Halifax Stadium Discussion

[Dmajackson]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

They had better not call it Molson Stadium since the Molson brewery is here in Moncton!!

Also, I'm sick and tired of everthing sports related in Halifax being associated with Moosehead beer. Something more innovative might be in order here...

Well since everything else is beer related how about Keith's Stadium or Garrison Stadium?

Then again other bigwigs like the Fountains, Sobeys or Risley (CLearwater) might chip in.

[reddog794]

Just a thought, we mention SMU quite a bit, how about Wickwire field? DAL is looking to build next to the field where the parking is, a new 25,000 seat stadium would fit in that whole foot print.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by reddog794

Just a thought, we mention SMU quite a bit, how about Wickwire field? DAL is looking to build next to the field where the parking is, a new 25,000 seat stadium would fit in that whole foot print.

I often wish they'd build a decent sized stadium there as well. They should close South Street between the field and Dalplex, then build a sunken bowl that takes up the entire area bounded by Dalplex, the hockey arena, and the University Club/Henry Hicks. The buildings between Dalplex and South Street would have to be demolished to make way for this redevelopment.

Not only would Dal get a good sized stadium right in the heart of campus, but the campus would become more pedestrian friendly. The elevation of the Dal campus is far above the water line so digging down should cause too many problems. The biggest obstacles would be NIMBY's and cost.

I've looked at aerials. Developing the site this way would allow for a stadium as big as 50,000. Start with a 10,000 seat sunken bowl expandable to 25,000 with allowances for major expansion over the next 50 years.


http://emit.phys.ocean.dal.ca/~kelley/MTM/campusmap.jpg


Start with a sunken bowl like this:


http://kenlew.com/collections/postcards/ru/181-l.jpg

[someone123]

I still maintain that the best site would be Gorsebrook or whatever that field is next to the IWK on the way to SMU along Robie Street. It's currently underused and there'd be lots of room to put in other new buildings and amenities. It would also be walking distance to Dal, SMU, and the downtown area.

http://www.bing.com/maps/default.asp...20ns&encType=1

[reddog794]

I'm going to have to differ with you over the use of the park Someone. That park is used daily by the kids of both Inglis St. Elementary, and Goorsebrook for both their gym classes, and recess/lunch. In the winter time that hill is a close contender against the Bowl, and Citedal Hill, for top sledding.

Now if you mean that road hockey rink, Soccer field, Baseball diamond, I can agree with that spot being a great location.

Or do you mean around the CNIB building?

[Dmajackson]

I've used Goorsebrook Field many times over the years and I used to love sledding down the hill in the winter.

if the stadium had to go there though I would place it on the APSEA site (with rear pedestrian access from Lundy's Lane). I'd also move Gorsebrook to Inglis Street (near Wellington) with the soccer field and basketball courts realigned for access off Inglis Street and effectively connect the two schools. On the corner of South and Robie (current site of Gorsebrook) I'd build a new mid-rise with a hotel in it for both the stadium and IWK families. With this plan the centre area where the hill is located would remain mostly intact.

Of course I'd never choose this site because of the massive traffic issues that would be raised with placing it so far south on the peninsula. Robie St is already jammed packed let alone with 10'000+ vehicles more on it.

[isaidso]

I have to admit that I've always salivated at the thought of that field behind the IWK being developed into a SMU-Dal-CFL stadium. I'd prefer if the natural bowl about 200 feet to the right and down were used, but you could put the stadium right up against Robie Street too:

GO DAL GO! (OK, I cheated, those aren't Dal Tiger fans, they're Missouri Tiger fans, but one has to have hope that football will return to Dalhousie)


Courtesy of Finiteman

BLACK....GOLD....BLACK.....GOLD....

[Takeo]

Not sure why we're even talking about this because it purely theoretical and will most likely never happen... but I don't feel a stadium belongs anywhere on the Peninsula. Stadiums are big. The need to be fed with high capacity, well ventilated roads. And they suck the soul out of funky urban and tight-knit residential areas. The Peninsula is simply too small and too tightly packed with residential and mercantile communities. If this idea were even real... which it's not... the only place I could think of would be the current Navy residential area bounded by Counnaught, Windsor and Bayers Rd... where the Cannex is. That area is huge and already dead and more or less cut off from the community. It has great road access via the bridge and the bi-high. You'd have to convince them to sell it first though. Otherwise, I'd say Shannon Park or Dartmouth Crossing. But on the peninsula? I say no.

[isaidso]

Lots of communities across north America have very large football stadia located in their cores with little in the way of parking close by. Urban planners argue that you do put stadia on transit corridors, but they don't have to be roads. As long as transit compensates, it is a far more palatable proposition than building in outlying areas that depend on the automobile.

Lansdowne in Ottawa is just such an example. They rejected Kanata because it's in the middle of nowhere and is really only accessible by car. It causes sprawl.

University of Alabama's football stadium is right in the heart of Tuscaloosa, population 206,765 and their stadium holds 92,012 people. There is some parking, but nowhere close to what this stadium holds. People bus in, walk, cab, etc. There are a myriad other examples across the continent. The idea that one needs big, high capacity roads is a 1960s mentality that causes sprawl. Progressive urban planning is about concentrated nodes, density, and efficiency. People need to be encouraged to congregate in the core, not sucked out to the outlying areas.

Besides, we're not proposing anything close to this size stadia. Just a puny one that will probably never grow past 30,000 in size.

This is smack in the middle of Tuscaloosa

[miesh111]

Ok, if we put that stadium in Halifax it would be amazing. Even a smaller version of that same stadium. It's just so great looking.

[isaidso]

How about just the lower bowl, but with less curvature for better sight lines?

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Takeo

Not sure why we're even talking about this because it purely theoretical and will most likely never happen... .

You realize that's why people get fed up and move to Ontario.

The prevailing attitude in Nova Scotia seems to be 'It won't ever happen so let's just plod along and do nothing'. If Nova Scotia wants to keep more of its young people, that type of thinking has to stop. Nova Scotia needs to start getting things done and move forward. People aren't going to wait around forever for things to happen. After a while they'll give up and move to a province that has more initiative and drive. Life's too short.

I only come back these days to see old friends and the occasional Dal or SMU game.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Lots of communities across north America have very large football stadia located in their cores with little in the way of parking close by. Urban planners argue that you do put stadia on transit corridors, but they don't have to be roads. As long as transit compensates, it is a far more palatable proposition than building in outlying areas that depend on the automobile.

Lansdowne in Ottawa is just such an example. They rejected Kanata because it's in the middle of nowhere and is really only accessible by car. It causes sprawl.

University of Alabama's football stadium is right in the heart of Tuscaloosa, population 206,765 and their stadium holds 92,012 people. There is some parking, but nowhere close to what this stadium holds. People bus in, walk, cab, etc. There are a myriad other examples across the continent. The idea that one needs big, high capacity roads is a 1960s mentality that causes sprawl. Progressive urban planning is about concentrated nodes, density, and efficiency. People need to be encouraged to congregate in the core, not sucked out to the outlying areas.

Besides, we're not proposing anything close to this size stadia. Just a puny one that will probably never grow past 30,000 in size.

Well put. You have convinced me that the DND area north of the Forum lands is the best location. It would have good transit and is surrounded by relatively high density. Plus, there wouldn't be the public outcry that would exist in the South End.

You realize that's why people get fed up and move to Ontario.

The prevailing attitude in Nova Scotia seems to be 'It won't ever happen so let's just plod along and do nothing'. If Nova Scotia wants to keep more of its young people, that type of thinking has to stop. Nova Scotia needs to start getting things done and move forward. People aren't going to wait around forever for things to happen. After a while they'll give up and move to a province that has more initiative and drive. Life's too short.

I also have to agree. Many Haligonians have a "can't do it" attitude although this seems to be changing bit by bit with several successful concerts (Rolling Stones, Paul McCartney, etc.) and other events (IIHF playoffs, G7 Summit in 1995, George Bush's visit while still president, several international conferences, etc.). Surprisingly to me, as a native Nova Scotian, many people from the Toronto area go to Halifax and have positive things to say about the city. This was always surprising to me (in the past) since when living in Halifax I always thought of it as being far inferior to Toronto. However, Halifax continues to make large strides forward. Now please make the next step forward and build a stadium! (anything at all).

[Takeo]

Originally Posted by isaidso

You realize that's why people get fed up and move to Ontario.

People who want stadiums you mean?

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by isaidso

University of Alabama's football stadium is right in the heart of Tuscaloosa, population 206,765 and their stadium holds 92,012 people. ............

Besides, we're not proposing anything close to this size stadia. Just a puny one that will probably never grow past 30,000 in size.

This is smack in the middle of Tuscaloosa

I checked this on Wikipedia and initially it was only 12,000 seats (bench style based on other pictures) when it was constructed in 1929 and was expanded several times thereafter.

I think 15,000 permanent bench style seats along just one side line would be a good start for phase I of the Halifax Stadium (hopefully to be built north of the Halifax Forum area). I would like to see this 15,000 seat section built along one side line with all the seats covered with a roof and extra washroom facilities. Then temporary seating can be installed along the other side line and end zones to add another 15,000 for CFL games and concerts (this being temporary would not be covered). The washroom facilities of the permanent seating section would also be adequate for the temporary seating. Then people attending concerts don't need to use portable washrooms (how much money is wasted to bring in all these portable washrooms for concerts on the Commons?)

I feel that if this were built then within 5 years, based on the likely success of the stadium, there would be a start on phase II which would be another 15,000 bench style seats along the other side line (again with a roof covering all seats) bringing the permanent seats to 30,000 with room in the end zones for another 10,000 - 15,000 temporary seats when required.

Ideally, this would be a relatively painless, with a cost of the first phase being about $20 million.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by Takeo

Not sure why we're even talking about this because it purely theoretical and will most likely never happen... but I don't feel a stadium belongs anywhere on the Peninsula. Stadiums are big. The need to be fed with high capacity, well ventilated roads. And they suck the soul out of funky urban and tight-knit residential areas. The Peninsula is simply too small and too tightly packed with residential and mercantile communities. If this idea were even real... which it's not... the only place I could think of would be the current Navy residential area bounded by Counnaught, Windsor and Bayers Rd... where the Cannex is. That area is huge and already dead and more or less cut off from the community. It has great road access via the bridge and the bi-high. You'd have to convince them to sell it first though. Otherwise, I'd say Shannon Park or Dartmouth Crossing. But on the peninsula? I say no.

The commons site reportedly emptied fairly quickly after the Paul McCartney concert so I think the DND Willow Park area would be ideal.

If Haligonians really want a stadium then it would be built since the residents are the ones electing the politicians. I think it is a matter of people in Halifax deciding on the priorities, another Metro Centre costing $100 - $150 million, or simply renovate the Metro Centre, which is already a good facility, for say $30 - $40 million (take out the skyboxes, add a couple thousand seats in the ends zones plus redo the skyboxes so they don't obstruct seats). Then there will be enough for the first stage of a stadium (say $20 - $25 million) plus a lot of money saved. I really don't see the point of building a new Metro Centre unless Halifax is aiming at a NHL team (which is an over-rated luxury in my opinion).

[Takeo]

Originally Posted by fenwick16

The commons site reportedly emptied fairly quickly after the Paul McCartney concert so I think the DND Willow Park area would be ideal.

Yes. If something like this were to ever happen... I think that site would make a lot of sense.

[hfx_chris]

Originally Posted by Takeo

People who want stadiums you mean?

Way to selectively quote.
He was referring to the general attitude held by many in Halifax, not just specific to a stadium.

[MonctonRad]

Personally, I don't understand why the city would want to replace the Metro Centre. It's a good sized facility (10,000 seats) in the centre of downtown and is a boon to the neighbouring restaurant and hotel district. It is plenty large enough for the Mooseheads, the annual tattoo and most concerts and special events. It perhaps need to be refurbished, not replaced.

The Moncton Coliseum on the other hand needs to be replaced. There are structural issues with the current facility and we want to build downtown to replicate the sort of effect that the Metro centre has on your downtown core. You guys already have a good thing going.

I think Halifax would get far more bang for the buck by building a football stadium instead......this would tend to complement the Metro Centre.

[Empire]

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