Salt Lake City: Official Development News Thread - Part 5

[Marvland]

Makid,

Thanks for posting this. Please don't shorten it. Sltrib's paywall is a mess. Interesting to see how this disaster happened. Also good to see Stan Penfolds readying his mayoral campaign.

At issues is this provision:

Line 611 (c) The authority may not receive property tax differential from an area included within a community reinvestment project area, as defined in Section 17C-1-102, under a community reinvestment project area plan, as defined in Section 17C-1-102, adopted before March 1, 2018 from a taxing entity that has, before March 1, 2018, entered into a fully executed, legally binding agreement under which the taxing entity agrees to the use of its tax increment, as defined in Section 17C-1-102, under the community reinvestment project area plan.

This points to 17C-1-102 of the Utah Community Reinvestment Act (CRA). Section 2(d): "(d) under an interlocal agreement that authorizes the agency to receive a taxing entity's tax increment.". So: SLC had created and adopted the community reinvestment project area in February. It had not, however achieved any interlocal agreements because those get done on a deal by deal basis. Really bad circular, unclear language and a great place to start with a lawsuit. The bill is a hodgepodge of goodies for a number of players and, like every piece of garbage that the Laughislature kicks out, ripe for lawsuits. Also a stong possiblity that the law supercedes and affect multiple development deals inked by the city over the last few months. That is where the city will get its traction as Utah, as a whole, does not fuck around with real estate contracts. Just need to file. Go gettem, Margaret Plane!

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Originally Posted by Marvland

Jackie is a great lady. A true pioneer in Utah. An openly gay married lady with kids is our mayor! But for whatever reason, her and the city council locked horns. They all have the same political beliefs, the same goals, yet they just can't get in sync. This is a microcosm for the entire city government. SLC is now suffering and bleeding for its sclerotic and backwards ways. Top to bottom not doing its job. Losing its left arm (read: the entire NW quadrant) this session should be a wake up call. It was a really bad read on their part. The last draft of the bill was really good and they should have taken it. If I was in the room, having seen the sleazy and gross legislative process up close and personal for the last three years, I would have told them this was coming. The men on the hill have no respect for anybody or anything but themselves and Herbert is just an absolute drooling, booger-eating goober. They do have a chance to redeem themselves. Sometimes in the dev world you have to just toss your hat in the ring and file a gold old-fashioned lawsuit. Sue the state, refuse municipal services and and hold their ground. Lock it up. Get an injunction and ride that horse to the supreme court if you need to. Opportunity costs will pile up, every greasy broker on the hill that had a build-to-suit deal lined up for their brother-in-laws and uncles will tense up real quick. Purchase contracts and MOU's have deadlines. Deals will fail. Brows will furrow. Some early indications that maybe Jackie and the council will do just that:Here is the latest Dnews article on the subject, still a headline on their front page (SL trib = not a peep). Anybody else noticed the weak sauce coming from the Trib lately, especially since they pay-walled annoyingly? Hello Trib, any action on the most pressing issue for SLC in a decade or so?

Thanks Marvland. I like your writing style. Can you elaborate more as to why Jackie is a great mayor other than being the first openly gay mayor and 2nd woman? That is wonderful, but that won’t get her re-elected, nor does that do anything for the city. We need someone with vision, tenacity and tactical instincts. Right now all I see is tenacity. One thing that rubbed me wrong is a comment she made last summer that suggested that criticisms of her were expected because she is a woman and gay. That to me smacked of using her gender and orientation as a way to neuter legitimate criticism.

[bob rulz]

I've never met Jackie, but I get the impression that even if she means well, she is extremely difficult to communicate with, extremely stubborn (not necessarily a bad thing, but it can be), and stand-offish. I also don't really understand what her vision for the city is. I always say that the most effective politicians (or more accurately, leaders) are the ones with vision, even if you disagree with that vision. You can hear the name and be like "oh yeah, this is the person that wants to do XYZ". Even with Ralph Becker, saying he was the "bike lane" mayor is SOMETHING. He at least seemed dedicated to evolving SLC along a more urbanized path. What is Jackie's vision? I hear Jackie Biskupski, and I hear "oh, you mean the mayor that seems to fight with everybody and nobody can get along with?"

Hey, it's great that she's a gay mother and also mayor of SLC. That part is fantastic. But I haven't seen much of anything yet that indicates she's a great mayor, or a great anything else. I'm sure there are things that I don't know about, but she never seems to do anything publicly that makes her more likable, or that helps somebody like me understand what her vision is.

So yeah, I would be very interested to hear your perspective as well Marvland. (Also, great lady =/= great mayor.)

[Marvland]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

I've never met Jackie, but I get the impression that even if she means well, she is extremely difficult to communicate with, extremely stubborn (not necessarily a bad thing, but it can be), and stand-offish. I also don't really understand what her vision for the city is. I always say that the most effective politicians (or more accurately, leaders) are the ones with vision, even if you disagree with that vision. You can hear the name and be like "oh yeah, this is the person that wants to do XYZ". Even with Ralph Becker, saying he was the "bike lane" mayor is SOMETHING. He at least seemed dedicated to evolving SLC along a more urbanized path. What is Jackie's vision? I hear Jackie Biskupski, and I hear "oh, you mean the mayor that seems to fight with everybody and nobody can get along with?"

Hey, it's great that she's a gay mother and also mayor of SLC. That part is fantastic. But I haven't seen much of anything yet that indicates she's a great mayor, or a great anything else. I'm sure there are things that I don't know about, but she never seems to do anything publicly that makes her more likable, or that helps somebody like me understand what her vision is.

So yeah, I would be very interested to hear your perspective as well Marvland. (Also, great lady =/= great mayor.)

I don't think we've had a great mayor since Deedee Corradini. Rocky was good when he could focus all of his pent up energy. IMHO 😀

[Comrade]

Jackie has done well the last year in leading the city. She got off to a very rocky start, and I was skeptical if she'd be able to find any type of momentum, but I think she's found her voice and it's helped over the last year or so. But this showdown with the state is likely to define her legacy. Hopefully she makes the right moves and SLC pushes back because, frankly, I'm tired of being bullied at the city level. SLC has been bullied far too long...even going back to the Rocky Anderson administration. The last mayor to have any traction with the state government, it seems, was Deedee Corradini.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Marvland

Makid,

Thanks for posting this. Please don't shorten it. Sltrib's paywall is a mess. Interesting to see how this disaster happened. Also good to see Stan Penfolds readying his mayoral campaign.

...

OMG! Stan Penfold would be another disaster mayor. I worked with him for over 2 years. He's completely incompetent.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Comrade

Jackie has done well the last year in leading the city. She got off to a very rocky start, and I was skeptical if she'd be able to find any type of momentum, but I think she's found her voice and it's helped over the last year or so. But this showdown with the state is likely to define her legacy. Hopefully she makes the right moves and SLC pushes back because, frankly, I'm tired of being bullied at the city level. SLC has been bullied far too long...even going back to the Rocky Anderson administration. The last mayor to have any traction with the state government, it seems, was Deedee Corradini.

What has Jackie done in the last year (besides have less public feuds with everyone)??? The only good I can see out of her mayorship is if she uses her tenacity to fight like hell against this inland port deal, as it currently stands. I'm not sure I see her doing that, though.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Marvland

I don't think we've had a great mayor since Deedee Corradini. Rocky was good when he could focus all of his pent up energy. IMHO 😀

Corradini was a GREAT mayor, despite the Bonneville nonsense, which wasn't her fault. Rocky was a terrible mayor. His accomplishments were orange flags and back-in parking downtown.

[Liberty Wellsian]

Derek Kitchen for Mayor
^my vote

Biskupski

Bought and paid for by Reagan signs
Bike hater
transit an afterthought
good at firing people
hiring...?
negotiations not looking good

Jackie isn't proactive. Seems to me that she's very reactionary and that she wants to be mayor for the sake of being mayor. I'm not sure what she has done as mayor as far as accomplishments go other than pissing off a city council that definitely does not hate her for being gay.

[ThePusherMan]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

Derek Kitchen for Mayor
^my vote

Derek is running for the State seat that Dabakis is vacating. Hopefully he can do some good for SLC from inside the snake pit!

[bob rulz]

Rocky did some good things for Salt Lake - implementing green policies and at least attempting city-level criminal justice reform for example - but he often seemed to care more about putting his name on the national stage and picking fights with state leadership just as much if not more than actually being a mayor. I think the contentious relationship between city and state is at least partially attributable to Rocky's tenure. Rocky can't take any blame for how the state has acted since then, of course.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by Stenar

What has Jackie done in the last year (besides have less public feuds with everyone)??? The only good I can see out of her mayorship is if she uses her tenacity to fight like hell against this inland port deal, as it currently stands. I'm not sure I see her doing that, though.

I think the way she handled the homeless shelter situation was admirable. I was disappointed the city caved so easily on the SugarHouse site but on the whole, I felt her approach was favorable, despite the fact everyone apparently working against the city on accepting relocation sites. I know some didn't like the secrecy of the approach, but with how it turned into a pathetic shit-show when actually debated, like out in the heart of the so-called compassionate suburb of Draper (yeah right), it showed WHY it needed to be more behind the scenes. Alas...

[Comrade]

Salt Lake has lucked out - it hasn't actually had a bad mayor in a long, long time. People who think any of the recent mayors have been bad don't know what they're talking about or have lived in a bubble and need to get out more. The worst we may have with Jackie is that she's ineffective. We'll see how this showdown with the state goes. But every mayor has brought at least something decent to the table in terms of overall growth - while also losing something decent in the process. Some have been more successful than others, though.

There's no question Deedee Corradini was the most influential. She not only was instrumental in getting SLC the Olympic Games in 2002 but advanced light-rail, spearheaded the baseball stadium (even though I still believe it should have been built downtown) and oversaw the beginning stages of revitalizing downtown - and the city as a whole. She also presided over a crime-infested city, as crime in the 90s in SLC was at its worst. Her hiring of Ruben Ortega as police chief didn't help matters and her last couple years were filled with scandal and her association with the Bonneville Pacific corporation and even the Olympic bribery scandal (hard for me to believe no one in Utah politics, from the governor on down to the mayor, with how they all worked to get the games, didn't know about the bribery deals going around) goes to show she wasn't even perfect.

But none have been outright bad or corrupt or actively hurt the city with their leadership. Even if they stagnated or were unforgettable like Ralph Becker was.

No doubt, tho, Rocky was the most contentious.

[Makid]

Another apartment building coming:

Planning Commission info - Ice House Apartments.

No attachments and I haven't been able to find any renderings. Hopefully Isaac will have an update soon.

[Utah_Dave]

So let’s take a little poll. Should the Mayor be re elected? Is she good for the city and development?

I can’t really make an informed decision but it sounds like we need a better advocate for the city that can work better with the different levels of government from what I’m hearing.

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Depends on the alternative. If it is between Jackie and Jim Dabakis, I would take Jackie. Between Jackie and Derek Kitchen probably Derek. My ideal candidate would be someone will a business background who sees a need to get serious about complete streets, solid relations with the state and advocating for aggressive changes to the zoning of the city to more widely see the adoption of a form based code.

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by Always Sunny in SLC

Depends on the alternative. If it is between Jackie and Jim Dabakis, I would take Jackie. Between Jackie and Derek Kitchen probably Derek. My ideal candidate would be someone will a business background who sees a need to get serious about complete streets, solid relations with the state and advocating for aggressive changes to the zoning of the city to more widely see the adoption of a form based code.

What do you have against Debakis. I've mostly agreed with his positions on left right and center(local public radio program)

[asies1981]

The U released a study showing how bad sprawl is for our air quality.

[Ironweed]

Well...Shucks...If we had any doubt that the state legislature and the SLC offices didn't get along...

The Wasatch Front is in the most prolific growth phase in Its history. Intelligent thought, deliberation, and cooperation are essential to navigate the challenges growth brings. Yet the incompetence and ineptitude of so called 'leadership' is both appalling and staggering. It is no wonder SLC's development has been retarded for so long.

Are the only solutions found in the voting booth?

[bob rulz]

Originally Posted by Comrade

Salt Lake has lucked out - it hasn't actually had a bad mayor in a long, long time. People who think any of the recent mayors have been bad don't know what they're talking about or have lived in a bubble and need to get out more. The worst we may have with Jackie is that she's ineffective. We'll see how this showdown with the state goes. But every mayor has brought at least something decent to the table in terms of overall growth - while also losing something decent in the process. Some have been more successful than others, though.

There's no question Deedee Corradini was the most influential. She not only was instrumental in getting SLC the Olympic Games in 2002 but advanced light-rail, spearheaded the baseball stadium (even though I still believe it should have been built downtown) and oversaw the beginning stages of revitalizing downtown - and the city as a whole. She also presided over a crime-infested city, as crime in the 90s in SLC was at its worst. Her hiring of Ruben Ortega as police chief didn't help matters and her last couple years were filled with scandal and her association with the Bonneville Pacific corporation and even the Olympic bribery scandal (hard for me to believe no one in Utah politics, from the governor on down to the mayor, with how they all worked to get the games, didn't know about the bribery deals going around) goes to show she wasn't even perfect.

But none have been outright bad or corrupt or actively hurt the city with their leadership. Even if they stagnated or were unforgettable like Ralph Becker was.

No doubt, tho, Rocky was the most contentious.

I agree with this. You hear of so many other cities whose mayors get engulfed in major scandals and Salt Lake has avoided that (aside from the Olympics, which obviously extends far beyond just the city government).
They've all overseen positive progression. I still don't know what Jackie's vision for the city is, but at the very least, the city isn't regressing.