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  #21  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 6:09 PM
Schertz1 Schertz1 is offline
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Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
You got it all wrong. I only disagree with things that don't make sense (like subsidizing a grocery store or NOT building the at&t center downtown). When the environment is right for a grocery store, one will be willing to locate there.

If you want an area to grow, you develop an environment conducive to growth. If the County, State, or Fed needs to subsidize it to ensure the investors do not lose money the first few years so be it. I am not talking about a handout, but tax incentives and/or other benefits to keep them out of the red. Please tell me what does not make sense about this? Do you not think the objective is to increase the tax base in central city by spurring residential development; will the County, State, and Fed not benefit from the development?

Do you have a problem with the State giving F1 25,000,000 a year to come to Austin? Do you agree with taxpayers, possibly, footing the bill for hundreds of millions to improve the roadways around the facility? Do you honestly believe F1 is viable in Austin without subsidies? Better yet, do you believe Austin really beat out NYC to host F1 without them? We are paying for it!

So, unless you plan on making sense, go play in your own sandbox.
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  #22  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 6:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Schertz1 View Post
When you say the Austin model, what do you mean? They may have more condos DT, but from what I read over half are sitting vacant or unfinished - meaning Alteza style unfinished. They do not have many more people DT than we do, yet they have a grocery store. Not near UT, but on the south side of DT near the river.
There may be some vacant condos, but there was already neighborhoods near downtown that could support the Whole Foods store. It has been at that location for years and just recently moved across the street into their new hedquarters. Those neighborhoods also have the means to support that type of store.
(Check out the property values: http://www.zillow.com/homes/austin,t..._zm/1_rs/1_fr/)

What is the history with the Hippo's grocery store? I visited it when we there once and it was pretty limited. It looks like they cater more to visitors. Not a bad location (just east of the court house).

There is also another little market we've been to on Market by the court house as well. They have a bit more to offer there. But again, it really caters more to visitors.

It seems like some businesses are trying, but the model that works right now is selling to tourists.
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  #23  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 6:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Schertz1 View Post
If you want an area to grow, you develop an environment conducive to growth. If the County, State, or Fed needs to subsidize it to ensure the investors do not lose money the first few years so be it. I am not talking about a handout, but tax incentives and/or other benefits to keep them out of the red. Please tell me what does not make sense about this? Do you not think the objective is to increase the tax base in central city by spurring residential development; will the County, State, and Fed not benefit from the development?

Do you have a problem with the State giving F1 25,000,000 a year to come to Austin? Do you agree with taxpayers, possibly, footing the bill for hundreds of millions to improve the roadways around the facility? Do you honestly believe F1 is viable in Austin without subsidies? Better yet, do you believe Austin really beat out NYC to host F1 without them? We are paying for it!

So, unless you plan on making sense, go play in your own sandbox.
As a matter of fact, I do have a problem with the F1. (BTW: you do know that Red McCombs is behind that, right?)

The city should concentrate on encouraging growth, but do you really think this grocery store scheme is going to do that? What would have made a difference is working to get Tesoro to locate downtown, or Rackspace to locate near downtown, or NuStar to locate downtown. Hell, even Whataburger.

Maybe those employees would have considered living in town or near town; then they would demand services like a cleaners, coffe shops and, yes, a grocery store.

Ask the question "why did this not happen?" Then remove those roadblocks. I added some thoughts with my first post to this thread.

The idea that people choose to not live downtown because there is no grocery store is weak. It's a different kind of environment and people that like that lifestyle will move there.
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  #24  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 8:14 PM
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Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
The city should concentrate on encouraging growth, but do you really think this grocery store scheme is going to do that? What would have made a difference is working to get Tesoro to locate downtown, or Rackspace to locate near downtown, or NuStar to locate downtown. Hell, even Whataburger.
THIS. Why couldn't our city leaders do something about that!

Btw, I know this is off topic but what is F1?
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  #25  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 8:36 PM
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Btw, I know this is off topic but what is F1?
F1 is the Formula One Race track they are planning on building near the Austin airport.
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  #26  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 9:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schertz1
When you say the Austin model, what do you mean? They may have more condos DT, but from what I read over half are sitting vacant or unfinished - meaning Alteza style unfinished.
That's not completely true. It's not as though they're all full, but some people believe they're completely empty. The street life in downtown proves different though.

http://downtownaustinfacts.com/

Here's the latest article (from last week) on the sales.
http://www.statesman.com/business/do...inglePage=true
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  #27  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 9:02 PM
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Austin does have one major grocery store downtown, the Whole Foods, but honestly, it's not an everyday needs grocer, and it's pricey. BUT, we do have the smaller grocery stores in downtown. There's now 3 or 4 Royal Blue grocers throughout downtown, including one in the base of 360 Condos. They're a bit more modest than Whole Foods. I wish we could land an HEB in downtown. That's really what would be nice.
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  #28  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 9:38 PM
Schertz1 Schertz1 is offline
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Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
There may be some vacant condos, but there was already neighborhoods near downtown that could support the Whole Foods store. It has been at that location for years and just recently moved across the street into their new hedquarters. Those neighborhoods also have the means to support that type of store.
(Check out the property values: http://www.zillow.com/homes/austin,t..._zm/1_rs/1_fr/)

What is the history with the Hippo's grocery store? I visited it when we there once and it was pretty limited. It looks like they cater more to visitors. Not a bad location (just east of the court house).

There is also another little market we've been to on Market by the court house as well. They have a bit more to offer there. But again, it really caters more to visitors.

It seems like some businesses are trying, but the model that works right now is selling to tourists.

This is my point, some in SA want to wait until the DT population alone supports a store, when this is not how it happened in other cities, including Austin. The answer may be to close the HEB on Houston and New Braunfels and move it to Commerce near St. Paul Square.

There are two high-rise condos beside Hippo's, a timeshare and 230 Dwyer; I think they cater to the timeshare then the rest of DT.

I believe there is also a grocer on Commerce and Navarro.

Last edited by Schertz1; Sep 24, 2010 at 10:17 PM.
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  #29  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 9:44 PM
Schertz1 Schertz1 is offline
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Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas View Post
That's not completely true. It's not as though they're all full, but some people believe they're completely empty. The street life in downtown proves different though.

http://downtownaustinfacts.com/

Here's the latest article (from last week) on the sales.
http://www.statesman.com/business/do...inglePage=true

The statesman blog has a wide range of views, but the vast majority agree there is a sales problem and many condos have not been finished out.
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  #30  
Old Posted Sep 24, 2010, 10:15 PM
Schertz1 Schertz1 is offline
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Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
As a matter of fact, I do have a problem with the F1. (BTW: you do know that Red McCombs is behind that, right?)

The city should concentrate on encouraging growth, but do you really think this grocery store scheme is going to do that? What would have made a difference is working to get Tesoro to locate downtown, or Rackspace to locate near downtown, or NuStar to locate downtown. Hell, even Whataburger.

Maybe those employees would have considered living in town or near town; then they would demand services like a cleaners, coffe shops and, yes, a grocery store.

Ask the question "why did this not happen?" Then remove those roadblocks. I added some thoughts with my first post to this thread.

The idea that people choose to not live downtown because there is no grocery store is weak. It's a different kind of environment and people that like that lifestyle will move there.
No, not a grocery store alone; it will take effort in many other areas. Years ago, there were incentives for SBC employees to live in or close to DT. Kind of hard to live there when there is not enough suitable housing. San Antonio should use builder incentives similar to those used in Austin to encourage the development there. I don't blame NuStar or any other corporation for not moving DT, though I would like to see something besides Frost Bank HQ there. I will use DT Austin as the example, what major corporations are HQ there? Why not focus on who already works in or near DT, college professors, doctors, military retirees, lawyers, and entrepreneurs.

Yeah, I know Red is a partner. It is his money and he can spend it how he sees fit. I also know he is a big UT booster, but he also supports many local causes. I only wish he'd spend a bit more here and less elsewhere.
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  #31  
Old Posted May 30, 2011, 2:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Schertz1 View Post
The statesman blog has a wide range of views, but the vast majority agree there is a sales problem and many condos have not been finished out.
Not true, though, since you can see at night lights on and being turned on and off inside the buildings and the tell tale glow of televisions. This is actually something I've paid attention to since everyone is unsure of this untested market. But it seems to be doing well.

And I only go to the Statesman blogs when I want a good laugh. Newspaper comments sections are kind of a vacuum of intelligent conversation.
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  #32  
Old Posted May 30, 2011, 11:57 PM
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I think that if San Antonio is going to build a grocery store downtown it should allow H.E.B. to build a Central Market, and not just another regular H.E.B. or H.E.B Plus! People downtown I think want a grocery store where they can not only shop for all kinds of groceries, but also be able to eat quality food in an indoor/outdoor restaurant setting that serves all kinds of foods from around the world. It should also be a grocery store that once built should look and feel unique from the inside and outside. Just like I said on a previous post: "If you build not just another generic building, but an attractive and well-constructed one, they will come, and not just come, but come back over and over again because it will be a unique experience to shop downtown." In addition, I think that people will be attracted to shop and eat downtown simply because it will be an experience that is unique and convenient for many that will want to spent time downtown seven days a week. If it is built, I plan to patronize it myself even if I don't live downtown.

Here are a couple of other opinions from readers giving their own opinions about a grocery store downtown in the San Antonio Express News:

m_mroz

6:55 AM on May 28, 2011

One of the best experiences I have had grocery shopping is at the Whole Food Store at 6th and Lamar in Austin. It is a regional magnet and a showcase for Whole Foods. Austin is the world headquarters for Whole Foods and both are proud of the relationship.

H-E-B has the opportunity to do the same thing with downtown San Antonio. Create a destination store that rivals the Whole Foods store at Lamar & 6th in Austin. Being close to H-E-B's headquarters, vendors would delight in showcasing their new products and creating a powerful and exciting atmosphere for San Antonio Shoppers.


RBearSAT

6:04 AM on May 28, 2011

Oops, looks like someone may have jumped the gun.

One point to note in the article that seems to overlook one aspect regarding residential support of a downtown store is that the store would actually serve more than the 4,500 residents living downtown.

If the store is place at the rumored location it would also serve the neighborhoods of King William, Lavaca and South Flores, probably putting it at the level required. Most people overlook those areas when considering a downtown store but those areas are a part of the mix and are growing.

BTW, if you look at the income in all those areas I think you'll find it can easily support a store in the area.


Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/City-apologizes-to-H-E-B-over-premature-notice-1399502.php#ixzz1Ng5WJEiu"]www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/City-apologizes-to-H-E-B-over-premature-notice-1399502.php#ixzz1Ng5WJEiu"]www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/City-apologizes-to-H-E-B-over-premature-notice-1399502.php#ixzz1Ng5WJEiu"]http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/City-apologizes-to-H-E-B-over-premature-notice-1399502.php#ixzz1Ng5WJEiu"]www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/City-apologizes-to-H-E-B-over-premature-notice-1399502.php#ixzz1Ng5WJEiu
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