Chinatown - What do you think of it?

[simonfiction]

I've been in Vancouver for just over a year now, and I'm almost embarrassed to say that I've only *just* taken a good explore of Chinatown. I guess I've always been slightly dissuaded by the gritty undertone of poverty, drugs, and general non-Chinese elements that come with it being engulfed in the DTES. I was pleasantly surprised though. There seems to be quite a lot of new development going on and I found quite a few gems.

But despite that, it is still seriously lacking. I'm not going to completely bad-mouth it with a list of what I think is wrong with the area, as I know half of it is plagued by some serious social problems and most people are already aware of those issues. But considering the tourist nature of Vancouver and the massive Chinese population, it is pretty disappointing. What you'd assume would be the obvious jewel in Vancouver's crown is mostly a sketchy part of town even for locals, let alone tourists.

One constructive thought though and my opinions aside; has there ever been any sort of outdoor food market with hawker-style street vendors in Chinatown? It feels like it could really do with something like that, perhaps on a closed off side street. Something to give it more energy and a claustrophobic bustle that I normally associate with Chinatowns.

I remember the hawker vendors and eating areas in Singapore, I felt like I'd just been invited straight into Asia's dining room for dinner. It's awesome. The whole communal eating experience is something I associate with Asia as well.

Not the best photos, but something like this I guess...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mnw168/3217745948/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ming_th...ss/1098677264/

Has there ever been anything like this in Vancouver's Chinatown? Or maybe there already is and I'm completely ignorant to it?

What's everyone else's take on the area in general? I'm still a newcomer really, so a more seasoned Vancouverite might have a completely different opinion and perspective.

[Denscity]

There's been a night market in Chinatown every summer for a looong time. Richmond has one as well.

[LeftCoaster]

Ya closest thing I've ever seen to a Singaporean hawker centre is the night market in Richmond. A downtown equivalent would be a welcome addition though.

[cabotp]

I feel chinatown is really just a victim of being in a bad location. Or put another way the problems that are in the area are not a result of the fact that chinatown is there.

As for what should be done to make it better. I can't say as I never go down there.

[SpongeG]

most of the chinese people I know - the younger ones say its for OLD people and they prefer Richmond

it's purpose is really outdated and not that needed - if it weren't for all the old chinese homes in the area it would probably be worse since it serves the old people

T&T and otehr chains sell lots of Asian products - there are chinese bakeries, bubble tea houses, chinese meat shops etc on pretty much every street in the city - so there is no need to go down there - why pay for parking when its free elsewhere

there is a night market every weekend from may to october - but it has shrunk and was never as good as the one in Richmond which dominates in the area

and the new people running the richmond nght market - are no good - the last two years the night market in richmond has been nothing - 50% of the stalls are empty and its just not what it was when it started - when it started at lansdown mall it was always busy and they had rides and games and stuff like that in addition to the food and knock offs - which they can;t sell anymore cause the police have cracked down

[delboy]

Originally Posted by simonfiction

I've been in Vancouver for just over a year now, and I'm almost embarrassed to say that I've only *just* taken a good explore of Chinatown. I guess I've always been slightly dissuaded by the gritty undertone of poverty, drugs, and general non-Chinese elements that come with it being engulfed in the DTES. I was pleasantly surprised though. There seems to be quite a lot of new development going on and I found quite a few gems.

But despite that, it is still seriously lacking. I'm not going to completely bad-mouth it with a list of what I think is wrong with the area, as I know half of it is plagued by some serious social problems and most people are already aware of those issues. But considering the tourist nature of Vancouver and the massive Chinese population, it is pretty disappointing. What you'd assume would be the obvious jewel in Vancouver's crown is mostly a sketchy part of town even for locals, let alone tourists.

One constructive thought though and my opinions aside; has there ever been any sort of outdoor food market with hawker-style street vendors in Chinatown? It feels like it could really do with something like that, perhaps on a closed off side street. Something to give it more energy and a claustrophobic bustle that I normally associate with Chinatowns.

I remember the hawker vendors and eating areas in Singapore, I felt like I'd just been invited straight into Asia's dining room for dinner. It's awesome. The whole communal eating experience is something I associate with Asia as well.

Not the best photos, but something like this I guess...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mnw168/3217745948/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ming_th...ss/1098677264/

Has there ever been anything like this in Vancouver's Chinatown? Or maybe there already is and I'm completely ignorant to it?

What's everyone else's take on the area in general? I'm still a newcomer really, so a more seasoned Vancouverite might have a completely different opinion and perspective.

I think your perception of the place is typical and is what keeps many away. It's often viewed as being outdated and on the wrong side of town and somewhere to avoid at night. As already noted, Richmond has eclipsed the place and is where new Chinese tend to gravitate to.

Vancouver has tended to focus its' energies on the west side of teh city in the past few decades and has only recently began to look east. Things have started to turn though. The Wang Sang building on pender is stunning. The carall street greenway has now linked Ctown to gastown. The old London hotel has had a nice face lift and will soon be home to the london pub. As you already noted, there are some gem in the area.

There's also the Keefer Hotel and bar, fortune sound club, everything cafe, and Bao Bai that are showing that the area can shrug off its seedy reputation. Even skytrain changed Stadium to Stadium/Chinatown. There is much to be done, however.

As an aside, take a walk east of Chinatown into Strathcona and check out some of the older hoods - there are some neat examples of turn of the last century homes that are worth seeing

[jlousa]

Chinatown has improved in recent years but certainly still has a ways to go. The parking issue is a big thing with the newer Asian generation, their parents/grandparents might have had no issue with taking the bus into Chinatown to go shopping but that was then. I'm sure the streetcar whenever it's built would help out considerably, it still won't be able to attract youth like Richmond does. The current improvements of hot happening places is certainly bringing vitality back to Chinatown after hours but isn't really attracting Asians so much as others.
I wander Chinatown on a pretty frequent basis as I live close by, there are still too many stores that appear unwelcoming to non-Chinese. I feel it would help if the Chinatown BIA were to help shop owners translate all signs so that English is also displayed. Also the BIA should strongly encourage shop owners to repair their canopys, clean pigeon droppings, repair broken windows. Most of the storefronts aren't a problem but there are quite a few scattered around that seem to bring down the whole block.

[PaperTiger]

There are a bunch of issues with Chinatown. One of the issues is that It is an populated by older generation of Cantonese speakers that came over largely from a few specific ‘counties’ in Guangdong province of southern china. These people haven’t been very open to subsequent waves of immigration form China, and especially Taiwan. Add this to the existing social problems and the stigma that carries and it means that Chinatown has not been able to cashing in on the flow of Chinese immigrants in the last 2-3 decades. That said, I still believe Chinatown will be the next Gastown.

With regard to parking I don’t see that as an issue with the Chinatown plaza parkade. It is huge and rarely full. In fact we park our second car there because it is cheaper than anywhere else.

[SpikePhanta]

I go to chinatown from time to time, and I like the charm of it. That being said though, i've noticed that it isn't as busy as it used to be around 8 years ago. Though at night its coming along with the mentioned pubs and sound bar.

But the area west near International village is becoming quite busy with new stores, and by time the improvments will continue east.

[Pinion]

Redundant and uninviting. I wish Japan town still existed - would've been a lot more interesting.

[Conrad Yablonski]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Redundant and uninviting.

Not at all true-as a long time Vancouver resident I've seen some changes not all positive but I'm cheered by the many second and third generation Chinese Canadians taking over the shop from their parents-think Sunrise Produce, Cathay Importers and IIRC Rice World as well.

Originally Posted by Pinion

I wish Japan town still existed - would've been a lot more interesting.

Japantown would be suffering under a similar malaise not to mention the hammer blow of the internment.

Overall I think Chinatown is cool, lots of people do and it can only improve-you wait!

[trofirhen]

I love Chinatown for its colourfulness, and because it serves as a reminder of the days when Vancouver had less racial resentment, (over the "poor us" and the "rich THEM") ... and everybody chipped in to build the city we have today. It was largely Chinese labour that chiselled the first train track into Vancouver, and we should be mindful of that.

[Coldrsx]

I love how eclectic and real it is...unlike the option of Richymond.

[nova9]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

I love how eclectic and real it is...unlike the option of Richymond.

I loved Chinatown but I laugh at your comment about how 'real' it is. Richmond is what the Chinese community 'want' while Chinatown is viewed as the past. But this largely applies only to the older Chinese and the new immigrants.

I do agree with Conrad about the taking over by 2nd and 3rd generation Chinese but the new openings are mainly for a Westernized crowd. And I would argue that they don't build a Chinese community. They're just maintaining and updating the area called Chinatown and not the community of old. If the Chinese Cultural Centre were to be built today, it would be located in Richmond (and inside Aberdeen Mall......)

[delboy]

Originally Posted by nova9

I loved Chinatown but I laugh at your comment about how 'real' it is. Richmond is what the Chinese community 'want' while Chinatown is viewed as the past. But this largely applies only to the older Chinese and the new immigrants.

I do agree with Conrad about the taking over by 2nd and 3rd generation Chinese but the new openings are mainly for a Westernized crowd. And I would argue that they don't build a Chinese community. They're just maintaining and updating the area called Chinatown and not the community of old. If the Chinese Cultural Centre were to be built today, it would be located in Richmond (and inside Aberdeen Mall......)

clearly he meant traditional

[simonfiction]

Originally Posted by nova9

I do agree with Conrad about the taking over by 2nd and 3rd generation Chinese but the new openings are mainly for a Westernized crowd. And I would argue that they don't build a Chinese community. They're just maintaining and updating the area called Chinatown and not the community of old. If the Chinese Cultural Centre were to be built today, it would be located in Richmond (and inside Aberdeen Mall......)

So do you think going forward, Vancouver's Chinatown will be defined as a traditional, historic and touristy area serving to western tastes with a mixture of old and new? While Richmond will be a far more authentic Chinese area, primarily serving a modern day Chinese community living in Richmond?

[delboy]

Originally Posted by simonfiction

So do you think going forward, Vancouver's Chinatown will be defined as a traditional, historic and touristy area serving to western tastes with a mixture of old and new? While Richmond will be a far more authentic Chinese area, primarily serving a modern day Chinese community living in Richmond?

I think that pretty reasonable. I forget how it works but theres some sort of association that owns a lot of the property in Ctown that is problematic. The city wants to revatalize the area by converting vacant spaces above stores.

[Vancity]

I think a lot of the more recent immigrants coming from Taiwan, and HK, and mainland China are moving to places like Richmond. That's where all the "chinese" people are, and where the chinese community is at. Sure there are still chinese people living in chinatown, but to be fair, Richmond is now the new chinatown. The Chinatown on Main St., and Hastings, to me at least, serves a lot of history, but to be honest, very few chinese people, their families, and their children, go there anymore. Might drop by every once in a while, but Richmond really is where it's at (at least for the more recent chinese immigrants). A lot of chinese people feel "at home" in Richmond, mainly because there is such a predominant chinese community. You don't even need to speak english to get around Richmond. Most likely bump into a chinese person, for every 3-4 people you come across. LOL.

[Vancity]

Originally Posted by simonfiction

So do you think going forward, Vancouver's Chinatown will be defined as a traditional, historic and touristy area serving to western tastes with a mixture of old and new? While Richmond will be a far more authentic Chinese area, primarily serving a modern day Chinese community living in Richmond?

Yeah. I think so.

[nova9]

Originally Posted by simonfiction

So do you think going forward, Vancouver's Chinatown will be defined as a traditional, historic and touristy area serving to western tastes with a mixture of old and new? While Richmond will be a far more authentic Chinese area, primarily serving a modern day Chinese community living in Richmond?

yes. but I would also add that richmond isn't necessarily the cultural centre of the chinese community either. It is in the sense that Aberdeen is the HQ of the Fairchild Group which runs Fairchild TV and Fairchild radio. But the Chinese are spread throughout the Eastside and you can look at clusters around Victoria-41st (then extending north to Kingsway and south to 47th) or around Granville and 70th.