modern architecture, which has never been as popular with the public as classical styles, is in its own way undemocratic - modern architecture is obviously fashionable among architects, but the voting, tax-paying public seems not to prefer it. One can look at a list of America's favorite buildings as voted by the average person - they are mostly at least as ornate as Art Deco and many of them are, indeed, classically-styled.

For the same reason that people decry suburbs, which seem to have no historical sense and favor (perceived) convenience over urban forms that had greater roots in the past, maybe there is a reason to consciously reject, even somewhat arbitrarily, modern styles that consciously divorce themselves from history.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 2:59 PM
harryc's Avatar
harryc harryc is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Oak Park, Il
Posts: 14,989
There is a place - and a time - for brutalism.



And a place for modernism.




And what was once modern -and is now truly Amerircan.

(although this is township - any Prairie School federal buildings ? )

almost as if this is a diverse country made up of - and constantly incorporating - other cultures.
__________________
Harry C - Urbanize Chicago- My Flickr stream HRC_OakPark
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. B Franklin.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #14  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 3:40 PM
PersonOfInterest PersonOfInterest is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 65
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #15  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2020, 7:11 PM
Hudson11's Avatar
Hudson11 Hudson11 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,034
This news led to an early Christmas gift of architectural discussion trending on social media.

https://www.architecturalrecord.com/...eral-buildings

Trump Signs Executive Order Promoting Classical Architecture for Federal Buildings

Quote:
Notably, the recently signed order only mandates classical architecture as "the preferred and default architecture for Federal public buildings" in Washington, D.C., "absent exceptional factors necessitating another kind of architecture." But it creates new guidelines for all Federal buildings, and an approvals mechanism that sidelines the General Services Administration’s Design Excellence program.
__________________
click here too see hunser's list of the many supertall skyscrapers of New York City!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #16  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2020, 5:20 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is offline
cle/west village/shaolin
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,530
well the question of style demands is on the low end as much as on any major structure.

if it demands the classical style over low grade cheap garbage then ok.

if it prevents expression and modernism, then no.

seems like its ok to make a pitch for something modern, but if a conservative/fascist leaning gov is in power like trump's, it would probably get denied.

so i am thinking of the new/modern federal courthouse building binge of 10 years back that is still ongoing, i wonder where that falls?

it seems be somewhere in the middle with modernized, yet classic echoing designs:


cleveland carl stokes fed courthouse tower




brooklyn fed court




nashville fed courthouse 2021

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #17  
Old Posted Feb 26, 2021, 7:12 PM
geomorph's Avatar
geomorph geomorph is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 3,552
On February 24, 2021, Biden revoked Executive Order 13967, titled 'Promoting Beautiful Federal Civic Architecture.'

Here is an article:

https://www.dezeen.com/2021/02/25/bi...ecutive-order/
Reply With Quote
     
     
End
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > Buildings & Architecture
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 9:32 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.