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  #141  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2018, 7:50 PM
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Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
I'd recommend reading up on the Chinese String of Pearls along the Indian Ocean.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String...(Indian_Ocean))

tl;dr China essentially has Government-run ports in Sri Lanka and Pakistan. They also have the 21st Century Silk Road Initiative, increasing land connectivity between Europe and China via Central Asia.
A civilian port is not a military base.

Also most of these projects have not gotten off the ground. Pakistan has recently cut back railway investment, for example, the Thai canal is going nowhere, etc.

China is clearly trying to reduce its reliance on the Straits of Malacca and diversify its export markets, but that is a far stretch from “Australia should be worried”.
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  #142  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2018, 8:19 PM
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...eg. the Chinese dissidents who dislike China's government, Tibetan refugees and Falun Gong people against China's human rights abuses...
The percentage of these types of Chinese in Canada is undoubtedly infinitesimal anymore.
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  #143  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2018, 8:20 PM
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Which is of no geopolitical or military value and pointlessly antagonizes its neighbours.
You don't have a clue what you're talking about when it comes to China.
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  #144  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 3:01 AM
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  #145  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:04 PM
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Originally Posted by wave46 View Post
They're not equally bad though. That's where we disagree.

Look at what happens at protests in front of the Washington Monument. Then look at ones that happen in in Tienanmen Square.

I agree with you that we should do better. I'll take Denmark, Sweden and Norway as examples of what humanity can do to advance the cause of itself. The United States is closer to those countries than China.
just a reminder that much of the information around tianamen square is propaganda:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...les-claim.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/there-w...uare-massacre/
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  #146  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:07 PM
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Probably also that Canadians think that they are able to identify with, critique and influence the US a lot more than they can for other countries, especially big, foreign, undemocratic ones.

That's why you often see US protest movements show up strongly north of the border (eg. protesting the Iraq war, or protesting Trump) but rarely as much protests by Canadians over China, Russia's policies etc. For better or worse, the US is held to a different standard as a place that is familiar to us and also one that claims to represent the "west" or is the biggest nation that represents the west.

Seems like it's mostly diaspora communities who fled from and disliked their old regimes that protest the other big powers (eg. the Chinese dissidents who dislike China's government, Tibetan refugees and Falun Gong people against China's human rights abuses, Ukrainian-Canadians who dislike Russia during the Crimea thing) but most Anglo Canadians have their gaze focused on the US.

For China, there were some protests by westerners like Americans and Canadians back not too long ago (eg. the Free Tibet movement, anti-sweatshop labour movements) but these seem to have fallen by the wayside after the 90s and '00s in favour of the "make nice with the rising superpower who's got a lot of money" sentiment.
the people who are tibetan "refugees" are feudal warlords fleeing the (very democratic) dismantling of feudalism there. the entire "free tibet" was a western op

also, falun gong is a cult and should be opposed wherever they are

it's a bastardization of a traditional practice that an entrepreneur decided to change a bit to make money on
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  #147  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:09 PM
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Originally Posted by headhorse View Post
the people who are tibetan "refugees" are feudal warlords fleeing the (very democratic) dismantling of feudalism there. the entire "free tibet" was a western op

also, falun gong is a cult and should be opposed wherever they are

it's a bastardization of a traditional practice that an entrepreneur decided to change a bit to make money on
Are you the last vestige of Stalin's "useful idiots"?
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  #148  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:11 PM
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Originally Posted by headhorse View Post
just a reminder that much of the information around tianamen square is propaganda:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...les-claim.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/there-w...uare-massacre/
Probably splitting hairs, though. From your second article:
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I reported what I saw; I said I hadn't seen any bodies. Admittedly, I've never made a point of trying to contradict a colleague on the air; I've simply stuck to my own story, because I've believed it's true.

Some have found it uncomfortable that all this conforms with what the Chinese government has always claimed, perhaps with a bit of sophistry: that there was no "massacre in Tiananmen Square."

But there's no question many people were killed by the army that night around Tiananmen Square, and on the way to it — mostly in the western part of Beijing. Maybe, for some, comfort can be taken in the fact that the government denies that, too.
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  #149  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:13 PM
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let's see some evidence
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  #150  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:14 PM
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Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN View Post
Are you the last vestige of Stalin's "useful idiots"?
how come you can't engage in the critique of ideas and presentation of evidence? it's justbuzz words and the propaganda

Last edited by headhorse; Oct 14, 2018 at 7:36 PM.
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  #151  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:23 PM
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let's see some evidence
I used the same evidence as you did.
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  #152  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:25 PM
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I used the same evidence as you did.
if nothing happened, what evidence is there? if there was a massacre, there should be bodies. there were several international journalists around. lets see.
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  #153  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:39 PM
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Originally Posted by headhorse View Post
the people who are tibetan "refugees" are feudal warlords fleeing the (very democratic) dismantling of feudalism there. the entire "free tibet" was a western op
Too many fantastically idiotic things to respond to in your posts (hence the shorthand that you like to call "propaganda"), but take just this one: acknowledging the feudal nature of traditional Tibetan society that is invariably glossed over by the airhead Hollywood crew is not a substitute for the acknowledgment of the brutal, murderous, genocidal invasion and occupation of Tibet by the Chinese. It's not an either-or proposition.
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  #154  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:50 PM
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Too many fantastically idiotic things to respond to in your posts (hence the shorthand that you like to call "propaganda"), but take just this one: acknowledging the feudal nature of traditional Tibetan society that is invariably glossed over by the airhead Hollywood crew is not a substitute for the acknowledgment of the brutal, murderous, genocidal invasion and occupation of Tibet by the Chinese. It's not an either-or proposition.
do you have evidence of a genocide?

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The whole "Free Tibet" campaign was also funded by them. You can even find sources about this directly from the US State Department: https://history.state.gov/historical...964-68v30/d337

The CIA Tibetan Activity consists of political action, propaganda, and paramilitary activity. The purpose of the program at this stage is to keep the political concept of an autonomous Tibet alive within Tibet and among foreign nations, principally India, and to build a capability for resistance against possible political developments inside Communist China.

a. Support of 2100 Tibetan guerrillas based in Nepal—$ 500,000

b. Subsidy to the Dalai Lama—$ 180,000

c. [1 line of source text not declassified] (equipment, transportation, installation, and operator training costs)—$ 225,000

d. Expenses of covert training site in Colorado—$ 400,000

e. Tibet Houses in New York, Geneva, and [less than 1 line of source text not declassified] ( 1/2 year )—$ 75,000

f. Black air transportation of Tibetan trainees from Colorado to India—$ 185,000

g. Miscellaneous (operating expenses of [less than 1 line of source text not declassified] equipment and supplies to reconnaissance teams, caching program, air resupply—not overflights, preparation stages for agent network in Tibet, agent salaries, etc.)—$ 125,000

h. Educational program for 20 selected junior Tibetan officers— $ 45,000

Total—$ 1,735,000
from https://np.reddit.com/r/worldnews/co...es_in/dgq1lpd/

sounds like it's not actually tibetan's who have an issue with china.
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  #155  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 7:51 PM
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if nothing happened, what evidence is there? if there was a massacre, there should be bodies. there were several international journalists around. lets see.
So I'm expected to believe your source for one thing, but not another?
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  #156  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 8:05 PM
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So I'm expected to believe your source for one thing, but not another?
nothing too substantial coming up on the old google, hey?
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  #157  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 8:24 PM
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Is the Dalai Lama just some feudal warlord propagandist then?
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  #158  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 8:32 PM
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Originally Posted by O-tacular View Post
Is the Dalai Lama just some feudal warlord propagandist then?
I mean, he's something..

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a8537221.html

https://www.nytimes.com/1998/10/02/w...-from-cia.html

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/0...n_8186726.html
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  #159  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 8:34 PM
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nothing too substantial coming up on the old google, hey?
Don't look at me, you're the one who posted evidence that contradicted you.
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  #160  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2018, 8:44 PM
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Don't look at me, you're the one who posted evidence that contradicted you.
I've posted two articles with multiple independent eyewitness accounts, including one that includes documents from the US Ambassador to Beijing. there was no massacre. it's been debunked, just not in popular culture because it serves a purpose as propaganda. the fact that lilley changed parts of his story after it became public isn't surprisig.
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