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  #1  
Old Posted Jul 18, 2009, 2:58 AM
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Downtown residents getting more affluent, report says

Downtown residents getting more affluent, report says

Fri, July 17, 2009

Londoners living downtown are younger and richer — and there’s more of them every year, a new city hall report says.

The State of the Downtown report, an annual analysis of progress in the city’s core that was first done in 1998, breaks down Statistics Canada numbers that show a growing affluence among the people calling downtown London home.

From 2001 to ’06, downtown’s median household income jumped from $34,667 to $46,908 — a 35% increase that far outpaced the overall city increase over that same period (16%).

The study also shows clearly that it’s young people who are driving the overall population growth of downtown, which in 1996 was home to 2,500 residents and now has 3,400.

Those between the ages of 20-44 represented 29% of that increase. The number of children residents has also jumped.




The news, though, isn’t all good in the annual report, which will be presented to council’s planning committee on Monday.

It appears 2005 may have represented a high-water mark in the decade-old effort to revitalize the core, with progress in some key areas flatlining or even declining since.

Vacancies, of course, also remain a problem, as illustrated by one particularly troubled section of Richmond Street.
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  #2  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2009, 1:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ldoto View Post
Downtown residents getting more affluent, report says
Guess it's turning into another Byron/Oakridge. True, we should be doing something about the emo piercing-covered people who stand around near Dundas and Richmond and are harder to get by than Tim Best's bar patio, but we don't need another Byron/Oakridge area packed with rich snobs.
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  #3  
Old Posted Jul 20, 2009, 6:40 PM
LondnPlanr LondnPlanr is offline
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Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
Guess it's turning into another Byron/Oakridge. True, we should be doing something about the emo piercing-covered people who stand around near Dundas and Richmond and are harder to get by than Tim Best's bar patio, but we don't need another Byron/Oakridge area packed with rich snobs.
The highlighted word is all that matters, friend.

By the way, all those 'rich snobs' are also the ones who buy the tickets for the expensive events at the JLC and Centennial Hall and The Grand Theatre, etc... you see where I am going with this. If they lived downtown, in some trendy, vibrant condo/highrise developments, then they just might attend more.

I don't understand your problem with the Downtown area being a 'rich, snobby' area.

Explain.
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  #4  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2009, 12:54 AM
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I don't understand your problem with the Downtown area being a 'rich, snobby' area.

Explain.
Because London is already stuck-up and snobby enough already. If you're not part of the "in" crowd that has money and acts a certain way and dresses a certain way, you're an outcast. But it won't matter to me in another couple years when I've moved far, far away from this city. And no, it's not "like that everywhere". I've travelled across North America and London has the most stuck-up and fake people anywhere.

A friend of mine who grew up in Istanbul and has lived all over the United States and recently moved to London says the same thing about London. And talking to a friend in Northern Ontario, London has this reputation up there.
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  #5  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2009, 1:28 AM
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So, what's your definition of "rich"? $40,000/year? $80,000/year? $100,000/year? Pray tell.

The median income for London families was nearly identical to the provincial median in the last census. You have no idea what you are talking about.

That number was a little under $69,000/year. That will very barely pay the bills for a family with a mortgage, car payments, and kids. Perhaps you feel that qualifies that family as a bunch of rich snobs.

And, if you think that a prosperous, successful community is a bad thing, please pack your bags and move to Istanbul like your friend. Please comrade, as soon as possible.




Quote:
Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
Because London is already stuck-up and snobby enough already. If you're not part of the "in" crowd that has money and acts a certain way and dresses a certain way, you're an outcast. But it won't matter to me in another couple years when I've moved far, far away from this city. And no, it's not "like that everywhere". I've travelled across North America and London has the most stuck-up and fake people anywhere.

A friend of mine who grew up in Istanbul and has lived all over the United States and recently moved to London says the same thing about London. And talking to a friend in Northern Ontario, London has this reputation up there.
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  #6  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2009, 3:34 AM
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A friend of mine who grew up in Istanbul and has lived all over the United States and recently moved to London says the same thing about London. And talking to a friend in Northern Ontario, London has this reputation up there.
This is the reputation that London has in Windsor too (ironically, Windsor has the higher average income though). But honestly, I've lived in London off and on for over 3 years and haven't really noticed that attitude among the people in London.

Living in downtown London and walking the streets, I don't get the impression that the average person in the downtown area is very wealthy. Besides, a median income of $46,000 isn't very much.
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  #7  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2009, 4:37 PM
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There's no attitude in London. I grew up in Oakridge, and you want the stuck-up rich/snobby people? Go north of Fanshawe between Wonderland and Adelaide.

Byron and Oakridge are very nice neighbourhoods, but in no way would I classify it to be snobby.

Sure i'm proud, and think London is one of the best places in Ontario to live. but that notion happens most places to be honest. Hometown pride exists. get used to it.
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  #8  
Old Posted Jul 22, 2009, 8:20 PM
LondnPlanr LondnPlanr is offline
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Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
... But it won't matter to me in another couple years when I've moved far, far away from this city.
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

It's not the so-called 'rich' people that are the problem, its YOU!

Get over it. Wow.
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  #9  
Old Posted Jul 23, 2009, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by LondnPlanr View Post
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

It's not the so-called 'rich' people that are the problem, its YOU!

Get over it. Wow.
Please explain to me why in all my travels to cities across North America, Londoners are the most difficult to approach out of any city, and are the least friendly. I can't control others. It's not my problem that others are self-absorbed and don't like talking to strangers. My mother went to high school in London and has lived in cities all over Canada, and she says the exact same thing. She said Halifax and much of the Maritimes are the exact opposite. Someone else one of my parents know said it took them many years to be able to get to know anyone in London, compared to another city they lived in. And yet another friend of mine said New Brunswick is a lot friendlier than London. And then there was my friend in Northern Ontario who left Western after two years and moved back home, in part because she couldn't stand the attitude of London. It's clearly not just me.

Maybe you should think about why many Londoners have an issue with the affluent class, instead of just brushing it off as my own personal problem. If you don't fit a certain stereotype in this city, it is exceptionally difficult to fit in. It's not something any one person can change; they can improve their own personal well-being by moving to a friendlier place, and that is my plan. It is my problem if I just sit around London and complain, but I have a plan to move beyond it. It's just going to take some money, which I will have in the next couple years from working.

Last edited by manny_santos; Jul 23, 2009 at 10:23 PM.
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  #10  
Old Posted Jul 24, 2009, 9:14 PM
go_leafs_go02 go_leafs_go02 is offline
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Yeah, I can say you don't like the place. Move somewhere else. I have that issue with the City of Hamilton. I go to school there during the year, and would transfer the heck out of that city if I could. I don't really mind the people and friends I've made there, but I just hate the urban design, the crumbling infrastructure, and the heavy industry dotting the bay there. Therefore, I will make the best effort possible NOT to live there.
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  #11  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2009, 4:01 AM
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Opportunities abound in downtown London

The recently released State of the Downtown report has suggested development in the city’s core has started to not only move forward, but even accelerate towards levels not seen in decades.

Colin Foster has experienced first-hand the ups and downs of living and working in downtown London.

Growing up, Mr. Foster worked at several downtown stores before eventually becoming a business owner himself – first of the Daily Grind coffee shop and then later, the Braywick Bistro. Mr. Foster owned the Daily Grind for over two years before moving on to open the Braywick, which he has operated for over seven years now.

Whether the streets have been full of shoppers or nearly empty because of business closures or large-scale construction, Mr. Foster says his commitment to the downtown has proven to be justified.

“Most of my working career has been on this block (the Braywick is located at 244 Dundas St.). It was 10 years ago we had the Bay across the street; the mall (Galleria at the time, now Citi Plaza) was full. People were quite enthusiastic around the time when I took over the coffee shop,” Mr. Foster says. “But then half the block closed when the Bay closed. The Free Press wrote about how the downtown was dying and here I was as a new business owner feeling like an island, it was very scary. But I was fortunate to have members of this community pointing out to me the big picture.”

The big picture, Mr. Foster says, would see the eventual construction of big draws like the London Convention Centre, the Covent Garden Market, the downtown library and the John Labatt Centre (JLC).

“It’s been a wondrous evolution. This (the Braywick) had been a diner for 67 years, it was a tired building in need of a lot of love to bring it back, but I was seeing beyond the short term. I see the downtown in a very similar way,” Mr. Foster says. “I believed in the downtown, I knew there were opportunities. It wasn’t just that they built the JLC and the next day everything was all right, but it has been a hundred tremendous opportunities opening up. Within three blocks there were 3,000 people to draw from. I definitely saw the opportunities with One London Place, TD Tower, Citi Plaza now. Busy begets busy and I think that is what you are seeing now.”

Marvin Rivas is someone taking advantage of those opportunities Mr. Foster refers to.

Mr. Rivas has purchased the building at 225 Dundas St. and is currently preparing to open a restaurant beneath the apartments he has already fully renovated and rented out.

“I spent 15 years in the restaurant business, everything from bussing tables to managing. A friend of mine who is a professor at Western (University of Western Ontario) came into the place I was working in Toronto and said that London needed a place like this. He later invited me to London, showed me around, and I like the city right away,” says Mr. Rivas, who is originally from El Salvador and moved to Toronto in the early 1990s. “The restaurants, the clubs, the bars, I have seen communities where their downtown’s had turned around and I see London being in the same place. You look at this block, there are no vacancies. It’s a busy, exciting place.”

Mr. Rivas says he expects to have spent $1 million by the time all his renovations are finished and the restaurant opens its doors later this year. However, he is quick to say the investment is one he believes will pay off.

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“This building was in terrible shape, but I saw potential. I believe in the people that are attracted to the downtown. If you have a great concept, they will come. I am hoping they will come into a fun, energetic place with fabulous food and a great atmosphere,” Mr. Rivas says. “And I hope Londoners look at the downtown in the same way. As a great place with a lot of positives. People have this misconception the downtown isn’t safe. But I don’t think that is the case. That is definitely not my experience.”

It hasn’t proven to be the case for Eddie Phimphrachanh either.

In 2005, at 20 years old, Mr. Phimphrachanh opened his Thaifoon Restaurant across from the JLC at 120 Dundas St. The success of the restaurant would lead Mr. Phimphrachanh to purchase another building, 238 Dundas St., where he would eventually open Lavish Nightclub in 2008 while also fully-renovating the upstairs for his own residence.

Mr. Phimphrachanh says his time in the downtown has shown him his faith in its future was justified.

“When I was first scouting for locations I looked at foot traffic in the downtown, the day was fairly steady, but the night was pretty dead. But the JLC was there and it was having an impact, it became the foundation for that restaurant. The concerts, games, it’s visibility, it made sense to be near it,” Mr. Phimphrachanh says. “Slowly you could see things beginning to turn. I saw a lot being down there. There was a mix of people coming downtown, students, hockey fans, concert goers. There was a buzz building and I never doubted that would grow.”

That growth would see Mr. Phimphrachanh move further down the block to open Lavish while also renovating his own residence.

“The prices were good, the opportunities were there, so I purchased the building. At first I was just going to live upstairs and rent out the bottom, but then I started crunching the numbers. I realised I could make more with my own business than I could make renting out the space,” Mr. Phimphrachanh says. “So we went forward with the club. It’s been very exciting. We have a very mixed crowd at Lavish. Very eclectic, fashion forward, trendy. You don’t have to be gay, straight, you really see everyone downtown now.”


Mr. Foster also knows a little something about the opportunities that come with working and living in the downtown. Mr. Foster not only owns the Braywick – and the catering business Wicked Catering that has grown out of it – but he purchased the building itself and renovated the apartments above it as well.

“You see the vibrancy in the people. You see young people, young vibrant people who are involved in the community. There are great urban units downtown that people have put the time into fixing up, that wonderful people have moved into,” Mr. Foster says. “When you live here 24 hours a day you really see it. It went from that construction period where there were not many people living downtown to now there are wonderful people living downtown, people who want the experience of living here. My parents moved from Oakridge to a condo downtown because they wanted this way of life. It is a totally different way of life and I am one of those who feel fortunate to be a part of it.”

As a businessman, Mr. Foster says he knows downtown London has seen its ups and downs, but he adds the investment that has been made in recent years has started to create something very positive.

“City council took a big risk by investing in downtown and I think we are seeing the result. There are more people working downtown, living downtown. It is frustrating when people say those things about downtown not being safe, about there being nothing to do here. It’s so not true,” Mr. Foster says. “This isn’t the core of 20 years ago, consumers have different shopping patterns now. But there are so many opportunities. I am someone who definitely believes in the downtown, in looking long-term, and I think you can see all the grassroots investment paying off.”

Mr. Phimphrachanh agrees the investment made downtown by both public and private investors has created something many Londoners remain unaware of.

“Personally I love being downtown. Everything is just footsteps away, everything is very accessible. It’s never dull. Yes you will run into panhandlers, homeless people, but you run into that in every city. It’s unfair to think of that as a London problem. It’s unfair to focus on the negatives,” Mr. Phimphrachanh. “I think the people who don’t come downtown would be surprised by what is here. All the unique shops you can’t find anywhere else. The restaurants. The city invested in the downtown and that is paying off. It’s an eclectic mix for sure, it’s definitely not cookie cutter. If you are open to experiencing new things, it is a great place to be.”
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  #12  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2009, 3:32 AM
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the grocery store is just footsteps away?
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