Portland Open Thread

[uncommon.name]

Playing Devil's advocate here, but the recent crime, violence, and social issues that Portland is facing has a definite impact on the development of this City. I think we can all see that. So posting an article about such topics, when there is a direct connection with the development and growth of our City... seems on topic to me.

[subterranean]

I post both positive and negative content about Portland. I occasionally make posts with original content such as progress photos of buildings under construction, and I'm supportive of updates from other forumers and of good development in general. I care about this city and region deeply and urban issues in general. I do not intentionally derail conversations, troll, or name call. But since I occasionally post news of interest or critical content that the moderation team would like to bury about their precious city, I get harassed and told it's "not welcome," or posts get deleted or threads get locked entirely. I've been keeping a file on this moderation team and its actions. You may be moderators with wide discretion, but you are not dictators, and I don't even think Kevin, as politically active as he is on this forum, would be fine with the level of "discretion" this mod team takes with "guiding" its content.

It feels very much like you both continue to show up at topics you dislike and provoke behavior with immature responses. It's consistently argued under the guise that this is a development-only forum. But this is and always has been a development and urban issues forum. 2oh1 is exactly right that Reddit is a cesspool where mean-spirited people hide behind their handles and post divisive crap from god-knows-where around the world. We are a community here who shares a common interest, even if we express it in different ways. Continually pushing out views and topics that don't fit into a certain narrative is not the move. It just makes people not want to contribute despite a long history of being here. I have never experienced this type of weird pressure from mods in the 20 years I've been on this site.

[MarkDaMan]

Originally Posted by subterranean

I post both positive and negative content about Portland. I occasionally make posts with original content such as progress photos of buildings under construction, and I'm supportive of updates from other forumers and of good development in general. I care about this city and region deeply and urban issues in general. I do not intentionally derail conversations, troll, or name call. But since I occasionally post news of interest or critical content that the moderation team would like to bury about their precious city, I get harassed and told it's "not welcome," or posts get deleted or threads get locked entirely. I've been keeping a file on this moderation team and its actions. You may be moderators with wide discretion, but you are not dictators, and I don't even think Kevin, as politically active as he is on this forum, would be fine with the level of "discretion" this mod team takes with "guiding" its content.

It feels very much like you both continue to show up at topics you dislike and provoke behavior with immature responses. It's consistently argued under the guise that this is a development-only forum. But this is and always has been a development and urban issues forum. 2oh1 is exactly right that Reddit is a cesspool where mean-spirited people hide behind their handles and post divisive crap from god-knows-where around the world. We are a community here who shares a common interest, even if we express it in different ways. Continually pushing out views and topics that don't fit into a certain narrative is not the move. It just makes people not want to contribute despite a long history of being here. I have never experienced this type of weird pressure from mods in the 20 years I've been on this site.

This seems deeply personal to me. You're keeping a file on our actions? We're provoking people to make immature responses? I just don't agree with you at all.

It appears to me that you went to Skyscraper City to build a competing Portland development thread and they rebuffed you. After that you came back here and started the "Coffee" thread and have been angling to push myself and Iain out for being big mean moderators crushing your posts. That's just not the case. At least be honest about your intentions.

[subterranean]

Originally Posted by MarkDaMan

This seems deeply personal to me. You're keeping a file on our actions? We're provoking people to make immature responses? I just don't agree with you at all.

It appears to me that you went to Skyscraper City to build a competing Portland development thread and they rebuffed you. After that you came back here and started the "Coffee" thread and have been angling to push myself and Iain out for being big mean moderators crushing your posts. That's just not the case. At least be honest about your intentions.

Again, no idea what this has to do with anything? Indeed, I asked how to get a Portland sub-forum over there because SSP has no image hosting and I take a LOT of photos that I think others would like to see. It is an incredibly PITA to post photos to this forum, which I have brought up here on several occasions. Thus me stating "behind the times".

[subterranean]

I see you again deleted Corbin's last post, but I took a screen shot of it also before you deleted it. Same old game.

[MarkDaMan]

Originally Posted by subterranean

Again, no idea what this has to do with anything? Indeed, I asked how to get a Portland sub-forum over there because SSP has no image hosting and I take a LOT of photos that I think others would like to see. It is an incredibly PITA to post photos to this forum, which I have brought up here on several occasions. Thus me stating "behind the times".

On March 17, SSC told you no dice to creating a Portland local over there. On March 22nd you started coming after the "moderation" of this thread. Coincidence?

[subterranean]

I have no idea what you're getting at? I have been on both sites for a very long time but we all have been more active over here. In a perfect world, this site would simply update its vBulletin software.

[subterranean]

[MarkDaMan]

^Umm...

[subterranean]

Um what? I have not posted any substantive photo updates here since.

The people are over here. Our history is over here. It's just unfortunate that SSP doesn't stay up-to-date and the Portland sub-forum has the moderators that it does.

[subterranean]

[MarkDaMan]

Originally Posted by subterranean

Um what? I have not posted any substantive photo updates here since.

The people are over here. Our history is over here. It's just unfortunate that SSP doesn't stay up-to-date and the Portland sub-forum has the moderators that it does.

I think we're incredibly lucky to have Iain here as a moderator. He's respected in the development community, frequently featured in local news updates as the source, and is one of the nicest people you will ever meet. This forum would have died years ago if not for his contributions including a lot of hours of maintenance that you don't see, to keep a historic account of what's been built to go along with our tracking of future developments.

[maccoinnich]

Thank you, Mark.

Subterranean, you haven't haven't been banned; you haven't even been suspended. All you've had is repeated requests not to try to turn this into a politics forum. There's only two moderators, and I personally am not checking this forum around the clock every day. Politics discussions tend to get really heated and I personally am not in a position to be monitoring them every day—and even when I am checking, it's a thankless task. When I do step in and moderate I get criticized by one bunch of forumers; when I don't, I get criticized by another bunch. Sometimes I'll lock a thread (temporarily, or very occasionally permanently) because I don't want to be in the position of surgically editing other people's posts and I think the best course of action is to let things cool down a bit.

My role here is a whole lot easier if we all stick to the topics described in the subforum labels (which, btw, were not created by me and I'm not able to edit). Note that even the "General Discussion" subforum has the description "Topics that do not fit into other forum sections. Please note this is not an "off-topic, anything goes" forum.".

[urbanlife]

Originally Posted by 2oh1

OH, REALLY?

(...did we ever get a definitive answer on whether Stumptown is the new Starbucks-But Better? We had an entire thread on it and no one minded)

Don't be hating coffee.

[subterranean]

Originally Posted by MarkDaMan

I think we're incredibly lucky to have Iain here as a moderator. He's respected in the development community, frequently featured in local news updates as the source, and is one of the nicest people you will ever meet. This forum would have died years ago if not for his contributions including a lot of hours of maintenance that you don't see, to keep a historic account of what's been built to go along with our tracking of future developments.

Few people are all good or all bad, and this isn't a total indictment of either of your contributions here, or offline. But I have had a growing irritation with the moderation here as the pandemic dragged on, which likely reached a peak last March for me when it became apparent that there really is little separation between the moderation and the personal politics of the moderator(s).

Recently I had noticed that some discussion had been left alone in the Downtown Portland section, and I appreciated that - I thought we were doing better. I think the members did a great job discussing some crazy crap that has been going on here, and I think it's a great example of how we are grown ups and can handle ourselves pretty well, for the most part. Sure, we have differences of opinion, but there is no doubt some collective trauma that we've all experienced as a result of the changes the city has experienced the last few years and sharing that stuff isn't unhealthy at all. Ignoring it is, IMO. I still believe some of those discussions belong here, which is why I posted in the Open Portland Thread.

[sopdx]

I support the moderators and their decisions. Perhaps it's better to get rid of the Open-thread section altogether and as Mark said, keep blogs about and or related to architecture and urban design.