The Great Canadian Practice your French Thread

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Huh okay...

I thought the strip of Renfrew County in UOV would also be bilingual just because of its proximity to Québec (although there are only 3 crossings between Renfrew and Pontiac).

If Renfrew’s largely unilingually English, is it because there’s nothing much going on on the Québec side? I’ve seen the map that, past Pembroke, it’s just mountain range in Québec (hence Zone d’exploitation contrôlée).
.

The Quebec side of the river is actually (sparsely) populated with small towns and villages for about 20 km up(river) past Pembroke and in the other direction all the way down the north shore towards the Gatineau-Ottawa area.

The Upper Ottawa Valley (Ontario side) actually did have a pretty significant francophone population 100-150 years ago as evidenced by some of the place names and surnames that you find here and there. I believe francophones may even have been the majority or close to it in the town of Pembroke at one point.

But the Ontario Catholic church a century or more ago was very influential in people's lives in the region (via churches and schools) and extremely anti-francophone under the influence of a number of Irish-origin bishops that effectively ran the area. So most of the francophones ended up being assimilated after a while.

The Catholic church officials based in Pembroke even had a great deal of influence on the Quebec side of the river (including running the schools there for a time), which was quite isolated from the rest of the province, and as a result the francophone population of the Pontiac underwent an inordinately high assimilation rate as well - at least when you consider they were living in Quebec territory. That's one of the main reasons the Quebec Pontiac is a majority anglophone region today - pretty much the only one in the province in fact. (Francophones are about 40% of the population in the Pontiac.)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Fair enough. For me, I’d think that, if it ends in -ière, -ie, or -gue (like Témiscamingue), it’s most likely feminine.

As for Laurentides, I know the English name is Laurentian Hills. If you directly translate it back into French, it’ll be like Montagnes Laurentiennes (although I don’t think anyone says that) so it should be feminine. Later on I’ve also seen articles that say “Les Hautes Laurentides”.

Laurentides is feminine: Hautes-Laurentides, Basses-Laurentides

Témiscamingue is actually masculine: le Témiscaminigue, au Témiscamingue. Might be because it's named for a lake, and "lac" is masculine.

[mintzilla]

Another gripe. If French people don’t really use the inversion or “est-ce” for making questions in real life why did I spend so much time on it? To look a fool? Zut alors!

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by mintzilla

Another gripe. If French people don’t really use the inversion or “est-ce” for making questions in real life why did I spend so much time on it? To look a fool? Zut alors!

From what I know...
For inversion, people definitely use it, like, “Que fais-tu?” But since it’s speaking, people go informal and so you may hear instead, “Tu fais quoi?”

As for “est-ce”, Acajack, lio45, any thought?

[Dengler Avenue]

Also, http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...01#post8419501 #1046 I went full-on French in a highway thread, again. I only replied in French simply because the other SSP-er started using it though.

On another note...
Many here know that I came to SSP mainly because of highways. Once I was telling GlassCity that I’d have commented in the Québec forum too if there was a thread on highways there too. Then he suggested I could start one.

Should I do it?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by mintzilla

Another gripe. If French people don’t really use the inversion or “est-ce” for making questions in real life why did I spend so much time on it? To look a fool? Zut alors!

"Est-ce que" is basically "is it so that..." and begs a yes or no answer.

It is used in real life. Though not all the time. In order to omit it in speech, you need to use a specific tone. So if you're saying "il fait froid" as a statement, it won't sound the same as if you're asking a question about if it's cold outside.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Also, http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...01#post8419501 #1046 I went full-on French in a Highway thread, again. I only replied in French simply because the other SSP-we started using it though.

That's not bad at all. Is that all from you or did you use a translation software?

[Dengler Avenue]

Other than checking the spelling of “réfection” (because I spelled “réfaction” at first) and the French name of that bridge in Miramichi, everything else was from me.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Other than checking the spelling of “réfection” (because I spelled “réfaction” at first) everything was from me.

Bravo. Then you've got a pretty darn good level of bilingualism.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Bravo. Then you've got a pretty darn good level of bilingualism.

My listening’s trash though. Any recommendation for podcasts? (Right now, sometimes I go on radio Canada to watch Découverte by Charles Tisseyre, TLMP by Guy A. Lepage & Dany Turcotte, and Vérité et Conséquence by Louis Tremblay. Funny enough, occasionally, I can understand the first one without subtitles, but for the last two, even with subtitles it’s still hard to follow.)

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Other than checking the spelling of “réfection” (because I spelled “réfaction” at first) and the French name of that bridge in Miramichi, everything else was from me.

And you weren't even in French Immersion if I remember correctly!

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

And you weren't even in French Immersion if I remember correctly!

I started learning French 2 years ago.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

I started learning French 2 years ago.

You're doing pretty well then! (I'm assuming you don't get many chances to practice.)

[lio45]

Originally Posted by mintzilla

Another gripe. If French people don’t really use the inversion or “est-ce” for making questions in real life why did I spend so much time on it? To look a fool? Zut alors!

? In real life it's still used regularly.

Sure, some people may in speech use extreme shortcuts, but you'll always be understood if you say the right thing. To reuse a previous example, regardless of shortcuts, it's nice - and useful - to have the knowledge to properly ask someone how they're doing / what they're up to in English, even though one can simply just ask "wazzup" as the shortest way to achieve that.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

"Est-ce que" is basically "is it so that..." and begs a yes or no answer.

It is used in real life. Though not all the time. In order to omit it in speech, you need to use a specific tone. So if you're saying "il fait froid" as a statement, it won't sound the same as if you're asking a question about if it's cold outside.

Exactly, the inversion isn't optional when the sentence is a question.

It's the exact same in English actually: from the observable fact that asking "ss'cold outside?" will work perfectly 100% of the time, you could think inversion is optional (the affirmative version, "ss'cold outside!", having the exact same form except for the voice raising at the end indicating it's a question), but it's not, and the correct way to ask (especially nonoptional in writing...) is "is it cold outside?" with the verb and subject both present and in that order (and not in the same order as in the affirmative version).

Personally (from my own experience learning other languages) I'd definitely advise against getting so used to such shortcuts that you're skipping learning the proper way.

[Dengler Avenue]

A question about pronunciation:
Do d and t always make the “dz” and “tz” sound, respectively? (Example: “dire”, “conduire”, “particulier”, “tu”.)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

A question about pronunciation:
Do d and t always make the “dz” and “tz” sound, respectively? (Example: “dire”, “conduire”, “particulier”, “tu”.)

Only in the French spoken in Quebec and points west in Canada.

In the rest of the Francophonie the D and T sounds are more similar to the way they sound in English. Interestingly enough Acadians also pronounce D and T like they do in francophone Europe.

[Dengler Avenue]

So it’s not just Québec, but also the prairies and BC.

(Quant au français ontarien, je le considère comme le français québécois modifié/anglicisé.)

I also find it interesting that in Québec, the i (like “fatigue”, “boutique”, “Témiscamingue”*) sound is short just like it is in English.

* Pronunciation of é is of another discussion.

Ps: I wonder what French in Nova Scotia sounds like. An anglicized version of Acadian French?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

So it’s not just Québec, but also the prairies and BC.

BC doesn't really have anything resembling a regionalized francophone accent. You basically hear the accents of where people came from: Quebec, Acadia, Europe, etc. And with each passing generation it becomes more tinged with English.

The Prairie provinces can be said to have their own accents though. They tend to be quite English-tinged as well (similar to Ontario's) but like Ontario they are variants of the Quebec accent that they are descended from.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

* Pronunciation of é is of another discussion.

Ps: I wonder what French in Nova Scotia sounds like. An anglicized version of Acadian French?

Here is Georgette LeBlanc, starting at :45. She is the Poet Laureate of Canada's Parliament at the moment. She is from Baie-Ste-Marie in SW Nova Scotia. I find her accent extremely charming.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsEfb0XF3vE