World Cup of Hockey 2016

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by osmo

Back to hockey...

All the comments on the future of this make sense but what about the NHLPA? As long as the players are partners and getting a cut of the pie you will only see NHLPA players playing.

Maybe you get to the point where more Euros are in and you just make to Europe teams or something. Not sure how you skate around the NHLPA issue. You all really think this thing can get to the point where small rump teams can feed in the same profits vs the top NHL players on each team?
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Aren't there some non-NHL players on some of the rosters from Europe?

[osmo]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Aren't there some non-NHL players on some of the rosters from Europe?

Is there? I was under the impression it is NHLPA only in this. Unless changes were made last minute the announced rosters are all NHL guys.

[FrankieFlowerpot]

Yes - there are - not many - but around 10

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by mistercorporate

Bumped into a bunch of Swedish hockey fans in full jerseys walking downtown after the TFC match, what a fantastic group of people, really lived up to the open minded stereotype. Can't believe they flew all the way from Sweden to watch this, the Cup is a bigger deal than i thought.

The NHL and hockey in general are more "global" than some people give them credit for.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by osmo

CGI boards need some work. You can tell this Tourney is testing ground for all types of new gizmos. To bad they didn't test out reduced pads here as well...

Why would they test reduced pads? That's not how you fix scoring issues.

To my count, the following are being tested at the WCH for future use in the NHL:
CGI Boards
Ref Cams
Jersey Ads
8PMEST Start Times
U23 Youth Team

Originally Posted by osmo

Maybe you get to the point where more Euros are in and you just make two Europe teams or something. Not sure how you skate around the NHLPA issue. You all really think this thing can get to the point where small rump teams can feed in the same profits vs the top NHL players on each team?

It's going to remain an NHL/NHLPA event for the foreseeable future. They're splitting profits and everyone's eating it up, so why would they branch out further when they don't have to?

Originally Posted by Acajack

Aren't there some non-NHL players on some of the rosters from Europe?

Originally Posted by osmo

Is there? I was under the impression it is NHLPA only in this. Unless changes were made last minute the announced rosters are all NHL guys.

Originally Posted by FrankieFlowerpot

Yes - there are - not many - but around 10

There are a couple non-NHL players. Most of them are former NHL guys with no contracts or pros without contracts in general. One of the few players with a contract in another league is Datsyuk, who is of course a prominent former NHLPA member.

[Trevor3]

The CGI boards I actually like. They change quite often which is distracting, but they aren't as busy as traditional board ads. It actually looks cleaner. They definitely aren't perfect and it can be a bit much on the eyes, but I think they have something there that could be an improvement eventually.

Hating the 8pm EST start times though. The games don't start until 9:30 out here so they often won't end until midnight, that's not ideal when you have to be at work for 8 am NST.

There are 3 Russians not in the NHL - Telegin (former St. John's IceCap), Dadanov and Shipachyov. Sobotka for the Czechs, though it was thought that he would rejoin St. Louis after the tournament. The Finns have 3, but 2 of them are Laine (going to Winnipeg this season) and Aho, who is a top prospect in his own right, and the third is Sami Lepisto - another former NHLer. By that count, I suppose Matthews for the North Americans counts as a non-NHLer as well.

[osmo]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Why would they test reduced pads? That's not how you fix scoring issues.

How else you going to get scoring up unless you tweak physical items?

Coaches have shown that they will fight tooth and nail to slow the game down to mud anytime a change in rules is made in attempts to speed up the game.

Make the nets a bit bigger and/or slim the pads. Not sure how else you will get more goals going.

If they can make bullet proof vests as thin as notebook these days then no reason the pads should be this large.

[Franco401]

Originally Posted by osmo

How else you going to get scoring up unless you tweak physical items?

Coaches have shown that they will fight tooth and nail to slow the game down to mud anytime a change in rules is made in attempts to speed up the game.

Make the nets a bit bigger and/or slim the pads. Not sure how else you will get more goals going.

If they can make bullet proof vests as thin as notebook these days then no reason the pads should be this large.

The fast, offense-heavy, four-scoring-lines Penguins winning the cup can do more to improve scoring than thinning pads, especially in this copycat-heavy league. There has also been talk of tightening goalie jerseys, but the PA reportedly wouldn't approve it.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by osmo

How else you going to get scoring up unless you tweak physical items?

Coaches have shown that they will fight tooth and nail to slow the game down to mud anytime a change in rules is made in attempts to speed up the game.

These sorts of coaches are on their way out the door. Guys like Tortorella are a thing of the past and it's only a matter of time until they're gone for good. If anything, the NA team at WCH is proving that you can play and win games fast and hard. Hockey has a really entrenched old boys club so a lot of them overstay their welcome, but newer, younger coaches are coming in and coaching at a level that emphasizes scoring and skill over size and grit.

You can increase scoring by altering things like penalties, powerplays, anything like that.

However, it's not an issue with scoring as it is scoring chances. A 1-0 game with plenty of scoring chances can be more exciting than an 8-7 game where every shot goes in. Watch video of games from the 80s - it was abysmal hockey and not thrilling to watch in the least. I'd rather watch a hockey game where every goal matters and could be the tipping point rather than a 10-8 game where a two-goal lead going into the third, or any lead, doesn't matter.

I don't really understand where all this concern about scoring comes from - hockey today is better than it's ever been, both in quality and in presentation.

Originally Posted by osmo

Make the nets a bit bigger and/or slim the pads. Not sure how else you will get more goals going.

See above. No no no no no no no no no to changing net size. Please never.

[lubicon]

So in Group A both Canada and Europe qualify for the semi finals, and the U.S. and Czechs are eliminated (correct)?)

In the B Group nothing is set yet, and the scanarios I See are:

Sweden - moves on with a win or tie. With loss they would still advance if Finland beats Russia. If Russia beats Finland and Sweden loses the it is a three way tie

North America - moves on with a win and Finland beats Russia. A win and a Russia win would make a three way tie. A loss and a Finland wind over Russia and it is also a three way tie.

Russia - advances with a win and a North America loss. Three way tie breaker with a win and a Sweden win. Three way tie with a loss and a Sweden win.

Finland - needs to beat Russia and Sweden to beat North America for any hope, then it is a three way tie.

Tie breakers would essentially come down to goals for and against (goal differential) so there are a lot of permutations, but right now North America is ahead on that front compares to Russia and Finland.

[logan5]

The North america team is intriguing, but it is gonna seem silly having Canadians against Canadians in a "World Cup" final.

[Mister F]

Originally Posted by JHikka

These sorts of coaches are on their way out the door. Guys like Tortorella are a thing of the past and it's only a matter of time until they're gone for good. If anything, the NA team at WCH is proving that you can play and win games fast and hard. Hockey has a really entrenched old boys club so a lot of them overstay their welcome, but newer, younger coaches are coming in and coaching at a level that emphasizes scoring and skill over size and grit.

You can increase scoring by altering things like penalties, powerplays, anything like that.

However, it's not an issue with scoring as it is scoring chances. A 1-0 game with plenty of scoring chances can be more exciting than an 8-7 game where every shot goes in. Watch video of games from the 80s - it was abysmal hockey and not thrilling to watch in the least. I'd rather watch a hockey game where every goal matters and could be the tipping point rather than a 10-8 game where a two-goal lead going into the third, or any lead, doesn't matter.

I don't really understand where all this concern about scoring comes from - hockey today is better than it's ever been, both in quality and in presentation.



See above. No no no no no no no no no to changing net size. Please never.

Absolutely, 100% agree. The glory days of the 80s weren't as great as people make them out to be. Half the goals were harmless looking wrist shots that today's goalies would stop every time. There's nothing exciting about that. Scoring is lower now in no small part because goaltending is miles better than it was then. It's like they're playing a whole different sport. Smaller pads might have a small impact but the goaltending will still be in a whole different league than it was 30 years ago.

I'm not convinced that increasing scoring will make the game any more popular internationally either. The lowest scoring sport I can think of is soccer and it just so happens to be the most popular sport in the world.

Originally Posted by logan5

The North america team is intriguing, but it is gonna seem silly having Canadians against Canadians in a "World Cup" final.

The North American team could win the whole tournament but they'll still be a gimmick as far as I'm concerned.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Mister F

I'm not convinced that increasing scoring will make the game any more popular internationally either. The lowest scoring sport I can think of is soccer and it just so happens to be the most popular sport in the world.

If you want to watch high scoring i'd recommend watching basketball - where the rules are made up and the points don't matter.

I'm always confused by this notion that hockey can be better with more scoring. The best games to me are ones that are 1-0, 2-1, 3-2 struggles. Goals need to mean something.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by JHikka

If you want to watch high scoring i'd recommend watching basketball - where the rules are made up and the points don't matter.

I'm always confused by this notion that hockey can be better with more scoring. The best games to me are ones that are 1-0, 2-1, 3-2 struggles. Goals need to mean something.

Agreed. Hockey IMO is in a "sweet spot" in terms of scoring.

There are more goals generally than in soccer which for most people represents more "action", but few enough goals so that every goal is pretty important.

[Trevor3]

Originally Posted by JHikka

If you want to watch high scoring i'd recommend watching basketball - where the rules are made up and the points don't matter.

I'm always confused by this notion that hockey can be better with more scoring. The best games to me are ones that are 1-0, 2-1, 3-2 struggles. Goals need to mean something.

This.

It's really the pace of the game that matters, not the number of goals scored. You can have a 1-0 game with great pace that's fun to watch if there's great goaltending and smart defence that play hard. It was the evolution of the trap and the '95 Devils that drastically slowed the pace and scoring as a result.

Oddly enough, Martin Brodeur was really the last goaltenders to still use that stand-up reflex technique that most guys used in the 80s. The Devils locked down defensively and bored everyone to death with a goaltender who had a) some of the smallest equipment in the league, and b) arguably the worst technique among starters.

Really it all comes back to coaching and how you try to win games. Lemaire's trap system, Demers' defensive cult in Minnesota, etc... are all products of a different time, and the game that has changed in the past 20 years. Give it time a bit more time and the last of those coaches disappear, along with their systems. We're seeing successful teams now that have strong defensive structure in their play but aggressive forechecking as well, which was unheard of in, say, 1998.

[lubicon]

Originally Posted by logan5

The North america team is intriguing, but it is gonna seem silly having Canadians against Canadians in a "World Cup" final.

Won't happen. The NA team needs Finland to beat Russia just to get to the semi finals, which is where they would play Canada.

[Acajack]

I watched part of the game on TVA Sports last night and the ads on the boards were all in French. That's 21st century technology for you.

[Horus]

The hand-wringing over the possibility of Team North America winning the World Cup can end. Russia beat Finland today, eliminating TNA.

Too bad, those young guys were fun to watch.

[JHikka]

North America/Canada would have destroyed ratings. Canada/Russia, although still good, won't garner as much attention. Shame we can't see what the kids could have done against a full-squad Canada.