Why Rural America Needs Cities

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Personally, I'm not trying to be elitist about this. But it's just a fact of modern life - largely related to corporate consolidation - that jobs are flowing away from rural areas and into major metropolitan areas.

True, but most of the fastest growing metro areas are the low density sun belt cities that these urban elitist sorts abhor.

Originally Posted by Obadno

Your definition of urban is clearly an arbitrary line of density. Even most "urban" American "cities" have areas you wouldn't consider "urban" is Staten Island Urban to you? Thats NYC, what about the North West end of Chicago? Is that an Urban area to you?

He also likes to conveniently forget all the urban ghettos too. So yeah when you or I look at Chicago we see an urban core surrounded by lots of suburbs and ghettos but he doesn't because his view of Chicago is basically just inside the loop and nearby posh urban areas.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

True, but most of the fastest growing metro areas are the low density sun belt cities that these urban elitist sorts abhor.

But this isn't a thread about the Sun Belt vs. legacy cities. Nor is it really about walkability - functionally speaking suburbs and cities are both parts of the metropolitan economy. Rural areas are not. When the child of rural parents goes away to college and starts a career, they could end up living in a center city or a suburb depending upon their preferences. But the jobs themselves will almost certainly be in a metro area, making it a loss for the rural economy regardless.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by eschaton

But this isn't a thread about the Sun Belt vs. legacy cities. Nor is it really about walkability - functionally speaking suburbs and cities are both parts of the metropolitan economy. Rural areas are not. When the child of rural parents goes away to college and starts a career, they could end up living in a center city or a suburb depending upon their preferences. But the jobs themselves will almost certainly be in a metro area, making it a loss for the rural economy regardless.

Its not really a loss because rural areas have no demand for such professions.

I think thats really the point here of what im saying. The article is prefacing that rural america needs to have cities so that it would become like ....cities and not like rural america.

That doesnt make sense, Just as farmers adn Miners arent needed in Manhattan, Software Engineers and Professors of Gender Pronouns arent needed in Minot North Dakota.

[Leveled]

Jeeze its like the conservative posters are using the same talking points.

If yall dont like cities, maybe go somewhere else.

[Sun Belt]

Originally Posted by Leveled

Jeeze its like the conservative posters are using the same talking points.

If yall dont like cities, maybe go somewhere else.

Nobody said that, lol. Last time I checked human settlements [cities] were full of people representing a diverse set of beliefs and ideas -- some of which you may or may not agree with.

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by Leveled

Jeeze its like the conservative posters are using the same talking points.

If yall dont like cities, maybe go somewhere else.

1. WTF does a person's political beliefs have to do with where they want to live?

2. Nobody here is even saying anything bad about cities.

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

True, but most of the fastest growing metro areas are the low density sun belt cities that these urban elitist sorts abhor.

Not really true. Bay Area, Seattle, Austin are pretty much Exhibit A for "urban elitists". And the cores of more conservative metros like Dallas, Houston and Atlanta, are full of "urban elitists" too.

Originally Posted by BrownTown

He also likes to conveniently forget all the urban ghettos too.

Probably because metro areas are much richer?

The % of households in poverty in rural America is much higher than in metropolitan America. Yes, there's poverty in big cities too, but there are much better services and much higher upward mobility.

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Crime is higher in urban areas. How can you even pretend to believe otherwise.

Because it's the truth? Crime isn't higher in metropolitan areas.

And, putting aside your desperate attempt to change the subject (we were talking about the dangers of private trespass, not regional crime rates) because your link has nothing to do with what we're talking about? Gun-related homicides aren't linked to overall crime rates, and overall crime rates are linked to dangers of private trespass.

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Because it's the truth? Crime isn't higher in metropolitan areas.

You're delusional.

[Leveled]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

1. WTF does a person's political beliefs have to do with where they want to live?

2. Nobody here is even saying anything bad about cities.

The post at the top of the page is bitching about “urban elites.”

That’s all I had to read.

Edit: oh jeeze, it’s your post.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

You're delusional.

https://thecrimereport.org/2018/05/1...e-u-s-average/

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by Leveled

The post at the top of the page is bitching about “urban elites.”

It's not talking about politics, it's talking about 10023 being a douche.

Originally Posted by Vlajos

https://thecrimereport.org/2018/05/1...e-u-s-average/

Literally the second sentence of your own source is, "Though cities on average have a higher violent crime rate than rural areas.."

[emathias]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

It's not talking about politics, it's talking about 10023 being a douche.


Literally the second sentence of your own source is, "Though cities on average have a higher violent crime rate than rural areas.."

I grew up in rural America. The only person I knew who was murdered, was murdered in rural America. The only people I know who have been burgled by strangers are in rural America. The only murderer I've known personally (and who was not the person who killed the victim I knew) was in rural America. As an Adult, I've lived in Central Chicago for longer than any other place, and yet have never known a murderer, never known a friend or acquaintance who was murdered, and never known a friend whose home was burgled.

I've also known many people in rural areas who have committed assaults that would have gotten them arrested and convicted in an urban area who got away scott free because the victim didn't report it. Personally, I believe that crime has been higher on rural areas for a long time and is just under-reported.

[GlassCity]

I don't think the article is discounting the value of rural areas at all, certainly not of agricultural land. It's just speaking to ways of making rural areas more prosperous, and I agree with it.

Everyone supports farmers continuing to live on their land and making food from it, but clearly something needs to be done for those living in towns of 1,000 that aren't farmers but not doing a whole lot of anything else either. There are good reasons for preserving the health of agriculturally productive areas, but I don't think there are any good reasons for preserving these small towns, especially when it's near impossible

So I agree with the author - the way to do it is through consolidation of 'urban' areas (counting those 1,000 people towns as urban) into larger centres. Strengthen nearby medium and small cities and make them more attractive to non-farmer rural residents.

This has the added benefit of taking strain off of the metropolises and spreading prosperity and opportunity further. To go from 10023's example of Manson, Iowa, I think it'd be better in the long run if people from places like that were moving to Des Moines or Sioux City than Minneapolis or Chicago. But yes, I do think they should be moving. We can keep 'Middle America' populated and healthy, but it just doesn't make sense, nor is it possible, for that to happen in a bunch of small towns.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by Leveled

Jeeze its like the conservative posters are using the same talking points.

If yall dont like cities, maybe go somewhere else.

You dont need to be conservative to mock the absurdities of urban elitists lol

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by emathias

I grew up in rural America. The only person I knew who was murdered, was murdered in rural America. The only people I know who have been burgled by strangers are in rural America. The only murderer I've known personally (and who was not the person who killed the victim I knew) was in rural America. As an Adult, I've lived in Central Chicago for longer than any other place, and yet have never known a murderer, never known a friend or acquaintance who was murdered, and never known a friend whose home was burgled.

I've also known many people in rural areas who have committed assaults that would have gotten them arrested and convicted in an urban area who got away scott free because the victim didn't report it. Personally, I believe that crime has been higher on rural areas for a long time and is just under-reported.

Nice Anecdote cities still have most of the violent crime and murders.

[James Bond Agent 007]

If they had cities they wouldn't be rural.

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by emathias

I grew up in rural America. The only person I knew who was murdered, was murdered in rural America. The only people I know who have been burgled by strangers are in rural America. The only murderer I've known personally (and who was not the person who killed the victim I knew) was in rural America. As an Adult, I've lived in Central Chicago for longer than any other place, and yet have never known a murderer, never known a friend or acquaintance who was murdered, and never known a friend whose home was burgled.

I've also known many people in rural areas who have committed assaults that would have gotten them arrested and convicted in an urban area who got away scott free because the victim didn't report it. Personally, I believe that crime has been higher on rural areas for a long time and is just under-reported.

We can play this pointless game all day. I've known at least a dozen murderers and they were all in an urban area. So I guess by my personal experience 100% of murderers are in urban areas. This is obviously a ridiculous statement (especially since I've never really lived in a rural area) and what we need to discuss here is statistics, not irrelevant personal stories with minuscule sample sizes (your sample size is literally one murderer).

[pip]

Originally Posted by BrownTown

We can play this pointless game all day. I've known at least a dozen murderers and they were all in an urban area. So I guess by my personal experience 100% of murderers are in urban areas. This is obviously a ridiculous statement (especially since I've never really lived in a rural area) and what we need to discuss here is statistics, not irrelevant personal stories with minuscule sample sizes (your sample size is literally one murderer).

Where do you live that you know at least a dozen murderers?

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by pip

Where do you live that you know at least a dozen murderers?

At the time? A maximum security jail cell.