CHICAGO: ORD & MDW discussion

[sentinel]

If anyone in this forum has any connections with any member of the Chicago Dept of Aviation, I STRONGLY encourage them to plant an idea of a design competition for all of this new work (if it hasn't been considered already). And not just for the new Global terminal, but a master plan for everything, in order to provide a more unified vision, instead of the choppy, piecemeal design of the airport's current configuration.

[ardecila]

It's a shame that the city just plowed hundreds of millions into a top-flight arrival/departure zone with world-class design (Werner Sobek). This renovation is by no means obsolete or outdated, and the minimalist design gels nicely with the original 1960s airport designs by Perkins + Will and CF Murphy and the 1990s additions by Helmut Jahn. It is easily in the top tier of US airport design, but didn't get a lot of recognition due to the small scope (it wasn't a whole terminal) and due to a disputed construction process.

Obviously the terminals need expansion, but IMO the new terminal should only touch the concourses, and leave the arrival/departure area as-is. Would be a good way to save money, too.

[NikolasM]

Strange that they would essentially obliterate T3 and leave such a large space there that could house at least one pier. Maybe they don't want to because it wouldn't line up with the rest of the satellite terminals? Seems like a real lack of vision of what could be done with integrating T5 into the Core.

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by k1052

What the city thinks ORD will eventually look after this and a couple more expansions. The phase 1 items are what the city is going to do now.

YOU FOOL! THIS ISNT EVEN MY FINAL FORM

- O Hare Airport

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

YOU FOOL! THIS ISNT EVEN MY FINAL FORM

- O Hare Airport

Hey, hey, hey! Chill! Be nice!

[nomarandlee]

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/oh...s-one-of-them/

O’Hare Express competition down to two — and Elon Musk is one of them
BUSINESS 03/20/2018, 06:00pm

........He will vie against and O’Hare Xpress LLC, whose power player participants include Meridiam, Antarctica Capital, JLC Infrastructure, Mott MacDonald and First Transit.

Two other teams that responded to the city’s Round One “request for qualifications” (RFQ) were eliminated amid questions about their “ability to deliver the critical project with no public subsidy.”

A “request for proposals” (RFP) will be issued Friday — due back on May 18 — that will determine the winner.

It will permit travel corridors above or below ground and require stations at O’Hare and downtown with the possibility of finally using the empty Block 37 super-station that former Mayor Richard M. Daley spent $200 million to build........

..

[nomarandlee]

Very interesting tidbit while looking through that 2,000 page O'hare guide released last week.

Seems like the eventual idea will be to demolish concourse K/H/L and just have it be a Multiple Aircraft Ramp System (whatever that is).

[Kngkyle]

Between the runway reconfiguration, terminal redevelopment, and O'Hare express train, O'Hare will have received upwards of $20 billion in infrastructure improvements since 2005. That is assuming the express train becomes a reality. (still a bit iffy on that actually happening)

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by nomarandlee

..O’Hare Express competition down to two — and Elon Musk is one of them
BUSINESS 03/20/2018, 06:00pm

I'm not against the idea of the O'Hare Express if funded and managed privately, but I do think it was foolish to limit the field to only one conventional rail proposal. Unless there was something seriously wrong with the other two bidders that were eliminated, I think at least one of those proposals should have been invited to participate in the RFP. Now we will only have one conventional rail proposal, with no way to benchmark its cost, and one gadgetbahn proposal, again with no way to benchmark its cost.

Also, Elon Musk has not yet demonstrated how he plans to bring the cost of tunneling down. So far, all we've seen are suggestions that the tunnel diameter could be reduced, which reduces the size/cost of tunnel-boring machines and reduces the amount of soil that needs removal. The biggest potential savings come from using non-union labor, but that will most definitely be a flashpoint for critics of the project.

[kbud]

Hopefully this whole plan will get approved and the construction can start sooner than later...

I didn't read the whole report. I have a couple of questions:
1) Will the entire C concourse be demolited in the end? I know they are going to get rid of the south portion with the new satellite extension and then they'll continue the construction northward, but will it ever replace all of C? I just assumed they'd do this to help with taxing between B and C, but I didn't see any images with all of C being gone.
2) American's passengers are going to have a longer commute with H/K being destroyed if they have to solely use the satellite terminals and the "stinger" gates. Imagine arriving in the new satellite 2 with a 60 minute connection to a stinger gate?

[rlw777]

O'Hare expansion plan passes another test From Crains

Mayor Rahm Emanuel's huge rebuild of O'Hare International Airport moved closer to official takeoff today, but not before the $8.5 billion plan hit a bit of political and financial turbulence.

The action came when the council's Finance Committee voted to authorize up to $4 billion in bonds to pay for the first two or three years of work, plus a related extension of the field's runway 9R-27L. Earlier, the council's Aviation Committee had approved the rebuilding plan itself, with both measures scheduled to come before and be approved by the full council at its March 28 meeting.

After repeated sharp questioning from Latino and African-American aldermen today about whether minorities will get an adequate slice of one of the biggest projects in city history, the turbulence hit when Ald. Leslie Hairston, 5th, voted "no"—and indicated she would hold to that stance until she receives a list of minority firms that might serve as bond counsel on the debt sale.

[k1052]

So really no major issues, surely will be approved this month by the full city council.

[k1052]

Air New Zealand going to do AKL-ORD 3-5 times a week starting in November.

Quantas possibly/probably to announce directs to Brisbane.

[Steely Dan]

^ crazy!

that's gotta be like a 16 hour flight or something. holy crap.

[Kngkyle]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ crazy!

that's gotta be like a 16 hour flight or something. holy crap.

Yep - around 16 hours. It's about 300 miles further than to Hong Kong.

This will also make ORD the only city in the Western Hemisphere to have non-stop service to all 6 inhabited continents. Houston currently holds that distinction but loses it tomorrow as their scheduled service to Africa ends. Ethiopian and Air New Zealand both starting service will make ORD the only one. Globally only Johannesburg, Doha, Dubai, and London touch all continents. (London only just joined the list this week with LHR-PER starting)

[F1 Tommy]

Those 787-9's are making the amazing possible. By the way, Lufthansa started A350 flights to ORD last week along with the 787 Chicago-London Norwegian Airlines flights.


Here is the list of the top 10 international cities for North America showing international pax only in 2017. Chicago is below their weight class. That will change as they get more long range wide body aircraft and airport improvements online

1. JFK 32.4 million
2. YYZ 29.6 million
3. LAX 24.8 million
4. MIA 21.5 million
5. CUN 15.79 million
6. MEX 15.75 million
7. PTY 15.6 million
8. SFO 13.4 million
9. EWR 12.9 million
10. ORD 12.46 million

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by k1052

So really no major issues, surely will be approved this month by the full city council.

Awesome! I just thinking about this. Hopefully they will be final approved from city council.

Originally Posted by k1052

Air New Zealand going to do AKL-ORD 3-5 times a week starting in November.

Quantas possibly/probably to announce directs to Brisbane.

Wow, great news! I was hoping UA to start ORD-TLV. We shall see what happen.

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ crazy!

that's gotta be like a 16 hour flight or something. holy crap.

Yes, really! It's a very long flight. You will be very extremely tired. You need to do exercise during the flight and you must to do stretched your legs.

[Dracmus]

Actually...LAX, JFK, and Toronto Pearson go to all 6 continents also.

Originally Posted by Kngkyle

Yep - around 16 hours. It's about 300 miles further than to Hong Kong.

This will also make ORD the only city in the Western Hemisphere to have non-stop service to all 6 inhabited continents. Houston currently holds that distinction but loses it tomorrow as their scheduled service to Africa ends. Ethiopian and Air New Zealand both starting service will make ORD the only one. Globally only Johannesburg, Doha, Dubai, and London touch all continents. (London only just joined the list this week with LHR-PER starting)

[Kngkyle]

Originally Posted by Dracmus

Actually...LAX, JFK, and Toronto Pearson go to all 6 continents also.

Nope, LAX is missing Africa. JFK and YYZ are missing Oceania.

[denizen467]

Originally Posted by Dracmus

Actually...LAX, JFK, and Toronto Pearson go to all 6 continents also.

Thing is, the plane has to stay in the air the whole time. Until getting to the continent. Pilot's feet touch the ground, you're out. Like when Qantas's JFK flight refuels at LAX both ways.

Originally Posted by F1 Tommy

Here is the list of the top 10 international cities for North America showing international pax only in 2017. Chicago is below their weight class. That will change as they get more long range wide body aircraft and airport improvements online

1. JFK 32.4 million
2. YYZ 29.6 million
3. LAX 24.8 million
4. MIA 21.5 million
5. CUN 15.79 million
6. MEX 15.75 million
7. PTY 15.6 million
8. SFO 13.4 million
9. EWR 12.9 million
10. ORD 12.46 million

Listing only US cities is fine, but a continent-wide list is basically useless, since probably 99% of all air traffic at PTY is international, for example. Canadian cities also get this artificial steroid effect with their traffic to the US.

Originally Posted by k1052

Air New Zealand going to do AKL-ORD 3-5 times a week starting in November.

Quantas possibly/probably to announce directs to Brisbane.

I thought it would be years until this finally happened. Fantastic.

Originally Posted by Kngkyle

This will also make ORD the only city in the Western Hemisphere to have non-stop service to all 6 inhabited continents. Houston currently holds that distinction but loses it tomorrow as their scheduled service to Africa ends. Ethiopian and Air New Zealand both starting service will make ORD the only one. Globally only Johannesburg, Doha, Dubai, and London touch all continents. (London only just joined the list this week with LHR-PER starting)

Although, it would seem very possible Houston could regain an Africa route soon (maybe even before ORD gets AKL in November), given demand from the greater oil industry. But are there really no South American cities with Asia flights (or at least among cities that also have Europe flights)?