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  #21  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 4:15 PM
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Easiest way to check out the VIVA transitway i think would be to get the viva bus from Finch Station (the Northern terminus of the Yonge subway line) or any northbound YRT bus to Highway 7 and take a VIVA express bus from there in any direction. If you dont see a new streetcar on the waterfront line or at Union Station and on Spadina, just wait for the next one and take it.

The walk from Front Street to Bloor Street on Yonge Street is not too long and interesting enough with a good variety of quirky stores, restaurants and sights, I would say it's a must see and youre always near a subway station. Also, the PATH network is the world's largest underground pedestrian and shopping complex. It connects stores, office towers, restaurants, universities, government buildings union station, subway stations and some hospitals too.
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Last edited by mistercorporate; Dec 29, 2016 at 5:11 PM.
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  #22  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 4:58 PM
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I agree that PATH is quite unique to Toronto and would probably be interesting to see. There's nothing about it that is particularly unusual from normal indoor retail except the massive breadth of the system. 4-5pm in March would probably knock you off your feet.
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  #23  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 5:34 PM
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If you travel by car between the two, also consider stopping in Kingston. It's a very urban small city (the metro is about 150,000 and the old city about 65,000) with one of Canada's finest historic districts.
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  #24  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 6:26 PM
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Toronto's CBD (Union to Queen) is definitely dominated by modern office buildings but for an office ghetto I think it's a pretty nice one. If you're going in March though, it will probably be more interesting to check out the indoor portions - the PATH and the atriums and lobbies. Some of the squares and plazas can be nice, but mostly in the warmer months when the office crowd is out there eating lunch.
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  #25  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 6:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirrus View Post
2. What's the best way to get to Markham on transit? I'm interested in the Viva "rapidway" on Highway 7. But I'll only go see it if it's easy to get to and doesn't take too long. GO to Unionville? Viva Blue line from Finch to Richmond? Something else?
The VIVA purple line, along Highway 7, is the impressive one with the separated lanes and sophisticated transit stations. The north-south Viva Blue line is a pretty basic, but frequent, limited stop bus and doesn't contain anything really interesting to transit geeks.

If you're going to do VIVA purple, I highly suggest you take the eastern leg from Richmond Hill to Enterprise, rather than the western leg from Richmond Hill to York University.

The eastern leg not only contains model TOD projects like "Downtown" Markham, at Enterprise station (not really a downtown at all), but also goes past Chinese ethnoburbs that contain some of the best Chinese food on the continent (particularly around the Leslie stop).

The Western leg mostly goes through very boring subdivisions and industrial areas.

In any case, if you're staying downtown, York Region is way out there, so I'd budget at least half a day to do this.
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  #26  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 7:13 PM
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You might want to check Lionel_groulx metro station. It it well done to get from the Green Line to the Orange line (and vice versa) with just walking a few steps.
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  #27  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 8:10 PM
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Originally Posted by eternallyme View Post
If you travel by car between the two, also consider stopping in Kingston. It's a very urban small city (the metro is about 150,000 and the old city about 65,000) with one of Canada's finest historic districts.
Too bad they don't do Kingston Penitentiary tours in March. But yes, Kingston is a nice city.

Of course the nicest way to travel between Toronto and Montreal is on VIA Rail, which also travels through Kingston and Ottawa. Ottawa is famous for its bus transitways, which have been so successful, that some are presently being converted into a light metro.
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  #28  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 10:16 PM
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I really don't think an outside visitor will be that impressed by Markham.

I agree with the Queen streetcar recommendatiob, Maybe get yourself a day pass. Walking west along Queen from the CBD is a good way to catch the urban vibe of Toronto. Definitely see Kensington Market too. The area around St. Lawrence Market is interesting as well. Maybe also the University of Toronto campus.
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  #29  
Old Posted Dec 29, 2016, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by jeremy_haak View Post
I agree that PATH is quite unique to Toronto and would probably be interesting to see. There's nothing about it that is particularly unusual from normal indoor retail except the massive breadth of the system. 4-5pm in March would probably knock you off your feet.
The other unique system doesn't get as much love from the locals in Anthony Boirdain's Layover in Montreal. (around the 11:20 mark) "It's a beeping mall.." seems to sum it up fairly well. Other than a few impressive bits, bits with no stores, it is just a beeping mall!
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xo2kqf_
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  #30  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 1:51 AM
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Originally Posted by OutOfTowner View Post
The other unique system doesn't get as much love from the locals in Anthony Boirdain's Layover in Montreal. (around the 11:20 mark) "It's a beeping mall.." seems to sum it up fairly well. Other than a few impressive bits, bits with no stores, it is just a beeping mall!
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xo2kqf_
He also mentioned in the show and in an interview after that his initial impression of Toronto was clouded by the description he got from the Montreal friends/chefs he initially came to visit. After the layover, once he'd had a chance to see Toronto properly, his impression totally changed and he liked it very much. Claimed that the city vibe reminded him of Brooklyn.
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  #31  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 2:06 AM
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Originally Posted by jeremy_haak View Post
I agree that PATH is quite unique to Toronto and would probably be interesting to see. There's nothing about it that is particularly unusual from normal indoor retail except the massive breadth of the system. 4-5pm in March would probably knock you off your feet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistercorporate View Post
He also mentioned in the show and in an interview after that his initial impression of Toronto was clouded by the description he got from the Montreal friends/chefs he initially came to visit. After the layover, once he'd had a chance to see Toronto properly, his impression totally changed and he liked it very much. Claimed that the city vibe reminded him of Brooklyn.
Huh? I was talking about underground shopping.

No need to get all defensive, I'm sure he enjoyed his traditional Toronto poutine.
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  #32  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 2:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
I really don't think an outside visitor will be that impressed by Markham.
He said he was really into transit infrastructure and the Viva Rapidway is a very impressive piece of modern transit infrastructure; I took a trip up there once to gawk at it, it was quite memorable.
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  #33  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 2:08 AM
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Kingston & Ottawa are great stops in between Montreal & Toronto, if you have the time to get to them. Getting from their train stations to their downtown cores by transit kinda sucks, though. (Both are about to get WAY better on this file, but not for a few more years).

The Kingston Express BRT system is not very impressive at all infrastructure wise (just limited stop buses with some pretty looking shelters and some signal priority) but it is somewhat remarkable in how great (frequency, speed, etc.) of a service it provides considering how tiny the city is. Not many North American cities of Kingston's size have such good transit. That's not something I think a tourist could really appreciate, though.
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  #34  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 4:16 AM
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Thanks everyone! I don't think I have any more immediate questions.

The only reason I'm interested in Markham is the Viva Rapidway. If it's going to take half a day then I prooooobably won't bother. We'll see how things go.

And I arrive in TO via train, so no side trips to Kingston or Ottawa.
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  #35  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistercorporate View Post
He also mentioned in the show and in an interview after that his initial impression of Toronto was clouded by the description he got from the Montreal friends/chefs he initially came to visit. After the layover, once he'd had a chance to see Toronto properly, his impression totally changed and he liked it very much. Claimed that the city vibe reminded him of Brooklyn.
Evil Montrealers turned Anthony Bourdain off Toronto?

Honestly, if there is any truth to this at all, it says more about his credibility as a food critic than anything else...
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  #36  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by hipster duck View Post
The VIVA purple line, along Highway 7, is the impressive one with the separated lanes and sophisticated transit stations. The north-south Viva Blue line is a pretty basic, but frequent, limited stop bus and doesn't contain anything really interesting to transit geeks.

If you're going to do VIVA purple, I highly suggest you take the eastern leg from Richmond Hill to Enterprise, rather than the western leg from Richmond Hill to York University.

The eastern leg not only contains model TOD projects like "Downtown" Markham, at Enterprise station (not really a downtown at all), but also goes past Chinese ethnoburbs that contain some of the best Chinese food on the continent (particularly around the Leslie stop).

The Western leg mostly goes through very boring subdivisions and industrial areas.

In any case, if you're staying downtown, York Region is way out there, so I'd budget at least half a day to do this.
If someone is interested at attempts at building better suburbs, Markham offers the best example in the GTA. The best place to check out in this respect in Montreal is probably Bois-Franc in Ville St-Laurent which is not that far from downtown. Further out there is Quartier de la Gare in Mont-St-Hilaire.
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  #37  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Cirrus View Post

And I arrive in TO via train, so no side trips to Kingston or Ottawa.
Toronto-Kingston-Montreal or Toronto-Ottawa-Montreal are definitely doable by train, if you are interested. FYI.
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  #38  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by jeremy_haak View Post
I agree that PATH is quite unique to Toronto and would probably be interesting to see. There's nothing about it that is particularly unusual from normal indoor retail except the massive breadth of the system.
Toronto's PATH and Montreal's underground city: faces only a mother or a curious urbanist could love.

Not fond of spending more time than I have to in either of them, but worth a visit I guess if you're interested in seeing how they did it and what they ended up with.
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  #39  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 1:24 PM
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/\ Agreed. They are both vastly overrated as a tourist attraction. I find it somewhat embarrasing when the RESO is mentionned in a list of stuff to see in Montreal. It would be low on my list. If one want to see art, the newly opened 5th pavillon of the Montreal Museum of Fine Arts is where to go.

Of interrest in the newly opened stuff also is the observatory on top of Place Ville-Marie. Also worth a mention: cité mémoire, in Old Montreal.

http://www.montrealenhistoires.com/memory_city
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  #40  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2016, 5:13 PM
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I list it only as something that is definitely worthwhile for an urbanist to see. Also, he'll be visiting in March and might appreciate it.
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