Canadian Urban Canyons

[TorontoDrew]

Originally Posted by christmas

You just described the city itself.

Just a sad and pathetic comment by a petty person. This is a pic of the financial core. A Mon to Fri 9-5 area. This is a true canyon. If you want great street life one only needs to walk a block or 2 in any direction. I forget which city was voted the most boring a few years back? Comments like yours just show your biased views or complete lack of knowledge of the facts. My advice to you. Hop on a plane and leave your little city. It's a big world with a lot to offer and you may hate to find out but Toronto has an awesome pedestrian level experience. Chances are you won't though, your loss.

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by christmas

You just described the city itself.

[christmas]

Originally Posted by TorontoDrew

Just a sad and pathetic comment by a petty person. This is a pic of the financial core. A Mon to Fri 9-5 area. This is a true canyon. If you want great street life one only needs to walk a block or 2 in any direction. I forget which city was voted the most boring a few years back? Comments like yours just show your biased views or complete lack of knowledge of the facts. My advice to you. Hop on a plane and leave your little city. It's a big world with a lot to offer and you may hate to find out but Toronto has an awesome pedestrian level experience. Chances are you won't though, your loss.

I was born and raised in Markham, lived in downtown TO for 5 years, NYC, Seoul and Tokyo for about 1 year. Toronto by far has the worst pedestrian level experience. Not to mention, very run-down too. Next time you're on Yonge, take a look at the horrid quality of the cracked and neglected streets and the sidewalks, the ugly and chaotic utility poles crossing randomly throughout the city, and the run-down "heritage buildings" studded in between the brutalist buildings. I hope you realize how low-quality the city actually is. To me, Toronto is the most interesting city to watch, but it lacks quality, and that's a fact. It could be better.
No wonder there's the famous phrase that says "Toronto is overrated". Exactly how I'd put it.
The aesthetics of the city doesn't even come close to Montreal, and Vancouver. Not that that's a problem though. No harm in having cities to "just" live in.
And for your knowledge, I don't even identify myself as a Vancouverite actually lol. What made you thought your guess can be a fact?

[north 42]

Originally Posted by christmas

I was born and raised in Markham, lived in downtown TO for 5 years, NYC, Seoul and Tokyo for about 1 year. Toronto by far has the worst pedestrian level experience. Not to mention, very run-down too. Next time you're on Yonge, take a look at the horrid quality of the cracked and neglected streets and the sidewalks, the ugly and chaotic utility poles crossing randomly throughout the city, and the run-down "heritage buildings" studded in between the brutalist buildings. I hope you realize how low-quality the city actually is. To me, Toronto is the most interesting city to watch, but it lacks quality, and that's a fact. It could be better.
No wonder there's the famous phrase that says "Toronto is overrated". Exactly how I'd put it.
The aesthetics of the city doesn't even come close to Montreal, and Vancouver. Not that that's a problem though. No harm in having cities to "just" live in.
And for your knowledge, I don't even identify myself as a Vancouverite actually lol. What made you thought your guess can be a fact?

"Famous phrase" yeah, ok! Bitter ex Torontonians are as bad as bitter ex Detroiters!

[TorontoDrew]

[IMG]Toronto Blue Hour - King St by Ravi Pardesi, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]King Street by Yu-Hsin Chen, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]Commerce Court North Observation Deck by Marcanadian, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]Commerce Court North Observation Deck by Marcanadian, on Flickr[/IMG]

Spadina Canyon rises up around Dundas south to King.
[IMG]One Spadina by Marcanadian, on Flickr[/IMG]

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by christmas

I was born and raised in Markham, lived in downtown TO for 5 years, NYC, Seoul and Tokyo for about 1 year. Toronto by far has the worst pedestrian level experience. Not to mention, very run-down too. Next time you're on Yonge, take a look at the horrid quality of the cracked and neglected streets and the sidewalks, the ugly and chaotic utility poles crossing randomly throughout the city, and the run-down "heritage buildings" studded in between the brutalist buildings. I hope you realize how low-quality the city actually is. To me, Toronto is the most interesting city to watch, but it lacks quality, and that's a fact. It could be better.
No wonder there's the famous phrase that says "Toronto is overrated". Exactly how I'd put it.
The aesthetics of the city doesn't even come close to Montreal, and Vancouver. Not that that's a problem though. No harm in having cities to "just" live in.
And for your knowledge, I don't even identify myself as a Vancouverite actually lol. What made you thought your guess can be a fact?

You're confused. The aesthetics of Toronto don't come close to Montreal, certainly, but Vancouver? Don't be ridiculous.

Toronto is awesome at street level.



But it's not conventionally beautiful.

[isaidso]

That street scene isn't beautiful in any sense, actually. Toronto streets are more vibrant and interesting than Vancouver streets (for the most part) but Vancouver wins hands down aesthetically. I was only there for 2 weeks but I struggled to find ugly bits... even out as far as Burnaby.

Huge sections of Toronto are horrendously ugly; even our main street is an eye sore. As bad as the section of Yonge is between Dundas and Bloor it's even worse north of Sheppard. I walked that stretch to the last subway stop and it's shockingly horrible. Block after block of utter garbage. You just don't see stuff like that in Vancouver.

That photo above which I assume is meant to show Toronto's prettiness, isn't all that pretty. A mess of wooden utility polls and electrical, ugly store fronts, windows and doors that are merely utilitarian, extremely narrow concrete sidewalks, a lack of foliage, etc. Vibrant? Yes. Pretty? No.

Btw, I don't agree with the statement 'christmas' made that Toronto is over rated. It's still massively under rated around the world. Toronto's big 'black mark' is the quality of its buildings and the quality of its public realm. The Bloor Street improvement project, Berczy Park, and that bit in front of Union Station look fabulous but are the exception rather than the rule. I love Toronto but it's not a pretty city. Quality and design is improving but it will take 50 years to re-work this city. Even the downtown will take another 10-15 years minimum.

[yaletown_fella]

Originally Posted by christmas

I was born and raised in Markham, lived in downtown TO for 5 years, NYC, Seoul and Tokyo for about 1 year. Toronto by far has the worst pedestrian level experience. Not to mention, very run-down too. Next time you're on Yonge, take a look at the horrid quality of the cracked and neglected streets and the sidewalks, the ugly and chaotic utility poles crossing randomly throughout the city, and the run-down "heritage buildings" studded in between the brutalist buildings. I hope you realize how low-quality the city actually is. To me, Toronto is the most interesting city to watch, but it lacks quality, and that's a fact. It could be better.
No wonder there's the famous phrase that says "Toronto is overrated". Exactly how I'd put it.
The aesthetics of the city doesn't even come close to Montreal, and Vancouver. Not that that's a problem though. No harm in having cities to "just" live in.
And for your knowledge, I don't even identify myself as a Vancouverite actually lol. What made you thought your guess can be a fact?

I agree that the aesthetics of Vancouver's downtown areas are better than Toronto's downtown.

But the aesthetics of Torontos wealthy SFH areas are, in my opinion, better than the wealthy areas of Vancouver. I'm not including the distant views/scenery.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by yaletown_fella

But the aesthetics of Torontos wealthy SFH areas are, in my opinion, better than the wealthy areas of Vancouver. I'm not including the views/scenery.

Toronto's wealthy enclaves like Rosedale, Lawrence Park, and Wychwood Park are some of the best I've seen anywhere. I agree that wealthy SFH neighbourhoods is something Toronto does very well.

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by rousseau

But it's not conventionally beautiful.

Originally Posted by isaidso

That street scene isn't beautiful in any sense, actually.

...

That photo above which I assume is meant to show Toronto's prettiness, isn't all that pretty.

Reading comprehension not your strong suit?

[TorontoDrew]

Originally Posted by rousseau

You're confused. The aesthetics of Toronto don't come close to Montreal, certainly, but Vancouver? Don't be ridiculous.

Toronto is awesome at street level.



But it's not conventionally beautiful.

It's as though he never left the 905 and only left Markham for the airport. It's as if he has never seen the sidewalks in Montreal, or in cities like Chicago or New York. It's almost as if he only visits tourist traps where infrastructure is well maintained but never veered off the beaten path to see most North American cities have broken sidewalks. Toronto actually does a better job then most with sidewalk repairs as do most Canadian cities. No matter what his excuses are his post was sad and pathetic.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Btw, I don't agree with the statement 'christmas' made that Toronto is over rated. It's still massively under rated around the world. .

I agree with this. Toronto is under-rated by most everyone. Except by those who live in the 416!

[TorontoDrew]

One of my favorite canyons. I can't seem to find a pic of it but this park hidden away behind old bank towers.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.6498...7i13312!8i6656

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by TorontoDrew

One of my favorite canyons. I can't seem to find a pic of it but this park hidden away behind old bank towers.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.6498...7i13312!8i6656

That view is actually really cool.

[yaletown_fella]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Toronto's wealthy enclaves like Rosedale, Lawrence Park, and Wychwood Park are some of the best I've seen anywhere. I agree that wealthy SFH neighbourhoods is something Toronto does very well.

I think a walk through Wychwood Park should be on tourist brochures. But I kind of like that it's a hidden gem.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by isaidso

That street scene isn't beautiful in any sense, actually. Toronto streets are more vibrant and interesting than Vancouver streets (for the most part) but Vancouver wins hands down aesthetically. I was only there for 2 weeks but I struggled to find ugly bits... even out as far as Burnaby.

Huge sections of Toronto are horrendously ugly; even our main street is an eye sore. As bad as the section of Yonge is between Dundas and Bloor it's even worse north of Sheppard. I walked that stretch to the last subway stop and it's shockingly horrible. Block after block of utter garbage. You just don't see stuff like that in Vancouver.

Is Vancouver all that mind-blowing aesthetically, though? Its natural setting is fantastic, but the streetscapes have never felt so far beyond Toronto, or for that matter a lot of cities, larger and smaller.

Stretches like this, or this are fine, but with the exception of a few overhead wires, aren't all that different from Toronto.

[niwell]

Also worth noting that the comparison examples are three of the world's biggest and most vibrant cities. Of those, Tokyo and Seoul aren't exactly known for their aesthetic beauty though. NYC can be downright shabby in many places too, although the main tourist areas are certainly at a higher standard than Toronto (or any Canadian city, really).

[christmas]

I just want to make it clear that I love Toronto and seeing it grow and come into its own as a city of quality is one of the most gratifying experiences to me. I'm in Vancouver for now, but my ultimate destination will be Toronto (home).

However, the city is undoubtedly lacking in terms of infrastructural quality and how it is presented on street-level. As a starter, referring to what Isaidso said, the utility poles (esp. on King & Queen) is unnecessarily derelict. No (world-class) city that I've visited with streetcars and trams, has messy utility poles as seen in Toronto. The ones along Queen and King is to the point where it makes photography difficult unless you are digging for that run-down, hippy vibe.

Plus, it's not only those wooden poles that are the problem. It's the chaotic lines of which indicate no consideration on part of the city to aesthetically improve the quality of its infrastructure:

Seriously, this is Canada we're talking about. Not the rural parts of China or India. And even those cities get it right with their main streets:

1.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.64782...7i13312!8i6656

2.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.64385...7i13312!8i6656

3. https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.64409...7i13312!8i6656

Again, I've been to most major North American cities and the road quality of Toronto is among the worst. Yes, it's cold there and freezes regularly in the winter, but there are many cities that get as cold and hot as Toronto who are capable of maintaining good road quality (or sometimes excellent if you look at the cities in Japan) So that itself doesn't seem like a good excuse.

1.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.64784...7i13312!8i6656

2.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.66987...7i13312!8i6656

3.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.64796...7i13312!8i6656

[Acajack]

Easy to like. Harder to love.

[jakethesnake]

As someone from Edmonton with no horse in the race I have to agree that street level Toronto is better than Vancouver.