SAN ANTONIO | Urban Core Development Thread

[kornbread]

Originally Posted by miaht82

At the Downtown Luncheon yesterday, DT Blog reports that David Adelman of Cross & Co. announced that they are planning for first tenants to move in by May. They also mentioned that Alteza (atop Grand Hyatt) has sold 6 units, is pending on 6 and 4 are in negotiations.

On the agenda for City Council today, this report states that the Performing Arts Center will break ground in June 2011, and open in Sept 2013.

The facade work appears to be complete on the Kress building; I make that assumption based on the fact that the facade cover was removed. It looks good and Texas de Brazil seems to be on track for that December opening. Now if we could just get some apartments on those upper floors.

I'll be making some visual updates soon.

One interesting note was that Vidorra was 50% sold.

The numbers coming from these guys have really been interesting. First they couldn't start construction until they were 60% sold. Then they put out a report that they were the fastest selling condo in the state. Then they said had closed on many of the units in one month. In the end they're still on 50% sold, which is where they were just before construction.

It would be interesting to know what the real numbers are. How have they really been selling over the last few years?

[max7]

One interesting note was that Vidorra was 50% sold.

The numbers coming from these guys have really been interesting. First they couldn't start construction until they were 60% sold. Then they put out a report that they were the fastest selling condo in the state. Then they said had closed on many of the units in one month. In the end they're still on 50% sold, which is where they were just before construction.

It would be interesting to know what the real numbers are. How have they really been selling over the last few years?

Kornbread, Miaht82 wasn't talking about The Vidorra, she was talking about Alteza, the new Performing Arts Center, and Brazil de Texas. Do you have anything new to contribute about these three? I think that The Vidorra is a condo that has a high occupancy rate. Even if the secretary might have told you that The Vidorra has a 50% occupancy rate, I still think that is high considering the economy statewide. In addition, I don't think that one should base the San Antonio condo occupancy rate or the condo economy on just one building. There are more condos in San Antonio than just The Vidorra. The Vistana, is an excellent example. It is currently 93% leased, and it is located downtown. I believe that if an architect builds a beautiful building and not just a building, that condos or lofts will sell in downtown San Antonio with no problem at all. It is not just about the economy. There are always several aspects to take into consideration before drawing any conclusions about the San Antonio economy, which in my opinion is currently robust.

[kornbread]

Originally Posted by max7

Kornbread, Miaht82 wasn't talking about The Vidorra, she was talking about Alteza, the new Performing Arts Center, and Brazil de Texas. Do you have anything new to contribute about these three? I think that The Vidorra is a condo that has a high occupancy rate. Even if the secretary might have told you that The Vidorra has a 50% occupancy rate, I still think that is high considering the economy statewide. In addition, I don't think that one should base the San Antonio condo occupancy rate or the condo economy on just one building. There are more condos in San Antonio than just The Vidorra. The Vistana, is an excellent example. It is currently 93% leased, and it is located downtown. I believe that if an architect builds a beautiful building and not just a building, that condos or lofts will sell in downtown San Antonio with no problem at all. It is not just about the economy. There are always several aspects to take into consideration before drawing any conclusions about the San Antonio economy, which in my opinion is currently robust.

It is mentioned in the link to the Blog

According to Adelman, downtown’s apartment market is pretty healthy with 92 percent of 1,471 apartment units leased. Condominiums aren’t doing as well. Adelman said what makes things difficult is the lack of lending support. For example, there are no downtown condominiums approved by federally-owned Fanny Mae or Freddy Mac. And only the 146-unit Vidorra (50 percent occupied) is approved for Federal Housing Administration mortgages, “which gives them a tremendous advantage,” Adelman said. Another interesting update: of the Alteza’s 147 condos, six have sold, six are pending, and four are in serious contract negotiations.

You should read it. It's related to residency downtown, and this is a downtown thread. And if you read my post you would see that I was stating that Vidorra has probably never provided accurate numbers on sales. This Blog gives some insight on the condo market downtown.

The Vistana units are apartments, so not as excellent an example as you think. There are no conclusions to be drawn, the state of residency has been laid out at this luncheon by those directly involved and the conclusion is? There is interest in living downtown, but those interested either cannot afford (or don't like) what's available or they would like a test drive.

[miaht82]

Originally Posted by kornbread

It is mentioned in the link to the Blog


You should read it. It's related to residency downtown, and this is a downtown thread. And if you read my post you would see that I was stating that Vidorra has probably never provided accurate numbers on sales. This Blog gives some insight on the condo market downtown.

The Vistana units are apartments, so not as excellent an example as you think. There are no conclusions to be drawn, the state of residency has been laid out at this luncheon by those directly involved and the conclusion is? There is interest in living downtown, but those interested either cannot afford (or don't like) what's available or they would like a test drive.

I reference the links in hopes that they will be read. Glad to see that at least you did. I think you are pretty spot on with your assesment.

Vidorra has always been up and down with their numbers, I don't get it either. I optimistically gave them the benefit of the doubt at first and hoped that things were going well but after doing some math and seeing different numbers being put out, 70 units sounds about right. Still, I'd rather see 70 units sold than an empty lot.

The high number of vacancies in condos might be skewed a bit by the 70+ available at Vidorra and 140 available at Alteza. Judson Lofts are pretty solidly taken and I think that only a couple of units at Travis Lofts, Andalusia and Riverview are available. Overall there is still a very small amount of condos in DT and 300 new condos in 2 years is alot for the market to absorb, especially given the current climate.

Condos are nice, but I like the rate that they're adding apartments; there will be close to 750 more units in a little more than a year. With that many more residents DT, theres bound to be a few more amenities available DT that will make buying in DT a bit more attractive.

[kornbread]

Originally Posted by miaht82

Vidorra has always been up and down with their numbers, I don't get it either. I optimistically gave them the benefit of the doubt at first and hoped that things were going well but after doing some math and seeing different numbers being put out, 70 units sounds about right. Still, I'd rather see 70 units sold than an empty lot.

The high number of vacancies in condos might be skewed a bit by the 70+ available at Vidorra and 140 available at Alteza. Judson Lofts are pretty solidly taken and I think that only a couple of units at Travis Lofts, Andalusia and Riverview are available. Overall there is still a very small amount of condos in DT and 300 new condos in 2 years is alot for the market to absorb, especially given the current climate.

Condos are nice, but I like the rate that they're adding apartments; there will be close to 750 more units in a little more than a year. With that many more residents DT, theres bound to be a few more amenities available DT that will make buying in DT a bit more attractive.

It kind of seems like people prefer smaller scale developments. Maybe they get a better sense of community in those types of settings? Maybe a high-rise would do better in River North or lower broadway than east of IH 37?

From what I understand, the units that went first in Vidorra were the townhomes. At the same time Vidorra was proposed there was interest in re-developing the Freidrich site (which I imagine would have had that townhome feel).

Maybe if the city got behind the Friedrich project we might have seen residency develop in a better way. From an outsiders point of view, dropping a 20 story building in that location kind of feels like an island where as places like the Judson Lofts seem to be more about being in and developing a neighborhood.

Of course, the climate has definately had an effect because even a number of the smaller projects have gone from condo to apartment like St. Benedicts and 1221.

[ydoc14]

a large American flag now flies proudly in the San Antonio skyline

[The Model]

http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php...3923.701290514

[The Model]

I posted a picture of the American Flag on top of the Tower Life Building. I have it on my Facebook Profile, its also on my flickr. I just have trouble posting pictures all the time.

[FastFerrari82]

Originally Posted by The Model

http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php...3923.701290514

Great Pic! ! !! !!

[KevinFromTexas]

Cool. So they got the flag up. That is a really big flag!

[miaht82]

Originally Posted by kornbread

It kind of seems like people prefer smaller scale developments. Maybe they get a better sense of community in those types of settings? Maybe a high-rise would do better in River North or lower broadway than east of IH 37?

It does seem kinda out of place now, but I think with some decent infill, that'll change, although it might take a few years. There is a large lot on the corner of Commerce/Cherry that could fit a Vistana-like structure; plus it could help with the parking issues that they blame for the lack of vibrancy in St. Pauls Square. That sounds like it could be a project that the newly formed Centro Partnership could tackle; offer the developer some cash for public parking. That plus incentives for building on the East Side, offer some affordable housing and get grants for that; seems like it offsets some of the costs for a developer. Its still close enough to DT that it would do well vacany-wise, and it could lead to a small pocket of gentrification between that and Carver Academy.

Okay, so I took my day off to walk around DT instead of getting in line for a free meal at Applebee's or a couple of free donuts at Krispy Kreme. Here they are.

The new Ricos HQ's on Presa across from the Hog Stand.


New Bexar County Garage on Flores.


The Market Square getting a facelift/makeover.


Skyline should change some by 2012 and then again by 2015(ish)


Where's the Embassy Suites? It blends right in.


When you add a few more colors in, it's easier to spot.




Crane at Trinity. Both Trinity and UIW are running out of place to expand, but they both are/have this year.


Overlooking "Little Italy"


Lets see what UHS gives us....


The Broadway peeking from behind the Baptist Hospital.


Soledad side of Embassy Suites. I guess a wheelchair could fit.


Houston St. side of hotel.


Its not as bad as streetside




Whats an improvement to the River without some kind of water feature.






From behind Weston Centre.


Finally done with the facade repairs.

Originally Posted by ydoc14

a large American flag now flies proudly in the San Antonio skyline

Yes it does....


All photos taken by me.

[KevinFromTexas]

Nice pictures. I'm looking forward to getting back and seeing the Tower Life Building with the new flagpole and copula restored for the first time. It looks much better without that huge antenna.

[oldmanshirt]

Great pics as always. Seems like Houston St. is ready to buzz, all it needs is more residents!

[necropolis]

You think they would have at least cleaned up that concrete railing a bit, maybe a good power wash/scrubbing like what they did with the TownePlace Suites.

[jaga185]

I actually hate that wall. It makes it feel really claustrophobic... to me at least. I hate that they kept it. But yes, a nice power wash would have been nice.

Great pics Miah.

[Complex01]

Big flag in the sky. It does look very nice...

[JACKinBeantown]

Originally Posted by necropolis

You think they would have at least cleaned up that concrete railing a bit, maybe a good power wash/scrubbing like what they did with the TownePlace Suites.

Where are the barstaurants? This is the Riverwalk!

[The Model]

Why don't Trinity and ICW build taller structures if their running out of space! I'm not asking for 50 story towers. 8 to 10 storys would be nice

[Keep-SA-Lame]

Originally Posted by The Model

Why don't Trinity and ICW build taller structures if their running out of space! I'm not asking for 50 story towers. 8 to 10 storys would be nice

Trinity doesn't have any long term growth plans like UIW does. I don't see the current enrollment going up much in the future (2000 undergrad right now I think). They want to stay small.

The crane is for a new science center. I saw a rendering it's not particularly tall (4 stories I think). But it still looks nice.

[The Model]

I took this picture on Veterans Day.

I hope the picture comes out, still trying to post pictures, if not I apologize.