Canadian province/ U.S. state analogues

[jd3189]

Just an interesting thing I wanted to do to gather how similar and different Canada is compared to it's southern neighbor.

For this discussion, I am aware that the number of federal sub-entities are different. But certain states/provinces have similar history and roles in each country. But nuance exists and we may not all agree.

Ontario appears to be like New York ( has the largest city which is also very cosmopolitan) and California (most populous subdivision, center of film industry as well unless that spot is also for British Columbia).

Quebec has characteristics of both Louisiana ( French influence) and Texas( feels itself to be independent)

British Columbia, once again, has some similarities to California and the rest of the West Coast ( since it, along with Washington State and Oregon, are collectively the Pacific Northwest).

I'm not too familiar with the other provinces ( and we can stick with just the provinces rather than include the territories). What do you guys think and which states share similarities with which province.

[Architype]

^This topic has been done to death BTW.

Here's my quick take:

BC = California
Alberta = Texas
Saskatchewan = Nebraska
Manitoba = Wisconsin
Ontario = New York
Quebec = Pennsylvania
New Brunswick = Alabama
Nova Scotia = Louisiana
PEI = Rhode Island
NL = Maine
All Territories = Alaska

[casper]

Originally Posted by jd3189

Just an interesting thing I wanted to do to gather how similar and different Canada is compared to it's southern neighbor.

For this discussion, I am aware that the number of federal sub-entities are different. But certain states/provinces have similar history and roles in each country. But nuance exists and we may not all agree.

Ontario appears to be like New York ( has the largest city which is also very cosmopolitan) and California (most populous subdivision, center of film industry as well unless that spot is also for British Columbia).

Quebec has characteristics of both Louisiana ( French influence) and Texas( feels itself to be independent)

British Columbia, once again, has some similarities to California and the rest of the West Coast ( since it, along with Washington State and Oregon, are collectively the Pacific Northwest).

I'm not too familiar with the other provinces ( and we can stick with just the provinces rather than include the territories). What do you guys think and which states share similarities with which province.

British Columbia, Washington State and Oregon historically were the same colony. There were disputes between the Americans and British over who controlled the territory. That was finally settled when the Oregon Treaty of 1846 was signed. The British called the area Columbia Territory and the Americans called the area Oregon Country.

Growing up in BC I was taught that the British/Canada gave up what today is called Oregon and Washington state to satisfy the unreasonable demands of the Americans.

Certain American kids are taught that the US made a major concession of giving up British Columbia.

There was even a war over part of the territory. The Pig War of 1859.

Back to modern days there are strong ties between these two states and BC.

[Beedok]

It doesn’t really work due to the differing proportionate scales. Ontario has nearly 40% of Canada’s population and the national capital. So, the US equivalent is, like, basically the whole mild-west + Virginia + DC or, something. Quebec, holding the historic largest city, main port for the Atlantic, and also a strong independent streak is more like the Mid-Atlantic states and the Southern Atlantic states minus Virginia.

[SignalHillHiker]

Originally Posted by Architype

^This topic has been done to death BTW.

Here's my quick take:

BC = California
Alberta = Texas
Saskatchewan = Nebraska
Manitoba = Wisconsin
Ontario = New York
Quebec = Pennsylvania
New Brunswick = Alabama
Nova Scotia = Louisiana
PEI = Rhode Island
NL = Maine
All Territories = Alaska

Haven't thought about this in ages. My guess...

BC = Oregon
Alberta = Texas
Saskatchewan and Manitoba = Any of the prairie states

For Ontario and Quebec, I'd want to combine multiple states to get the same effect. Maybe...

Ontario = New York and Pennsylvania
Quebec = Virginia and Louisiana and Pennsylvania

Maritimes = New England

NL = Hawaii

All Territories = Guam

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Architype

New Brunswick = Alabama

Gee, thanks..........

Some provinces have clear US analogues, other do not.

The Maritime analogues are most definitely in New England.
- Nova Scotia = Massachusetts
- New Brunswick = Maine

- Prince Edward Island is an outlier here though. I would probably choose Delaware for PEI (same size and shape, nice rural landscape).

- Newfoundland is Canada's Alaska as far as I'm concerned (remoteness, ruggedness, climate).

- Quebec is New York. Montreal is a good analogue for NYC in terms of character and cosmopolitan status. St. Lawrence = Hudson River. Townships = Finger Lake district. Laurentians = Adirondacks.

- Ontario is a dogs breakfast just because of it's size and diversity. A good analogue would be Illinois, but with touches of Michigan and the midwest states too.

- Manitoba = Minnesota
- Saskatchewan = North Dakota
- Alberta = Montana, but with hints of Colorado and Texas

- British Columbia = Washington, but with strong overtones of California.

The northtern territories have no real US analogue.

[Innsertnamehere]

so most provinces are just the state that borders them to the south!

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

so most provinces are just the state that borders them to the south!

Not always, but physiographic geography has a large bearing on cultural and economic geography.

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Gee, thanks..........

Some provinces have clear US analogues, other do not.

The Maritime analogues are most definitely in New England.
- Nova Scotia = Massachusetts
- New Brunswick = Maine

- Prince Edward Island is an outlier here though. I would probably choose Delaware for PEI (same size and shape, nice rural landscape).

- Newfoundland is Canada's Alaska as far as I'm concerned (remoteness, ruggedness, climate).

- Quebec is New York. Montreal is a good analogue for NYC in terms of character and cosmopolitan status. St. Lawrence = Hudson River. Townships = Finger Lake district. Laurentians = Adirondacks.

- Ontario is a dogs breakfast just because of it's size and diversity. A good analogue would be Illinois, but with touches of Michigan and the midwest states too.

- Manitoba = Minnesota
- Saskatchewan = North Dakota
- Alberta = Montana, but with hints of Colorado and Texas

- British Columbia = Washington, but with strong overtones of California.

The northern territories have no real US analogue.

Minnesota only touches the extreme SE of MB. SC, SW MB and SE SK are similar to ND. SW SK and S AB are more Montana, Wyoming and Colorado in similarity.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by jd3189

Just an interesting thing I wanted to do to gather how similar and different Canada is compared to it's southern neighbor.

For this discussion, I am aware that the number of federal sub-entities are different. But certain states/provinces have similar history and roles in each country. But nuance exists and we may not all agree.

Ontario appears to be like New York ( has the largest city which is also very cosmopolitan) and California (most populous subdivision, center of film industry as well unless that spot is also for British Columbia).

Quebec has characteristics of both Louisiana ( French influence) and Texas( feels itself to be independent)

British Columbia, once again, has some similarities to California and the rest of the West Coast ( since it, along with Washington State and Oregon, are collectively the Pacific Northwest).

I'm not too familiar with the other provinces ( and we can stick with just the provinces rather than include the territories). What do you guys think and which states share similarities with which province.

As Beedok says, the scale is different.

One way to view this is

Ontario = the U.S. Northeast
Quebec = the U.S. South

seeing the way the new capital was deliberately selected to be the border between those two Canadas. (French Canada and English Canada.) Exactly equivalent to Washington DC and for the exact same reason.

The respective weights are also "similar".

I would oppose to any view that has Ontario considered as equivalent to one state. Ontario alone constitutes most of Anglo-Canada. By itself.

Think about that, from an U.S. perspective. Imagine there's one state that's most of the country.

All things considered, I think the easiest way to compare Canada with the USA is to slightly modify the current USA:

New England, the BosWash corridor, and the Midwest all merge into a single U.S. state. That state is "Ontario".

Mexico gets annexed. It's the 51st U.S. state. Still smaller than the "Ontario" described above. That 51st state is "Quebec". Speaks another language and feels foreign to "Americans".

Other 20-30 states that are left after the mergings that created "Ontario": no changes. (Well, I guess if you wanted you could actually do small changes to come even closer to mirroring Canada, like merging WA/OR/CA to create a single West Coast state equivalent to BC and which would then be much closer to matching the relative "Single West Coast State" weight of BC compared to "Greater Yankeeland" Ontario and "Annexed Mexico" Quebec)

That slightly altered USA of 2022 is pretty close to looking like Canada.

[MolsonExport]

Canada has no California. No Florida, no Hawaii. No Deep South. No Arizona (well, maybe the Similkameen/Okanagan valleys).

Ontario is nothing like California. British Columbia is much, much more like Washington State than like California.

Quebec is Quebec. There is no parallel south of the border.

Saskatchewan might be North Dakota. You betcha!

[lio45]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Canada has no California. No Florida, no Hawaii.

Maple Creek...?

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by lio45

Maple Creek...?

There is no place in the world like Maple Creek (maybe Okotoks, but there is not nearly as much to do in Maple Creek).

[thewave46]

Northern Ontario = Appalachia

Economy: Mining and forestry-based
Status of economy: Moderate decline to treading water
Accent: Delightfully backwoods in both national languages
Demographic makeup: Closer to Canada of yesteryear than tomorrow

[biguc]

We're actually doing this, eh. Should go over with that American guy who pops up every few months to whine about how mean we are.

Anyway.

Ontario: Illinois+Wisconsin
Quebec: the Louisiana purchase
BC: Oregon + Idaho
Alberta: Oklahoma
Manitoba: Nebraska
Saskatchewan: Kansas
Nova Scotia: Rhode Island
New Brunswick: Maine
Newfoundland: Hawaii
PEI: Puerto Rico

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Architype

New Brunswick = Alabama
Nova Scotia = Louisiana

Why?

NS = MA
NB = ME

[Innsertnamehere]

I'm not sure I quite agree with Ontario being Illinois / Wisconsin. It definitely has mid-western vibes, particularly southwestern Ontario, but much of it also has more east-coast vibes, particularly eastern Ontario.

The GTA seems to be a weird mashup of California and the east coast.

[lio45]

It's the industrial heartland, it's the cultural center, it's sprawly and mostly newish, and it's still booming (also, it's the main magnet for immigrants).

Southern Ontario is the Midwest, the Sunbelt, and the BosWash Corridor, all combined into one.

As pointed out earlier by a few of us, Ontario's "American equivalent" is a good chunk of the USA, no single state comes close to being comparable.

[hipster duck]

One thing I've noticed about Americans is that they tend to navigate the world by thinking of stateside equivalents.

Canada is the US' closest analogue, and even there comparisons fall apart. Even the most comparable places, like Saskatchewan and North Dakota, or BC and Washington, have fundamental differences in terms of value systems, ethnic makeup, industries, even built form.

And if you think it's hard to directly compare Canada to the US, I've heard Americans think of European and even Asian places on American terms. "Bavarians are like Texans - independent and conservative"; "Think of Chongqing like what Chicago was in the late 19th century - the great inland boomtown that's the gateway to the undeveloped west".

Americans either understand foreign places in a very academic way or in a completely inappropriate and parochial way (like I describe above), and this might be one reason for why they suck so bad at maintaining power or rebuilding society in countries they occupy after a war.

[thewave46]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

One thing I've noticed about Americans is that they tend to navigate the world by thinking of stateside equivalents.

Canada is the US' closest analogue, and even there comparisons fall apart. Even the most comparable places, like Saskatchewan and North Dakota, or BC and Washington, have fundamental differences in terms of value systems, ethnic makeup, industries, even built form.

And if you think it's hard to directly compare Canada to the US, I've heard Americans think of European and even Asian places on American terms. "Bavarians are like Texans - independent and conservative"; "Think of Chongqing like what Chicago was in the late 19th century - the great inland boomtown that's the gateway to the undeveloped west".

Americans either understand foreign places in a very academic way or in a completely inappropriate and parochial way (like I describe above), and this might be one reason for why they suck so bad at maintaining power or rebuilding society in countries they occupy after a war.

At least the Americans understand their own country and where it ends.

For all the complaints of the parochial attitude held by our neighbours, Canadians (present company excluded) seem far more ignorant about themselves and the world at large. No, visiting Cancun does not make one Peter Ustinov, even if it does require you to have a passport. Nor does Las Vegas represent America in all its facets.