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  #3801  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 3:24 PM
pegster pegster is offline
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Originally Posted by borkborkbork View Post
Do the Paragon buildings have any ground level CRUs?
Not as far as I can tell.
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  #3802  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 5:11 PM
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Dang
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  #3803  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 5:19 PM
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Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
The metal siding on the Zu bldg facing Osborne and Stradbrook looks like absolute ass and even the brick doesn’t make it look better. Looks so cheap and shitty.
Hopefully once the fire station is relocated a new development will hide that exterior wall.
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  #3804  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 6:13 PM
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Yeah it’s just so prominent
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  #3805  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 9:41 PM
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Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
The metal siding on the Zu bldg facing Osborne and Stradbrook looks like absolute ass and even the brick doesn’t make it look better. Looks so cheap and shitty.
I was going to mention this a couple weeks ago but I do my fair share of complaining about architecture in the city so I held my tongue lol. But ya it looks exactly like the side of a cheap shed or warehouse. The unfortunate part IMO is that it also wraps around the top of the Osborne fronting side and looks ridiculous right above the gorgeous brick. It almost looks like a cheap addition was added on to a brick building. I almost think stucco would've looked better in this case.


Also just watch the firehall land eventually get developed into a park or "plaza" and we get to stare at the Zu wall until we die
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  #3806  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 9:53 PM
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Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
The metal siding on the Zu bldg facing Osborne and Stradbrook looks like absolute ass and even the brick doesn’t make it look better. Looks so cheap and shitty.
When the metal siding was going up, I was thinking "that can't be the final siding can it?"
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  #3807  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2024, 10:50 PM
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Yeah I mean I’m happy for the building being built but I can’t believe the city just allows such low standards on such a high profile street like this. It’s a fucking crime. It truly doesn’t help the stereotype that Winnipeg is a substandard city. Driving up to it from the north it just…hurts. Then you go around the corner and see 197 and it’s like night and day, the difference in overall aesthetic quality. Dramatic, the difference.
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  #3808  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 2:29 PM
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Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
Yeah I mean I’m happy for the building being built but I can’t believe the city just allows such low standards on such a high profile street like this. It’s a fucking crime. It truly doesn’t help the stereotype that Winnipeg is a substandard city. Driving up to it from the north it just…hurts. Then you go around the corner and see 197 and it’s like night and day, the difference in overall aesthetic quality. Dramatic, the difference.
I don't get what people want the City to do with respect to implementing higher design standards. If standards are too high, you'll choke the market with "excess red tape" and inflate costs for developers, pushing them away from the very areas you want development to occur. You're not going to regulate yourself out of ugly design. Design is going to be a function of what the market can bear (rental rates for the area, interest rates, etc.), not government regulation.

The average rent in the Osborne Village area is $1,256 for a 2 bedroom, while it is $1,345 near the UofM, and it is $1,761 in the Bridgwater neighborhoods. Meanwhile, average rents for a 2-bedroom are $2,574 in central Toronto and $3,109 in downtown Vancouver. All these different neighborhoods have different upper limits on rent that can be charged by new construction, and therefore will ultimately influence the design selected by builders for fit their financial goals. If every developer expects to pull a 5% to 10% return on their investment regardless of the City they develop in, then obviously lower market rental rates is going to equal lower development costs which means lower design standards and cheaper materials. Plus, tenants are going to care more about inside furnishings than what the building looks like on the outside, so naturally nice design is going to be the first thing to go for developers who need to make the numbers make sense.

You can't regulate yourself out of this. The best you can hope for is for rents to rise naturally in neighborhoods over time as a result of increased desirability and increased scarcity of easily developable land. You have to start from the bottom up, and so as long as any development is occurring in central neighborhoods, I'm happy, even if design is subpar. Because eventually, increased population leads to increased activity and safety, which may lead to increased desirability, development, rents, and increasing design standards.

City aesthetic regulations beyond the bare minimum will just push potential developers away to areas where they can seek higher rents unimpeded by burdensome regulation, further exasperating housing affordability.
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  #3809  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 2:33 PM
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I feel like something to simply add some kind of detail to the sheet siding to at least make it look anything better than what it is would not be cripplingly expensive. Or some kind of municipal tax benefit to cut the cost to do so in high profile areas like this. Seriously. There has to be a solution other than just simply utterly yielding to developers.
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  #3810  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 3:05 PM
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Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
I feel like something to simply add some kind of detail to the sheet siding to at least make it look anything better than what it is would not be cripplingly expensive. Or some kind of municipal tax benefit to cut the cost to do so in high profile areas like this. Seriously. There has to be a solution other than just simply utterly yielding to developers.
If it makes you feel better the standard of "developer architecture" Canada-wide is mostly the same
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  #3811  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 3:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Wpg_Guy View Post
Hopefully once the fire station is relocated a new development will hide that exterior wall.
What's the status on this? Is it still a pipedream or might it actually happen in the nearish future?

I worry more about the people who have to sleep in the apartments next to that fire station than I do about the lackluster cladding.
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  #3812  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 5:18 PM
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Originally Posted by xubiqtss View Post
If it makes you feel better the standard of "developer architecture" Canada-wide is mostly the same
Yes I know, it’s an epidemic of cheap trashy aesthetic in the name of profit margins.
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  #3813  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 11:02 PM
Kris22 Kris22 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinCitySparky View Post
I feel like something to simply add some kind of detail to the sheet siding to at least make it look anything better than what it is would not be cripplingly expensive. Or some kind of municipal tax benefit to cut the cost to do so in high profile areas like this. Seriously. There has to be a solution other than just simply utterly yielding to developers.
I actually wouldn't mind a massive mural commissioned by the Synonym collective mural guys. Perhaps there's some sort of grant to make that happen too. Their murals are high quality and not tacky, plus it'd fit the OV vibe. Something just geometric in design would be cool.
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  #3814  
Old Posted Yesterday, 12:56 AM
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See now that’s a very doable and non prohibitive idea, why exactly can a developer not come up with something like that? Utter fucking laziness is the real answer. 197 is incorporating a mural. Developers (not all obviously but ones such as this example) need to just DO BETTER and not use whining about razor thin margins as an excuse to dip out on civic pride and aesthetic improvement when value engineering comes up.
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  #3815  
Old Posted Yesterday, 5:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Kris22 View Post
I actually wouldn't mind a massive mural commissioned by the Synonym collective mural guys. Perhaps there's some sort of grant to make that happen too. Their murals are high quality and not tacky, plus it'd fit the OV vibe. Something just geometric in design would be cool.
There's supposed to be some giant building-scale art on the inner courtyard. Right now it's just white stucco. The renderings had it covered in little Keith Haring figures, but that's probably hard to pull off (cost + keith haring is dead) :lol:
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  #3816  
Old Posted Today, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by borkborkbork View Post
There's supposed to be some giant building-scale art on the inner courtyard. Right now it's just white stucco. The renderings had it covered in little Keith Haring figures, but that's probably hard to pull off (cost + keith haring is dead) :lol:
Oh ya now that you mention it, I remember the mural in the courtyard. If that is still a go ahead, I'd love to see them continue it on the firehall side. It would seem like a no brainer if they already have the artists out there. I think it would actually make more sense to spend the mural budget on the exterior side where the whole city would see it. It would be great attention for the building.

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