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  #2561  
Old Posted Jun 1, 2013, 11:26 PM
eleven=11 eleven=11 is offline
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that hallway is cool but
what is on the other side of the blank wall???
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  #2562  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2013, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
Are there any expansion points built into the plans in case a JFK express train in any form to lower Manhattan ever materializes?
Yes, it's built to accommodate a lower level, with LIRR/JFK access. That drives up the cost, but at least you have that future possibility.
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  #2563  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2013, 3:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
Are there any expansion points built into the plans in case a JFK express train in any form to lower Manhattan ever materializes?
No and never going to happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eleven=11 View Post
that hallway is cool but
what is on the other side of the blank wall???
The museum.
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  #2564  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2013, 4:28 AM
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Originally Posted by JMGarcia View Post
PATH/Fail: The Story of the World’s Most Expensive Train Station

http://observer.com/2013/05/pathfail/
It's been said: Anything Calatrava designs, and is built, will eventually become a tourist attraction to any city!

Long Term, money well spent!

There's only one reason why I detoured, so far out of my way, on a Midwest trip in 2009: to go to Milwaukee, to gawk at that Calatrava-designed Milwaukee Museum on the lakefront!
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  #2565  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2013, 2:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
That hallway is pretty sick. This is looking very promising.

Though I want the additional lower level to built, as was originally proposed. This was also supposed to be the Lower Manhattan LIRR/JFK hub. That needs to be an MTA/Port Authority priority.
I'm sure some asshole out there is already planning on spray painting the wall with graffiti. I hope security will be too tight to let that ever happen.
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  #2566  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2013, 2:46 AM
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Originally Posted by CoolCzech View Post
I'm sure some asshole out there is already planning on spray painting the wall with graffiti. I hope security will be too tight to let that ever happen.
Paint isn't going to do anything to the marble, and it would be cleaned within an hour or two anyway. These are hallowed halls for many of the people that will be maintaining the site.
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  #2567  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2013, 5:54 PM
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Originally Posted by CoolCzech View Post
I'm sure some asshole out there is already planning on spray painting the wall with graffiti. I hope security will be too tight to let that ever happen.
Most types of graffiti with paint or marker can be "pulled" out of marble with simple inexpensive products. Scratches and can also be buffed out or filled.

I'm actually more worried about the wrong products used for regular cleaning. Overly acidic cleaners or bleach would destroy that white marble.
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  #2568  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2013, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by eleven=11 View Post
that hallway is cool but
what is on the other side of the blank wall???
Retail opposite. Behind it, the WTC museum. Original design...



http://observer.com/2011/07/another-...wtc-mall-deal/


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  #2569  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 12:36 AM
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WTC Progress on Facebook
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  #2570  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 3:58 AM
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The transit hub is seriously starting to take shape now.
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  #2571  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 5:07 AM
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The train station is looking great.

But damn, $4 billion? Most cities would kill to spend that on transit, lol.
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  #2572  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 1:24 PM
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Originally Posted by mfastx View Post
The train station is looking great.

But damn, $4 billion? Most cities would kill to spend that on transit, lol.
That's what I mean, whoever let the budget get that out of control should be fired. It's even worse because the WTC is going to be at least half empty when this thing is completed. The money should have gone towards finishing the towers, not building an undgerground palace that most people to the site will never see.
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  #2573  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 3:14 PM
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  #2574  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 4:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Onn View Post
That's what I mean, whoever let the budget get that out of control should be fired. It's even worse because the WTC is going to be at least half empty when this thing is completed. The money should have gone towards finishing the towers, not building an undgerground palace that most people to the site will never see.
The transit sections are the KEY to bringing people to this tip of the island. One could argue that without it, there is no need to go there or fill up any of these buildings! Businesses would stay in mid-town.

The budget is one thing (I don't think replacing the marble walls and floors with bare cement and sheetrock would save much) but to have a stunning place to end up makes a HUGE difference. Ever been in any of the old NYC subway stations? Not places I care to stay and explore!

Where would you rather be? Here in the Marble Palace? Or here : http://avenue80s.wordpress.com/2011/...ubway-station/
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  #2575  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 5:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Scrapernab2 View Post
The transit sections are the KEY to bringing people to this tip of the island. One could argue that without it, there is no need to go there or fill up any of these buildings! Businesses would stay in mid-town.

The budget is one thing (I don't think replacing the marble walls and floors with bare cement and sheetrock would save much) but to have a stunning place to end up makes a HUGE difference. Ever been in any of the old NYC subway stations? Not places I care to stay and explore!

Where would you rather be? Here in the Marble Palace? Or here : http://avenue80s.wordpress.com/2011/...ubway-station/
The problem though is right now most of the people visiting the site are tourists, who aren't coming by subway from New Jersey. Yes, the area needs a solid subway terminal, but the Calatrava design is so insane (from both a design point of veiw and a cost point of view) I don't see how it makes a whole lot of sense. They could be sacrificing a tower or two because the funds were diverted to this instead of being used above ground. I don't think people and companies want to move to an incomplete World Trade Center either!
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  #2576  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 7:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Onn View Post
The problem though is right now most of the people visiting the site are tourists, who aren't coming by subway from New Jersey. Yes, the area needs a solid subway terminal, but the Calatrava design is so insane (from both a design point of veiw and a cost point of view) I don't see how it makes a whole lot of sense. They could be sacrificing a tower or two because the funds were diverted to this instead of being used above ground. I don't think people and companies want to move to an incomplete World Trade Center either!
You do not understand the difference between private and public property. 2WTC and 3WTC are owned by Larry Silverstein, and this site is one of the most important transit hubs in the country. Not just for sentiment, but also economics, more people will pass through each day than the population of 90% of American cities. Also, $4 billion is a drop in a bucket, the US is the richest country in the world and just keeps getting richer. Just because the middle class in middle america is suffering doesn't mean downtown NYC is.

In other words, the people of New York that will be using these halls will be leading the country and the economy for the 21st century, making the investment all the more worthwhile. Its conceited but its based in truth.

Besides, going cheap with our transit results in Penn Station...
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  #2577  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2013, 8:01 PM
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Originally Posted by fimiak View Post
You do not understand the difference between private and public property. 2WTC and 3WTC are owned by Larry Silverstein, and this site is one of the most important transit hubs in the country. Not just for sentiment, but also economics, more people will pass through each day than the population of 90% of American cities. Also, $4 billion is a drop in a bucket, the US is the richest country in the world and just keeps getting richer. Just because the middle class in middle america is suffering doesn't mean downtown NYC is.

In other words, the people of New York that will be using these halls will be leading the country and the economy for the 21st century, making the investment all the more worthwhile. Its conceited but its based in truth.

Besides, going cheap with our transit results in Penn Station...
Yes I do understand the difference between private and public property! The federal government set aside "Liberty Bonds" after 9/11 to help rebuild the WTC site. Many of they bonds were used for private construction projects in Lower Manhattan (Goldman Sachs Building and Beekman Tower), but I believe much of the money is going towards the 9/11 Memorial and the Transporation Hub. Larry Silverstein could have taken advantage of the money for his towers except the money is either gone or in limbo now.

This Transportation Hub wouldn't even be the most important in New York, it's like the third most important. And New Yorkers themselves wouldn't be the main people using it, people coming from New Jersey are. Being wayyyy over budget is no excuse, there is no excuse for it. The original cost was something like $1.5 billion, now it's balloned to $4 billion! Everyone involved in this project has budget problems. Yes this would be the most expensive transportation hub in the world and these is no reason for it to be.
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  #2578  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2013, 3:16 PM
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Entertain me on this, as it's just a thought exercise, but I've frequently heard that LIRR is the most efficient way to get into the city from JFK, no?

So, is it not conceivable that PATH and LIRR(via Penn)/Metro North(pending it gets access to Penn) could cooperate a little better on serving the station with commuters? A logistical nightmare, yes, but it is not inconceivable, right?

Though, I guess I've answered my question, as I'm pretty sure the only way to really get this to work would be having one operator....

The way I see it, is that this station is expensive, but it's a good investment. Especially when we are basing the discussion in the frame of trying to reposition Downtown as a more attractive area to rent in, no?
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  #2579  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2013, 6:15 PM
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Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post


Entertain me on this, as it's just a thought exercise, but I've frequently heard that LIRR is the most efficient way to get into the city from JFK, no?

So, is it not conceivable that PATH and LIRR(via Penn)/Metro North(pending it gets access to Penn) could cooperate a little better on serving the station with commuters? A logistical nightmare, yes, but it is not inconceivable, right?

Though, I guess I've answered my question, as I'm pretty sure the only way to really get this to work would be having one operator....

The way I see it, is that this station is expensive, but it's a good investment. Especially when we are basing the discussion in the frame of trying to reposition Downtown as a more attractive area to rent in, no?
The LIRR and the Metro North is way too far to serve the World Trade Center. PATH doesn't run anywhere near an airport. The A line is the only subway line that serves JFK Airport and would run to the World Trade Center. That is it.
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  #2580  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2013, 4:31 PM
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Awesome shot from WTC Progress on Twitter

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