Wpg: Chief Peguis Trail Extension

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by Mininari

Which is why if we ever want to see any major federal investment into roads around here, we need to hope that CentrePort Canada takes off in the coming years and attracts some new manufacturing / transportation companies. That coupled with the various north-south CANAMEXtrade corridors could help the city & Province make the case for federally funded improvements to Hwy 1, 101 and 75 to help support the whole scheme. Federal funding typically gets allocated to things that have a net benefit to the whole economy (especially with our current government), and if we can show a net benefit to the country by building up CentrePort, then we may be eligible for some funding via programs like the Asia-Pacific Gateway Initiative. Example: The South Fraser Perimeter Road and new Pitt River Bridge in the GVRD received federal money under this auspice, both since they are critical pieces of infrastructure that are missing to support the transportation / Port activities on the coast. The SFPR is the missing highway link between Highway 1 / 91 / 99 and Deltaport (unfortunately its not being built as a full freeway now, but is planned to be one day). Point is, the squeaky economic wheel gets the grease, and we need to get ours going before it gets squeaky.

Apparently, some people don't read posts thoroughly, perhaps we should put in more paragraphs.

It's always been about the G R E A S E ! This town has always been this way since people were living in tents. Even Duff Roblin's old man built the 'invisible bridge' back in the 20's. The 'Lege' building was also corrupt politicians trying to make a buck. If I had all the whiskey that was bought by all the construction companies, I could float the Paddle wheel Queen and the Rouge with it.

There is no way that you can compare Vancouver with Winnipeg. The last time they came close was back in 1948. Winnipeggers, in order to survive, have to have hard-core manufacturing done here(period). CANAMEXtrade and CentrePort will do nothing substantial for Winnipeg, except create a few jobs and add some buildings. You need some bricks and mortar, back up with machinery that spins Manitoba raw materials into GOLD.

The focal point of Winnipeg is its geographical position. As I said in other posts, tax the bastards that make use of our services. The roads across this Province should be paid for by all of Canada, because we are the only way across this Country. Every rail car that passes through Winnipeg, should be taxed. We have to build over/under passes to accommodate our surface traffic and the railways. We, the people, have to put up with the inconvenience of the rail lines as they pass through the City and our communities. The Railways constantly tell us that they are moving out, yet, over a hundred years later, they are still here. Make them pay to stay.

[Mininari]

Originally Posted by alittle1

Apparently, some people don't read posts thoroughly, perhaps we should put in more paragraphs.

It's always been about the G R E A S E ! This town has always been this way since people were living in tents. Even Duff Roblin's old man built the 'invisible bridge' back in the 20's. The 'Lege' building was also corrupt politicians trying to make a buck. If I had all the whiskey that was bought by all the construction companies, I could float the Paddle wheel Queen and the Rouge with it.

There is no way that you can compare Vancouver with Winnipeg. The last time they came close was back in 1948. Winnipeggers, in order to survive, have to have hard-core manufacturing done here(period). CANAMEXtrade and CentrePort will do nothing substantial for Winnipeg, except create a few jobs and add some buildings. You need some bricks and mortar, back up with machinery that spins Manitoba raw materials into GOLD.

The focal point of Winnipeg is its geographical position. As I said in other posts, tax the bastards that make use of our services. The roads across this Province should be paid for by all of Canada, because we are the only way across this Country. Every rail car that passes through Winnipeg, should be taxed. We have to build over/under passes to accommodate our surface traffic and the railways. We, the people, have to put up with the inconvenience of the rail lines as they pass through the City and our communities. The Railways constantly tell us that they are moving out, yet, over a hundred years later, they are still here. Make them pay to stay.

Okay. I have only lived here for five years now, and I'm only seeing the most-recent developments / proposals / scandals, etc. Sorry if I don't know the entire history of Winnipeg.

CentrePort Canada and the Foreign Trade Zone that is associated with it have the potential to bring in "hard-core" manufacturing companies, as so you state. Theres no guarantee that the whole thing is going to work, but if it does bring in manufacturing, then it very well could spin out some gold.

From what I understand, this whole "Inland Port" idea has been around since the 70's. Now its finally actually happening, with all levels of government support.

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by Mininari

Okay. I have only lived here for five years now, and I'm only seeing the most-recent developments / proposals / scandals, etc. Sorry if I don't know the entire history of Winnipeg.

CentrePort Canada and the Foreign Trade Zone that is associated with it have the potential to bring in "hard-core" manufacturing companies, as so you state. Theres no guarantee that the whole thing is going to work, but if it does bring in manufacturing, then it very well could spin out some gold.

From what I understand, this whole "Inland Port" idea has been around since the 70's. Now its finally actually happening, with all levels of government support.

You do not have to know the whole history of Wpg, just some of it.

Ask yourself, if its being around since the 70's, why are they just acting on it now?

I hate going off topic in someone else's thread, but the Federal government took more out of Winnipeg, than it ever put back. Because of geographical location, Winnipeg should be paramount in the aviation and transportation business, but the Feds prefer to subsidize Corn grow in Ontario and shipped back as corn flakes to Winnipeg.

[The Jabroni]

Originally Posted by alittle1

You do not have to know the whole history of Wpg, just some of it.

Ask yourself, if its being around since the 70's, why are they just acting on it now?

I hate going off topic in someone else's thread, but the Federal government took more out of Winnipeg, than it ever put back. Because of geographical location, Winnipeg should be paramount in the aviation and transportation business, but the Feds prefer to subsidize Corn grow in Ontario and shipped back as corn flakes to Winnipeg.

If it took them 40 years to finally take action, then whatever we have planned now, with that logic, will take another 40 years to actually happen?

I don't see that as an issue. It seems to be the norm in fact.

[Mininari]

Originally Posted by alittle1

You do not have to know the whole history of Wpg, just some of it.

Ask yourself, if its being around since the 70's, why are they just acting on it now?

I hate going off topic in someone else's thread, but the Federal government took more out of Winnipeg, than it ever put back. Because of geographical location, Winnipeg should be paramount in the aviation and transportation business, but the Feds prefer to subsidize Corn grow in Ontario and shipped back as corn flakes to Winnipeg.

My take on things (prior to my existence on this planet, and during my earlier days) is that our past federal governments have been based out of an Eastern power base. They did what is good for Ontario / Quebec / Atlantic Canada, while the west got screwed. My inlaws, for example, are very bitter about the lack of federal government funding for transportation in the west... e.g. just now struggling to twin more of the Trans-Canada in BC, while Ontario and Quebec have soaked up infrastructure money for a long time. The $2.46B upgrade of Highway 1 and the Port Mann Bridge (also critical elements to the west coast port system) are being paid for 100% through the Province and tolls. No help there. Heck, Quebec City has a comparably over-built freeway system (relative to other Canadian cities) for a city of its size (its quite easy to drive around the metro area there). But infrastructure spending is just a proxy of how the feds have treated the East versus west on many other fronts.

Well, now we have a conservative Majority, whose Prime Minister and roots are from the West. The economy is being shifted westward with the continued rapid development of the energy and resources sectors. This is a priority (given the recent streamlining of environmental regulation, and associated science programs), and with this kind of development, you can expect additional transportation and even manufacturing to come out of it.

Why did they wait for 40 years to *finally* build CentrePort? I don't know, I'm no expert on the topic, but I would be willing to guess that having a federal government whose priorities may favour Western Canada a bit more would be willing to support the program. Further to this, the Province had a rough time during the 80's and 90's (which arguably the feds could have done more about to support manufacturing and the aerospace industries). However, now things seem to be moving forward at a sustainable pace here; the economy is growing at a healthy rate, unemployment is low.

At the end of the day, whats passed is past. What matter is what is happening today, and for the future.

Back to Chief Peguis for a second... are we going to start seeing planning processes start for further extensions of the roadway?

[wpgcityone]

Does anyone know when/if they'll start paving all the pathways around the new extension. They've been putting down gravel the last week or so, including across Lag into Harbour View North. I suspect when they're done that they'll start paving?

Left turn lane on southbound Lag at Grassie will be closed for the next two weeks. Are they adding a second turning lane there to reduce the logjam of traffic?

I'll be at an APEGM luncheon in two weeks where Luis Escobar (the city's Manager of Transportation) will talk about the City of Winnipeg Transportation Master Plan. I wonder if anyone will ask him if he is consulted before city hall makes ad hoc decisions on what to do.

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by wpgcityone

Does anyone know when/if they'll start paving all the pathways around the new extension. They've been putting down gravel the last week or so, including across Lag into Harbour View North. I suspect when they're done that they'll start paving?

Left turn lane on southbound Lag at Grassie will be closed for the next two weeks. Are they adding a second turning lane there to reduce the logjam of traffic?

I'll be at an APEGM luncheon in two weeks where Luis Escobar (the city's Manager of Transportation) will talk about the City of Winnipeg Transportation Master Plan. I wonder if anyone will ask him if he is consulted before city hall makes ad hoc decisions on what to do.

If the City is building more bike paths, that just tells me that they will be raising taxes again and you will be peddling your bike and your ass for the next couple of years to make ends meet.

Putting a second turning lane in, still isn't going to help. What they need is a 'flipper button' like on a pinball machine; those cars that start up using the 20 second rule should be 'flipped' ahead so at least 7 or 8 of us can get around in the light cycle. Double flippers would be grand!

Biff, our regular transportation Master should go as our delegate and pose a few questions, and Bdog could act as his consul. My only request would be is, try and get a written copy of the Master Plan and ask Luis Escobar to sign it. We could later put fire to his feet with the pages that we would burn when he does go through with the written material contained within it.

Anyone know why Katz gave up smoking? Didn't want to start a GREASE Fire.

[h0twired]

Originally Posted by alittle1

If the City is building more bike paths, that just tells me that they will be raising taxes again and you will be peddling your bike and your ass for the next couple of years to make ends meet.

Thanks grandpa. God forbid we build infrastructure other than roads.

I for one am not 70+ years old and would love to be able to commute to work using a connected series of bike pathways like I used to in Calgary.

The majority of young people (aka "those still paying taxes") actually like the idea of more bike paths and rapid transit options.

[Mininari]

Originally Posted by h0twired

Thanks grandpa. God forbid we build infrastructure other than roads.

I for one am not 70+ years old and would love to be able to commute to work using a connected series of bike pathways like I used to in Calgary.

The majority of young people (aka "those still paying taxes") actually like the idea of more bike paths and rapid transit options.

I think I'm one of the few 30 and under crowd at my work that doesn't cycle to work (I've been carpooling, and soon will drive as I have to start taking my son to daycare)... but nearly everyone else rides their bike in. A couple even brave winter...

[roccerfeller]

That specific experience does depend on the person though.

That is, we all have different friends circles so our experiences are different.

There is a case to be made on both sides; perhaps certain areas in Winnipeg are just more accessible by bikes than others

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by h0twired

Thanks grandpa. God forbid we build infrastructure other than roads.

I for one am not 70+ years old and would love to be able to commute to work using a connected series of bike pathways like I used to in Calgary.

The majority of young people (aka "those still paying taxes") actually like the idea of more bike paths and rapid transit options.

I bike too. You can see me peddling my bike on the 207, I'm the one with the big butt crack. Stop and take pictures next time. If your around to see 70, give me a shout.


PS, My taxes dollars already paid for the roads I drive on!

[armorand93]

Originally Posted by alittle1

I bike too. You can see me peddling my bike on the 207, I'm the one with the big butt crack. Stop and take pictures next time. If your around to see 70, give me a shout.


PS, My taxes dollars already paid for the roads I drive on!

How old are you again? Just wondering.

[cllew]

Quick question about the extension of Chief Peguis via the ESP to Regent.

Its going to have to cross the CP Molson main line so what do you think the chances are of a grade separation at that point or do you think the the city will cheap out and do a level crossing?

I would guess that for the CEMR Pine Falls line it will be a level crossing as there are only a couple of trains a week on it.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by cllew

Quick question about the extension of Chief Peguis via the ESP to Regent.

Its going to have to cross the CP Molson main line so what do you think the chances are of a grade separation at that point or do you think the the city will cheap out and do a level crossing?

I would guess that for the CEMR Pine Falls line it will be a level crossing as there are only a couple of trains a week on it.

It's Winnipeg, you can't build a project with out a "future phases" so the initial crossing would be at grade. That way they can totally inconvenience everyone driving on the new road after it is built with the construction of an underpass.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Biff

It's Winnipeg, you can't build a project with out a "future phases" so the initial crossing would be at grade. That way they can totally inconvenience everyone driving on the new road after it is built with the construction of an underpass.

Sad but SO true.

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by cllew

Quick question about the extension of Chief Peguis via the ESP to Regent.

Its going to have to cross the CP Molson main line so what do you think the chances are of a grade separation at that point or do you think the the city will cheap out and do a level crossing?

I would guess that for the CEMR Pine Falls line it will be a level crossing as there are only a couple of trains a week on it.

If you look at the rails on the line you will see that there is a good layer of rust in place. The only place the tracks is being used is up by Griffin.

In the future, rail lines won't run through the City. Trucks will carry freight into the City.

[cllew]

Originally Posted by alittle1

If you look at the rails on the line you will see that there is a good layer of rust in place. The only place the tracks is being used is up by Griffin.

If your taking CEMR, they hold up traffic a few times a week on Regent when they interchange with CN. On the north end they are the only rail line into the Imperial Oil terminal in East St. Paul and there are always tank cars in there.

And about a month ago they were pushing potash cars into storage by the Manitoba Hydro steam plant in East Selkirk. I think that most of the sidings from East Selkirk to Pine Falls are now being used for their rail car storage program.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Sad but SO true.

You know what frustrates me the most is how other jurisdictions can do things properly. For instance, look up the details for Circle Drive in Saskatoon.

http://www.saskatoon.ca/DEPARTMENTS/...thProject.aspx

In brief they are making 8km of 4 to 6 lane FREEWAY with 4 grade separated interchanges, a 6 lane river crossing, 3 railway grade separations and sound walls in 5 years from design to completion for just over $300 million.

To compare Chief Peguis is approximately 3.5 km with 1 grade separation, 2 signalized intersections and some sound walls for $110 million.

Why is it that we cannot do things properly here? I know Sask has more money than us but try and compare apples to apples here. Their FREEWAY is just slightly over twice as long as ours but it has a 6 lane river crossing, 3 rail underpasses and 3 more grade separated intersections than ours.

So to triple ours (remember this is very rough) we would spend $330 million get 9 km of 4 lane road with 3 total grade crossings. They some how get 7 grade separations and a river crossing. We are doing something wrong here.

[h0twired]

Originally Posted by Biff

You know what frustrates me the most is how other jurisdictions can do things properly.

Other jurisdictions have oil and potash money to burn.

[alittle1]

Originally Posted by Biff

You know what frustrates me the most is how other jurisdictions can do things properly. For instance, look up the details for Circle Drive in Saskatoon.

http://www.saskatoon.ca/DEPARTMENTS/...thProject.aspx

In brief they are making 8km of 4 to 6 lane FREEWAY with 4 grade separated interchanges, a 6 lane river crossing, 3 railway grade separations and sound walls in 5 years from design to completion for just over $300 million.

To compare Chief Peguis is approximately 3.5 km with 1 grade separation, 2 signalized intersections and some sound walls for $110 million.

Why is it that we cannot do things properly here? I know Sask has more money than us but try and compare apples to apples here. Their FREEWAY is just slightly over twice as long as ours but it has a 6 lane river crossing, 3 rail underpasses and 3 more grade separated intersections than ours.

So to triple ours (remember this is very rough) we would spend $330 million get 9 km of 4 lane road with 3 total grade crossings. They some how get 7 grade separations and a river crossing. We are doing something wrong here.

Biff,

I would guess that the reason that THEY can do it, is because they build more efficiently then we do. And example is this: